Free Agents

- Drew Henson
- Dan Orlovsky (probably won't return, from what I've heard)
- Rudi Johnson
- Aveion Cason
- Keary Colbert
- Shaun McDonald
- Travis Taylor
- John Owens
- Damion Cook
- George Foster
- Moran Norris (played well for a midseason signing, notice Kevin Smith was productive towards the end of the season when Norris was his FB, rather than the start of the season when Felton was)
- Andy McCollum
- Shaun Cody (time to let him go)
- Langston Moore
- Paris Lenon (LOL if he can find a starting job elsewhere)
- Ramzee Robinson
- Travis Fisher
- Ryan Nece
- Dexter Wynn
- Jason Hanson (figures to return)


Potential Cap Casulaties

All these guys are still under contract, but could be cut to free up cap room.

- Daunte Culpeper (Personally, I'd be interested to see what he could do with a full offseason to learn the playbook; He's not the long-term answer, but with Orlovsky not expected back, I'd keep Daunte)

- Dwight Smith

- Edwin Mulitalo

- Chuck Darby

- Michael Gaines

- Dan Campbell (if the dude could just stay healthy, he'd be worth keeping on board, blocking is his strength)

- Leigh Bodden (I hope to God they don't cut Leigh, but he's owed a hefty roster bonus in the spring, and they may just end up dumping him. His numbers suggest he should be cut, but since we gave up Shaun Rogers to get him, and he's had success, I'd like to keep Bodden)

- Mike Furrey (hard to believe just 2 years ago he led the entire NFC in receptions. obviously that was a product of Martz being the OC...while I think Furrey would be a good depth guy, he makes to much $ to play second fiddle to Calvin)


MOVES I'D LIKE TO SEE

* Switch to a basic defensive set. A standard 4-3 or a 3-4, no more 'Cover Two' or 'Tampa Two'.

* Jeff Backus moved to Left Guard. I've read articles that say that many scouts think he would be much better suited at Left Guard. We're paying him Pro Bowl money for a mediocre effort, so moving him over could help both of us.

* Do NOT Draft a QB with the #1 Pick. Assuming we cannot trade the #1 Overall pick, I want a Left Tackle (Andre Smith).

Andre Smith-Jeff Backus-Dominic Raiola-Stephen Peterman-Gosder Cherilus

Defensive Overhaul

Other than Dewayne White, Ernie Sims, and Cory Redding, we don't have any starters, so I hope to God Mayhew doesn't treat free agent signings as if he's only finding backups for Travis Fisher & co. It needs to be imperative that the FA's we sign are clearly better than the shit we already have.

Lateral Move Free Agent Signings Have Killed Us.

This FA class is deep, it has pro bowlers (Alb Haynesworth, Terrell Suggs), quality veterans (Jordan Gross, Stacy Andrews), and intriguing upside players like Reggie Williams in it...not to mention all the guys around the league who could be cap casulaties (Stallworth, Derek Anderson, Torry Holt, Jason Taylor etc.)

Don't Fuck Up!

I think Avril started the last 2 games and he is a keeper at DE.

I think Avril started the last 2 games and he is a keeper at DE.


Yeah I forgot about Avril. He definitely was a bright spot this year. He'd be great in a 3-4 scheme btw, as kind of a hybrid OLB/DE like Adalius Thomas, Shawne Merriman or LaMarr Woodley is.

Who knows, whoever our Def Coordinator ends up being will tell alot about Avrils' future.

His pash rush speed is a mega asset.

Langston Moore, Moran Norris, Rayan Nece - FAs.

Moore and Nece are worth keeping if we can't rebuild to that depth level...if that makes any sense. We can't address every single need. We'll obviously get a LB and some DLine help but these guys could be some good fill.

I'd keep Norris if he isn't that much more than Felton. Which I think is the case.

And I think Sandeford (?) can be last years Furrey for way less money.

And I think Sandeford (?) can be last years Furrey for way less money.


Yeah, I was impressed with the glimpses Standeford showed. Considering he'd be less than half the price of Furrey, I'd say definitely bring him back...

Did anyone listen to his press conference? Martin Mayhew says you cannot blame him because of his association with Millen, but then turns around in the next sentence and wants praise for working with winners in his past. How is he not being a hypocrite? You can't blame him for associations with losers but you have to give him recognition for working with winners.

Pat Kaputo had a great response when he said, "well Millen also worked with some of those guys and other winners and look what happened".

As far as moves I would like...

Take Andre Smith with the first pick or trade down a few spots. Get Spikes or Laurinitus at MLB. Then get a DE with the first pick in the second round and continue to draft defense the rest of the draft.

I think Laurinitus will be there at #19/#20. If not you can probably get a good DE there and get MLB in the early 2nd.

#1 has to be LT, unless Orapko is a monster at the combine and shows he's the next Peppers. If so, you take the DE playmaker there and get a LT with the Cowboys pick.

I'd even be fine with DE, MLB, and then an elite OG in the 2nd. I'd live with Backus for another year at LT if we got two studs on defense.

As far as moves I would like...

Take Andre Smith with the first pick or trade down a few spots. Get Spikes or Laurinitus at MLB. Then get a DE with the first pick in the second round and continue to draft defense the rest of the draft.


I don't want any part of Laurinaitis. He may be a ball-hawk type LB, but he has major flaws, plus we already wasted a pick on a Lauriniaits type player last year in Jordon Dizon.

I agree with Andre Smith on the first pick (apparently the only reason he got suspended for his bowl game was because he was talking to agents, hardly considered a 'character issue').

With the #20 pick, I'd look to get either a corner (Alphonso Smith from Wake Forest) or a defensive tackle (Tyson Jackson from LSU).

I think we'll be able to snag an OLB like Brian Cushing with the #33 pick...then from there, I'd draft an Offensive Guard & Defensive End with our 2 Third Rd Picks.

I don't want any part of Laurinaitis. He may be a ball-hawk type LB, but he has major flaws, plus we already wasted a pick on a Lauriniaits type player last year in Jordon Dizon.

I think we'll be able to snag an OLB like Brian Cushing with the #33 pick...then from there, I'd draft an Offensive Guard & Defensive End with our 2 Third Rd Picks.

You probably would have said the same about this guy (that year Arrington was considered far and away the best LB prospect):


New Mexico’s Brian Urlacher is a 245-pound PFW All-America strong safety/rover. Although he is a dominating player, Urlacher just has not gotten the type of exposure he deserves. A superior athlete, Urlacher spearheads the defense, returns punts, covers kicks, plays on all special teams and finds time to play some offense. He has the best hands on the team, makes a ton of tackles, always seems to be around the ball and has amazing versatility and stamina.
For the past two years, Urlacher has played so well that if he played at a big school that got a lot of television exposure, people would have been talking about him as a Heisman Trophy candidate. While he’s a different type of player than Charles Woodson was, Urlacher does just as much for his team. If you are wondering why he ended up at New Mexico, the reason is he was a late bloomer who has grown by leaps and bounds in terms of size and ability since his early high school days, when he was a 5-9, 160-pound receiver with unspectacular speed. Urlacher played linebacker his first two years at New Mexico, and although he did not start as a sophomore, he still had over 100 tackles. In ’98, he became a full-time starter at strong safety/rover and led the nation in tackles by some counts and the Western Athletic Conference by everyone’s count. Although Urlacher is not a great cover guy, some scouts say they might leave him at strong safety and use him as the Bengals used David Fulcher when they went to the Super Bowl in ’89. Most scouts, however, like Urlacher best as a weak-side linebacker.


And Dizon was an OLB in college. We played him out of postion (which is what you want to continue by drafting an OLB).

I'd like to see us bring in a 3-4. Redding moves back to DE, which would be good for him in a 3-4. Cody seems like he could be a decent 3-4 end, being one of those tweener DE/DT's out of college just like Redding. Sims on one side, try out Avril on the other for the OLBs, you could try Dizon as a MLB in that system but if not he's depth at OLB, maybe competing with Avril. Then you just look for defensive players that fit the 3/4 scheme in the draft. You've got to know what type of defense you're going to install before the draft though, so you can know what type of players to focus on.

One of the front runners (Jim Swartz) uses a 4-3.

If you went to a 3-4, you could play Dizon & Laurinaitis in the middle, and Sims & Lenon on the outside.

Two run stuffers in the middle, and two quick OLB's, that would easily translate into a top 15 run defense, IMO.

Best of all, you'd only have to burn 1 draft pick (probably the Dallas pick) to make that work since you don't need to spend any money in FA to sign a LB nor do you have a glaring hole at MLB.

Redding at the nose (so we don't have to waste $ on another DT), DeVries & White on the ends, with Avril as a hybrid DE/LB (sort of like what Adalius Thomas plays)...

Then you can just use all the other Marinelli projects (Cohen, Fluellen, Hawaii 5-0) as reserve roster fodder.

Lions' roster set for major overhaul in offseason
by Tom Kowalski

Wednesday January 07, 2009, 12:30 AM

ALLEN PARK -- As the Detroit Lions continue their search for a new coach, one of the drawbacks to the job is the team's talent-challenged roster.

However, the Lions offer a couple of positives for a new coach: a lot of draft choices and a great deal of room under the salary cap. The Lions are expected to make a major overhaul of their roster in the offseason, and they are in position to do it.

After going 0-16, the Lions have eight draft picks, including five in the first 82 overall picks.


One of those is the first overall choice, the first time the Lions have held that selection since they took Oklahoma running back Billy Sims in 1980. The Lions also hope to get a compensatory pick, based on free agent losses in 2008, which would give them nine draft picks.

There are several other factors that will allow the Lions to make a lot of moves on the roster.

The Lions currently have $95 million committed to their 2009 roster, and, according to Sports Business Journal, the NFL cap for 2009 will be a minimum of $123 million. According to a document obtained from the NFL Players Association, Detroit has $28 million under the cap, but that number could grow significantly because of some expected roster moves.

Quarterback Daunte Culpepper, cornerback Leigh Bodden, guard Edwin Mulitalo, safety Dwight Smith and tight end Dan Campbell have big salaries coming, and they could be released in the offseason.

Culpepper, who was signed in mid-season, has a $2.5 million roster bonus due in late February that would trigger a $2.5 million salary for next season. If Culpepper is released, the Lions would save $5 million off their cap.

Bodden, who has an $8.6 million roster bonus also due in February, likely will be released, trimming $4.6 million of cap commitment in 2009. Mulitalo and Smith are in the last year of their contracts and, if they get cut, the Lions save $2.8 million and $2.3 million, respectively. Releasing Campbell would result in a savings of about $1 million.

If all of those players are released, the Lions would have an additional $15.7 million available in their cap, giving them almost $39 million to spend on new players for the 2009 season.

The Lions can look for free agents elsewhere because it doesn't appear they will re-sign many of their own unrestricted free agents. Detroit has 18 free agents, and there are only four or five the Lions likely will be interested in re-signing, and all of them, except kicker Jason Hanson, would fill backup roles.

In addition to the draft, the Lions will replenish their roster through free agency, but they won't do it with big-money signings, but a series of solid lower-profile players to fill starting gaps and backup positions.

"In terms of getting players to come here, I have a tremendous degree of confidence that we're going to be able to do that," Lions president Tom Lewand said. "It's not about spending a bunch of money in March to plug holes, and then, all of a sudden, 12 months later have the same holes.

"I've said it repeatedly, from a salary cap perspective, it's easy to get headlines in March. Those aren't the ones we're looking for. We're looking for headlines in December and January and hopefully beyond. Those are the ones that take a strong organization to build. We want to build through the draft."

Lewand isn't only referring to future drafts, but recent drafts as well. Lewand has said the team needs to make more of a commitment to play younger players and allow them to either blossom into productive starters, or cut their losses and move in a different direction.

The Lions have 24 players currently on their roster that are slated to make less than $1 million in salary next season, and 13 of those are former Detroit draft picks, most of whom haven't had a shot at much playing time. The Lions need to make evaluations on these young players so they know whether they need time to develop or whether they need to be replaced.




UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENTS
Here is the list of Detroit's 18 unrestricted free agents (Jason Hanson is on the list, but because he's still tethered under the 1983 transition tag rule, he still is not totally free because the Lions will have the right of first refusal):

• RB Aveion Cason
• DT Shaun Cody
• WR Keary Colbert
• G Damion Cook
• T George Foster
• K Jason Hanson
• RB Rudi Johnson
• LB Paris Lenon
• C Andy McCollum
• WR Shaun McDonald
• DT Langston Moore
• LB Ryan Nece
• FB Moran Norris
• QB Dan Orlovsky
• TE John Owens
• DE Corey Smith
• G Stephen Peterman
• CB Stanley Wilson

Cut Daunte, for sure. Bodden--seems like he has talent, but that bonus is pretty huge and I don't know if the benefit is worth the cost. Part of me wants to keep him and part of me says cut him. His is a tough situation.

Cut Daunte, for sure. Bodden--seems like he has talent, but that bonus is pretty huge and I don't know if the benefit is worth the cost. Part of me wants to keep him and part of me says cut him. His is a tough situation.

Tahoe disagrees, especially if :we: bring in a real QB.

He's barely worth 1 million, let alone 5.

Tahoe says Dante is a real QB. Just as good as the QB who carried his team into the playoffs over Dallas and might beat the Super Bowl champs in their building this weekend.

Bodden will depend on what system the new coach brings in. He seems like he just doesn't fit the Cover 2 in the slightest but he was much better in man-to-man.

And Tahoe is right, damn it!

Bodden will depend on what system the new coach brings in. He seems like he just doesn't fit the Cover 2 in the slightest but he was much better in man-to-man.


They might ask Bodden to re-structure his contract.

Culpepper too.

If they won't then it's safe to say both will be gone.

If this is true, I agree with him. I'm not a fan of taking an OT and cutting Backus to eat his dead money.

Just go all defense (and WR/OG in the 3rd/4th maybe) and replace Backus next year if he stinks.


Tom Kowalski on WDFN: Jeff Backus not powerful enough to play guard

by Philip Zaroo | MLive.com Thursday January 15, 2009, 9:54 AM


Some are speculating that the Detroit Lions will target an offensive tackle with their first overall pick in April's NFL draft.
The mindset is that if the team gets a strong left tackle to replace Jeff Backus, the eight-year veteran can slide over to guard, giving the team two picks for the price of one.
But, assuming the Lions' selection is strong enough to start right away, can Backus make the transition to guard? Don't bet on it, says MLive Insider Tom "Killer" Kowalski.
"No, I don't think he can," Kowalski tells WDFN-AM's (http://www.wdfn.com/) Sean Baligian on It Is What It Is. "And I base that on talking to other people who know that position a lot better than I do. I don't think – at least what I've heard – is that they don't think he's powerful enough to be good in that spot.
"That's why, if it's not a quarterback in the first spot, I think it's going to be a defensive player. I think it'll be a linebacker or defensive lineman. Because as much as you may not like Backus, or think that (the position) needs to be upgraded, I think that's a position they're (not) going to deal with right now. The money just doesn't make any sense; they've already paid him a ton of money.
"Again, I'm not ruling anything out. But my guess is that they're going to go toward defense, if not quarterback."

Yep, that's the ticket. Backus isn't a strong enough guard. Take LeVitre for a G and replace Backus next year.

I would consider Percy Harvin at 20 if he were there, the man has Hester type ability and could actually play in the slot as well.

But all else I would go defense. We were just shit last year at it and there's no QB truly worthy of being taken number 1, so defense first and a G in the third, that's my philosophy. I am all for replacing Backus next year.

The 20th pick will prolly be easier to move than the 1st. There isn't a clear cut #1 this year so I'm thinking no team will give a ton to get it.

The 20th is a different story.

Yeah, but I want to keep the 20th. We can get a very good or great player there and not tie up a shitload of cap in them (which is my concern at no. 1).

I wouldn't trade far from 20 but if we rec'd the 24th and a 3rd or 4th rounder and we thought we could still get our guy at 24....I'd do something.

Definitely.

Well outside of Hanson who deserves the respect to be brought back (sadly for him), I see no one on the free agent list that should be brought back. I assume most will be unemployed next season since they, for the most part, are not NFL-caliber anyhow.

I would bring back Moran Norris. To his credit, he did a damn good job as the lead blocker for Kevin Smith in the final 8 games of the season (which is when Smith was most effective).

I'd cut Jerome Felton.

But yeah, I suppose you could make a case to re-sign Paris Lenon and put him at OLB, since he won't find another starting MLB job anywhere else.

Other than that, there's not much else to re-sign.

If you keep Lenon, its entirely for special teams purposes. That's what we originally used him for, he was the captain of the special teams and he was damn good at it. Stop trying to use him as a starter and just let him go back to working hard on special teams and as a backup LB and he'll be fine.

http://images.art.com/images/-/Detroit-Lions-Logo--C10046336.jpeg
DO YOU BELIEVE IN NOW?!

Tahoe has that poster on his wall.

Along with a Culpepper fathead.

I would bring back Moran Norris. To his credit, he did a damn good job as the lead blocker for Kevin Smith in the final 8 games of the season (which is when Smith was most effective).

I'd cut Jerome Felton.

But yeah, I suppose you could make a case to re-sign Paris Lenon and put him at OLB, since he won't find another starting MLB job anywhere else.

Other than that, there's not much else to re-sign.

The problem is that outside of Sims, our other LBs have been SO bad that Paris was actually better than them. Now, when Paris Lenon is the 2nd best LB on your team it is a sure sign that you need to gut the ship and build over.

Well outside of Hanson who deserves the respect to be brought back (sadly for him), I see no one on the free agent list that should be brought back. I assume most will be unemployed next season since they, for the most part, are not NFL-caliber anyhow.

That would be a huge number of players to replace, imo. Correct me if I'm wrong but that would also take a huge amount of time to go and replace 20 some players.

I want the :our: GM (I use that term loosely) to concentrate on our draft and some turnover, but that would be quite a task.

Wil do teams change that much in 1 season?

Think of it this way -
We get, what, 6 picks in the first 4 rounds? Chalk them up, along with 2 more from the draft to make the team. That's 8 of the 20 replaced right there on one day. Signing them is all that's left.
Add two strong free agent signings and we tack on a couple impact players. Half of the list has been replaced and likely with better players across the board. Starting lineups are probably set at that point.
Fill the remaining depth with UDFA's. Depth is all they are. They rarely see the field anyhow, so why tie up their spot with the expense of an established NFL player?
In this economy, save the cap space (since it's not like we're contending for anything next year anyhow).
Next season we'll have 10 UDFA's with one year deals leaving the team. Add another 10 guys between the draft and other teams free agents (since we'll have the space) and retain our free agents as necessary.

And as for the question of how many teams change that much in one season, let me ask how many teams lose 16 games in one season?
Only teams that have to change that much actually do, and we qualify.

If it can be done where we aren't just replacing a player for the sake of 'replacing someone who was on the roster last year that isn't that good' just for the sake of replacing them, then spend your efforts at the top.

If the GM has time to evaluate and make sure he is actually getting a better player, then go for it. I don't think a first year GM has time to do that. Just my opinion.

I think you are risking breaking up the chemistry we had last year.

IF Carolina does not franchise Peppers do you think we have a legit shot at him? He wants to play in a 3-4, but we don't know what Schwartz is going to run yet.

IF Carolina does not franchise Peppers do you think we have a legit shot at him? He wants to play in a 3-4, but we don't know what Schwartz is going to run yet.

Does Julius want to be an OLB in a 3-4?

Kind of like LaMarr Woodley?

Yes. He said he wants a new challenge. I really think we could make the switch. Redding might be a good DE in a 3-4 (he was a DE before). Maybe Dizon would be a better LB in that, don't know. Sign Peppers, draft Aaron Curry to play opposite him. Sims and Dizon (if he pans out) in the middle. Redding and White on the ends. We'd just lack a space eater in the middle. Maybe that could be pick #20. Maybe just a vet that can play a year or two there.

At any rate, that defense would be a heck of a lot better than it is now.

a 3-4 DE position is ideal for Redding. If we signed Peppers, ran a 3-4 and drafted Curry I would cream myself. Pipedreams...

Ray, you need to upgrade to pro, bro.

I guess that's what happens when you leech somebody else's image. Thanks bro.

Well, if you had Peppers & Sims on the outside, what would you do with Cliff Avril? He's way too small to play on the line in a 3-4 scheme.

Given what he did despite not starting most of the season, Avril has to be starting next year. He's a key building-block.

The positive on a 3-4, however, would be that since we have Redding, we wouldn't have to spend money on a starting defensive tackle. Landon Cohen can be his backup.

White, DeVries, Fluellen, Alama-Francis rotate on the ends.

Cut Chuck Darby, Corey Smith, and Langston Moore.

I had Sims on the inside. I'd draft Curry and put him opposite Peppers. Avril hasn't proven he's a full time player anyway, so you can't count on him really. I'd just rotate him in at OLB. People get hurt all the time, so you need depth anyway.

If they are that high on him they could sign Haynesworth instead of Peppers. Or they could draft something else at #1 instead of Curry if they like Avril that much.

I haven't even see him play so I'm not ready to pencil him in as a starter just yet.

The positive on a 3-4, however, would be that since we have Redding, we wouldn't have to spend money on a starting defensive tackle. Landon Cohen can be his backup.

White, DeVries, Fluellen, Alama-Francis rotate on the ends.

Cut Chuck Darby, Corey Smith, and Langston Moore.

I'm not sure Redding would make a good NT. He came into the league as a DE. Does he have the size to take on two blockers inside?

For reference here is what the Steelers and Ravens are using on their DL:

Steelers
LDE: Aaron Smith (298 lbs)
NT: Casey Hampton (325 lbs)
RDE: Brett Keisel (285 lbs)

Ravens
LDE: Trevor Price (290 lbs)
NT: Justin Banin (310 lbs)
RDE: Ngata (345 lbs converted DT)

I'm not sure how Redding is supposed to soak up blockers with his size (295 lbs).

I wonder how Cody would have faired in a 3-4 since he's kindof a DE/DT tweener like Redding.

For reference here is what the Steelers and Ravens are using on their DL:

Steelers
LDE: Aaron Smith (298 lbs)
NT: Casey Hampton (325 lbs)
RDE: Brett Keisel (285 lbs)

Ravens
LDE: Trevor Price (290 lbs)
NT: Justin Banin (310 lbs)
RDE: Ngata (345 lbs converted DT)

I'm not sure how Redding is supposed to soak up blockers with his size (295 lbs).


hamburgers?

He was a 279 pound DE in college, so I'm not sure he can really add more than the 16 pounds he has already added.



Notes: High school All-American and USA Today Defensive Player of the Year. Also a high school linebacker and discus champ. Big 12 Defensive Freshman of the Year in 1999, when he played in every game and started in the Cotton Bowl. Started from the second game on in 2000 and led the Longhorns in sacks. Started every game in '01 and won All-Conference honors and second-team All-America honors. In '02, played in every game and had 76 tackles, 24 tackles for loss and 8½ sacks. Also forced four fumbles and recovered two and was an All-Big 12 pick.

Positives: Very tough, durable, relentless and intense. Almost too hyper. Will drop into coverage at times. Is quick off the ball and an intense worker. Is a tough, high-energy player with good quickness, top strength, burst and closing speed. OK in zone drops and coverage. Big, 10½-inch hands and pretty long, 33½-inch arms. Quick first step.

Negatives: Gets too upright and bounced around too much. Lacks change of direction and is slow redirecting. Has OK speed and lacks true edge speed. Thus, is not a speed rusher. Must learn how to counter and redirect as a rusher. Lacks quick hands and body control and has average athletic ability for a defensive end.

Summary: More of a defensive tackle trapped in a defensive end's body.

Redding is a DE in a 3-4, no questions asked. We'd have to look at a BJ Raji or Ron Brace for the NT spot.

Redding at DE with White opposite him, we can resign Cody for depth and see how he does as a 3-4 DE, I've always thought he'd fit there much better anyway. Avril gets to fight for one of the OLB spots in training camp. Getting Peppers would be golden. I don't know if Sims would be able to move to MLB in a 3-4 so if you get Peppers, he takes the other OLB spot and Avril gets subbed in for them I suppose. I've read a few places that Dizon would be better on the outside or as a MLB in a 3-4 scheme so you hope he can make the transition. I'd probably avoid taking Curry first overall because he'd have to be one hell of a linebacker to earn that $50-60 million contract he's all but guaranteed. I really like the idea of turning this team into a 3-4 defense. I also like the idea of taking BJ Raji if he slips to us at #20, whether we go 3-4 or not. He's perfect for a 3-4 NT or he can be a space eater next to the smaller Redding in a 4-3. Remember, Redding had his fantastic season next to gigantic Shaun Rogers eating up 2 blockers every snap. Build from the trenches.

If you don't get Peppers (which is highly unlikely) and you go to a 3-4, there's always the option of taking Orakpo. He's a DE/OLB, so he could make a Merriman-esque transition in the pros potentially. He's supposed to be a freak athlete and all.

^ Avril WILL start next season. 3-4, 4-3...doesn't matter.

Is there any way we have the cap space to sign BOTH Peppers and Haynesworth? If so, I say go with that and cram them in with Avril opposite Peppers and Haynesworth clogging the NT spot. Sims in the middle and likely Dizon alongside him.
Then, with the #1, take Andre Smith. Move Backus to RT and Cherilius to RG. At #20 you have two choices - either DJ Moore to help the secondary or Duke Robinson at LG.
Yes, that could mean you have rookies starting alongside one another on the left side of the line and it could be a difficult year of mistakes there. But it also means that once we get through this we may have the best left side of a line in the NFL one day - something I'm sure Kevin Smith would love to run through.
If they end up with Robinson at 20, I say go secondary in the 2nd round - Patrick Chung, Alphonso Smith, Rashad Johnson, or Sean Smith. Even if they go with Moore, it may be worth two picks for the secondary (which is more picks than the current secondary had all year, right?)

Redding is a DE in a 3-4, no questions asked. We'd have to look at a BJ Raji or Ron Brace for the NT spot.

Yeah, your right.

Raji is a projected Top 10 pick, so we'd have to burn our 1st rounder on him.

It's possible we could get Fili Moala, Terrence Cody or Terrance Taylor in a later round though.

It's extraordinarily doubtful we get both Peppers and Haynesworth let alone either one. We have the capspace but not the draw unless Haynesworth comes via Schwartzy and Peppers wants to play with Haynesworth.

So, assuming we get neither of those, my mock is shaping up somewhat.

1A) Aaron Curry, SLB

I know a lot of people are afraid of straying from paying anyone outside of a QB, OT or DE top pick money. To me, however, Backus is only worth anything as a tackle, Cherilus has shown he can be something pretty good at RT (so let's not move him from there). None of the tackles in the draft look or have the feel of a Jake Long or Joe Thomas type; rather, they all appear to have pretty high risk. Although Stafford has promising tools at QB, from the games I watched I am not sold on his mentality. Curry, while not being your prototypical #1 position, has shown he is the real deal in college. He has defensive ROY written all over him and I feel like that is something we can really use. We'll see how he shows up at the combine. I also hold some hope that we can sign Curry at a lower price than we would a QB or OT but that could just be pipe dreaming. If we do not take Curry or trade down, then I am looking for Stafford or Orakpo to be taken here.

1B) Alphonso Smith, CB

Here is another corner that should work out really well in a man-to-man scheme alongside Bodden (who I'm assuming we have to keep; we can't keep getting rid of talent since we have so little). I have a lot of faith in Bodden's ability in a man to man scheme; Smith is a little small at 5-9 but he can really make plays. Bodden can cover the bigger guys in the man-to-man system while Smith can be the playmaker on the smaller receivers. This pick really promises to shore up our secondary and probably add some flash and excitement to boot. Can tackle and make hits as well. I'm liking this pick more and more.

2A) Herman Johnson, G or Alex Mack, C/G

Both of these guys can really get the opposition on their heels and many times their backs. We are in sore need of good G's on this team and our Backus, Raiola, and Cherilus are at least serviceable and sometimes good. I like Herman Johnson here as he has more potential to dominate but I see Mack as more of the sure thing. Johnson is absolutely huge (6-7, 386) and that worries me a little (thinking of Aaron Gibson). But assuming he can stay in shape he seems the better prospect to me. If we are unsure of his ability to stay in shape, go with Mack here. Johnson would also rarely pull. I like both of these prospects. However, if we stick with the ZBS, Johnson may not even be an option due to his size. If the Duke is available here, I take him over both options, but I think he's gone by this point.

3A) Ron Brace, DT

Here we get our nose tackle who fits well in either the 3-4 or the 4-3. 325 pounder can really clog the run and also get a few sacks as he showed this year. I like him more than Taylor or Cody and, assuming all of them are available here, Brace is my pick. As a terrible running defense, Brace would really be an improvement over what we threw out there this year. Redding goes back to UT and we become that much better. If not Brace then Taylor.

3B) Andy Levitre, G or Trevor Canfield, G

I am hoping we can get Levitre here. However, his stock has been rising and he might not be available here. He is a guy that played both tackle spots in school but has the size to move inside and the ability to push guys off the line. This means he could also bounce outside if we get injured at the tackle spot and need someone out there in a pinch. Canfield is taller but only 305 pounds; he is said to be a bit more a product of his technique than his natural ability, meaning he is polished but probably doesn't have a lot of room to improve. So, I take Levitre here if available.

5, 6a, 6B) Here is where we look to take some flyers. Players who shine at the combine but are still doubted should be looked at here, especially for a PR/KR/WR spot or something similar. I would also look at a TE here. Maybe we look at Pat White to run some crazy offensive stuff like a Wildcat formation. He might also be an option at KR/PR. We could look at taking a flyer on a QB here as well although we may just wait until next year for that if we don't pick anybody good up in FA.

In FA, I think we should look at Vilma. He recently got into some trouble and, with his price likely decreasing some, he could be a great bargain for us at MLB. I am ok with resigning Orlovsky or possibly retaining Culpepper if he can get in/keep in shape. I also look at signing a WR in FA if any good options become available. Backup CB is also something we should be thinking about and acquiring.

Offense:

QB: Culpepper, Orlovsky, Stanton
RB: Kevin Smith
FB: Moran Norris, Jerome Felton
TE: Mike Gaines, Fitzsimmons
WR: Johnson, Furrey, Standeford, White , FA
LT: Backus
LG: Johnson or Mack or Duke
C: Raiola
RG: LeVitre
RT: Cherlius

Defense:

DE: White, IAF
UT: Redding, Fluellen
NT: Ron Brace, Cody
DE: Avril, Smith
WLB: Sims, Cannon
MLB: Vilma, Lenon
SLB: Curry, Dizon
CB: Bodden, FA
SS: Bullocks, Pearson
FS: Alexander, Pearson
CB: Smith, FA

KR/PR: Pat White or other pick

---

Assuming we stay with a 4-3 on defense. In a 3-4 there would be a few changes..

I would love signing Vilma. He would be a bargain. Low risk/high reward player.

Alex Mack would be great too. Yesterday at the Senior Bowl practices they said that Mack was the only linemen who could contain BJ Raji. Plus he can play both guard positions and center.

Holy shit, Ray.

Also DRay, we have Kalvin Pearson who played really well down the stretch as safety depth behind Alexander & Bullocks.

And other depth guys like Alex Lewis & Jared DeVries are adequate bench fodder.

Also DRay, we have Kalvin Pearson who played really well down the stretch as safety depth behind Alexander & Bullocks.

And other depth guys like Alex Lewis & Jared DeVries are adequate bench fodder.
Right. I remembered Pearson played decently down the stretch but forgot to put him in behind both Alexander and Bullocks. Lewis and Lenon can get back to special teams where they belong, and DeVries would play sparingly or be let go, I think. I edited Pearson in there.

I've been thinking long and hard about Curry lately too. He looks like a true impact player who could anchor our defense for years to come and be a leader.

I've been thinking long and hard about Curry lately too. He looks like a true impact player who could anchor our defense for years to come and be a leader.

I'm starting to grow on Aaron Curry too...

BUT, what if you could get Maualuga or Laurinaitis at #20?...I've seen mocks which have both of them that low...

^So what. Take them as well. Dizon hasn't proven anything and if they go to a 3-4 you need another inside LB anyway.

If you get a chance to line up Sims, Maualuga/Laurinaitis and Curry at LB's you do it.

I sure hope they don't take a QB. With Tebow, McCoy and Bradford all staying the crop should be pretty deep next year (and they'll still be picking top 10 anyway). Don't take a chance on a 1 year starter (Sanchez) or a guy that hasn't taken his team anywhere (Stafford).

I'm not willing to "wait and see" if Little Animal or Maualuga are around. It's time to start taking "our" guys. My idea is Laurinitis is still around at 20, but I'd rather we take Alphonso Smith or Vontae Davis if he's still there than James.

If Maualuga slides a little (say he's around at 15 or that area), we should trade a pick to move up and get him. It would probably cost us our extra 3rd rounder (or later picks depending on what they can work out), but I think he's that much better than the other MLB's. Plus I think we'll get an extra middle round pick from losing FA's last year anyway.

I'm not sure I can agree with that. Getting an extra middle round pick would definitely help the case... but I feel one of them is going to be around at 20 and they are both similar player, so I would really hesitate moving up to take one over the other. That's something I'll have to look into more after the upcoming events (Senior Bowl, combine)...

Trade up? No way.

I thought Ray had more speed and James a little better instincts. I guess there is no way to tell until after the combine where guys might go.

Both are true. I just feel their overall skill levels to be very similar, I suppose I should have said that instead.

One thing to note, James is probably better suited to a 3-4 than Ray would be (Ray's coverage recognition is suspect). Don't know what we'll be running but that may be a factor.

If the organization locks their sights on Aaron Curry, and the Lions make that public, I bet we can get out of the #1 pick.


There are teams under us that would entertain moving up to get him, IMO.

He's probably the only player in which you could create a huge demand for since their is such a huge talent drop off from him and Maualuga & Laurinaitis.

VIsvP0FEeTo&feature

RmnpZkypO_8&feature

He makes Maualuga look average and Laurinaitis look like garbage.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3848485

New D-coordinator.

During his original tenure as defensive coordinator, Cunningham's defenses allowed an average of only 16.4 points per game, the best mark in the NFL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NFL) and had a turnover margin of +30, tops in the AFC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Football_Conference). Under his lead, a number of players excelled, including stars such as Derrick Thomas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derrick_Thomas), Neil Smith (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neil_Smith_%28football_player%29), James Hasty (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Hasty), and Dale Carter (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dale_Carter). Cunningham's defenses led Kansas City to an overall record of 42-22.
Keep in mind the QB's during that +30 turn over margin and lowest PPG:

Steve Bono (29 starts, 23 INTs)
Rich Gannon (17 starts, 14 INTs)
Elvis Grbac (16 starts, 23 INTs)

They also had 90 fumbles during that period BTW.

So his defense was pretty good to overcome that.

I hear he's a bit insane and yells at his players like 4-year olds.

We might be able to utilize that.

So Schwartz is going to have the ultimate say over the defense and Cunningham's main focus will be LB's...

So Gunther is a DC in name only, really.

Sales of yellow-tinted shooting glasses are about to go through the roof.

The Detroit area is also about to be inundated with newborns named "Gunther".

Everyone keeps talking about how terrible his team was on defense last year, but if you look at the year before, I believe they were 13th overall (not bad with their not so talented roster) and then they lost Jared Allen to the Vikings, plus their offense couldn't really keep them off the field very well, so of course its going to be terrible. If you look at his entire history he really doesn't look that bad.

Yeah, I don't put any stock into his Defense rankings last year...

The guy has a track record, and to judge him soley on last year is way out of line.

Plus, Schwartz is the head defensive guru, not Cunningham.

http://media.scout.com/Media/Image/51/519568.jpg

So Schwartz is going to have the ultimate say over the defense and Cunningham's main focus will be LB's...

So Gunther is a DC in name only, really.

I wouldn't go that far. I think Schwartz will tell him all the schemes (3-4 vs 4-3) the play packages and who plays where.

I think Gunther will do the majority of the instruction and playcalling.

I haven't heard anything about Schwartz totally running the defense. In fact, I read where Schwartz said he was going to focus on the whole team and he was going to delegate the defense to Gunther. It was in an article on the FreePress but I'm just about to leave class and I don't have the time to look it up.

Yeah, I'm not sure what's making people think Cunningham will be subdued to Schwartz completely on defense. That makes not a whole lot of sense at all. I think they will work together. Gunth is a blitzer while Schwartz just likes to use the front four -- hopefully they find a nice balance with the right personnel.

Per RotoWorld...


Jim Schwartz will run the defense, but Cunningham adds a veteran presence. He won't be wooing many good free agents from his last stop, Kansas City, however. Cunningham's main focus will likely be the Lions' linebackers.

Former Broncos defensive coordinator Bob Slowik will take a position on the Lions' coaching staff, most likely secondary coach.

Any time a former coordinator takes a position coach role, I guess that's decent.

It’s amazing how Rey Maualuga (http://profootball.scout.com/a.z?s=127&p=8&c=1&nid=3833929) makes everything he does on the field look so effortless, and his play on Wednesday was no different. In one-on-one blocking drills, Maualuga went up against Clemson running back James Davis (http://profootball.scout.com/a.z?s=127&p=8&c=1&nid=3676427). Maualuga completely took Davis out of the play with a vicious rip move that left one Jaguars coach shaking his head and smiling. After that incredible move, the nonchalant Maualuga jogged back to where the rest of the linebackers were waiting their turn and started playing with his hair.

I read a Senior Bowl scouting report that said Maualuga is no more than 2 down LB at the next level...

I think his stock is falling.

Laurinaitis could fall to Rd 2.

#88 is supposed to be 'inside' Whatever...

I did get some decent info (I guess its considered inside) re the line, etc.

I guess I could post it if anyone is interested...if I can find it again.

sure, Tahoe, I'd be interested.

Seconded.

Would that be something you'd be interested in?

Yes, yes it would.

Any time a former coordinator takes a position coach role, I guess that's decent.

Source: Bob Slowik will not join the Lions (http://www.mlive.com/lions/index.ssf/2009/01/source_bob_slowik_will_not_joi.html)

Yeah I read that yesterday or a couple of days ago... Crazy how much misinformation we've been receiving this offseason.

Hmmm...he must've looked at the Defensive Back depth chart...

Can't blame him...

Linehan = new offensive coordinator.

Linehan = new offensive coordinator.

Love it. Way to hire coordinators with experience and not just random shmoes off the street.

Lions to the playoffs!


:cornbread text:

It could happen if all of our first five or so picks work out and play great and if we sign a couple of key free agents (I'm thinking Atogwe and Vilma).

But the chances of that happening are probably around 0.2%.

Supposedly Linehan likes Stanton's game... We'll see how that plays out and if Stanton can not get injured for more than two quarters.

Linehan = new offensive coordinator.

He coached DC, iirc, so maybe he'd be able to get something out of the old man till we can bring in another QB next year or something. But after looking at the cap hit on DC, why keep him?

He seems like a coach with a pretty balanced agenda as far as run or pass goes. No?

Supposedly Linehan likes Stanton's game... We'll see how that plays out and if Stanton can not get injured for more than two quarters.

Good news...borderline great news. We have an Off Co who likes someone on our team. :)

Linehan coached Steven Jackson in his best season as a pro...

Now we need an 'Orlando Pace' for Kevin Smith.


But in reality, I like the move. Linehan turned down the 49ers OC job, so he must've saw something he liked here (Calvin).

I've always thought it would be interesting to see the D Coord lobbying the Coach/GM to take a Defensive player early and the Off Coord lobbying the Coach/GM to take a Off player early.

Gunther and Linehan are prolly all smiles to each other and get behind close doors with the coach and start the sales pitch.

We really need to look at the available FAs mixed with whos available in the draft to get everything out of this offseason that we can.

Actually I haven't always thought that would be interesting, but I have do have some interest in it. Not that much though.

To be perfectly honest, about 5 mins ago was prolly the first I've ever thought about it.

2009 NFL Free Agents (http://profootball.scout.com/a.z?s=127&p=9&c=12&nid=83&lnid=83&yr=2009)

Haynesworth, Asomugha, Suggs are locks to be franchised.

Peppers, Dansby and Brandon Jacobs MIGHT be franchised.

So it's safe to toss those 6 out, I think.

I'd like to see Vilma here depending on what we draft in the first round.

I would like to look at Tank Johnson and Andra Davis as backup plans. And what's going to happen with Philly's OT's? They're both old, but both are solid and UFA's.

Can Gosder Cherilus play guard?

If we draft an OT, somebody needs to change positions, and the Killer wrote an article last week that said Backus would not move to guard (although I'm not sure why...)

I think Backus moving to guard would be not only be better for the team, but also make him a more effective player...

It depends on Linehan's offense. If he utilizes the o-line very aggresively (pulling guards and zone blocking), then Backus will need to remain at tackle.

Why? He's doing fine at RT.

EDIT: At least put up "edit" so I don't look like a doofus. Backus cannot play guard, too small and weak. Cherilus probably can, but if we draft an OT, just cut Backus. He's not all that great anyway, and you don't want to "demote" or discourage Cherilus after having a decent season.

Yeah, Backus cannot generate the power needed for inside push that a G requires.
The more effective plan would be to move GC to G and JB to RT, with the drafted player taking over as LT.

Steal every good coach and player you can...especially from the Titans




Lions | Given permission to speak with Burke
Mon, 26 Jan 2009 08:52:19 -0800
Jim Wyatt, of The Tennessean, reports the Detroit Lions have been granted permission to speak with Tennessee Titans defensive assistant/quality control coach Matt Burke. Burke is expected to be elevated to a higher position under new head coach Jim Schwartz.

Lions | Savage not interested in joining front office
Sun, 25 Jan 2009 12:23:36 -0800
Tony Grossi, of the Cleveland Plain Dealer, reports former Cleveland Browns general manager Phil Savage is not interested in joining the Detroit Lions in a front office position.


Cogent right there.

My free agent pruirity list goes like this:
#1 - Haynesworth - clearly dominant, has ties to Schwartz, major position of need.
#2 - Tank Johnson - backup plan for Haynesworth.
#3 - Vilma - versatile ballhawk, another huge position of need.
#4 - Khalif Barnes - big upgrade at LT. Allows some draft felxibility.
#5 - Peppers - stud, but need isn't as strong at DE as it is for some of the other positions.
#6 - Jon Runyan - RT, could give Cherilius the chance to move to G or LT, depending on draft.
#7 - Takeo Spikes - backup plan for Vilma. We almost had him last season. Improved coaching personnel may help us this time. Showed he can still play.
#8 - Amani Toomer - veteran, runs good routes, good enough to keep teams from triple teaming CJ.
#9 - Bo Scaife - young and solid at TE.
#10 - Ryan Fitzpatrick - young and smart. Didn't win in Cinci but a much better backup than anything else we have. Experienced for his age.
#11 - Jarrad Page - probably not too expensive and a nice talent addition at safety.
#12 - Dunta Robinson - another DB, only this time at corner, paired with Bodden is much better than last season.
#13 - Angelo Crowell - OLB isn't the top need but this team has 40 needs.

Pair this with a nice draft and we're competitive next season. Emphasis on competitive.

What about Atogwe as a ballhawking complement to Bullocks? I would love to get Scaife and Vilma as well. Then we'd be well on our way to righting this ship and fast... especially if we can get Alphonso Smith and Alex Mack with the second two of our top three picks.

Not bloody likely, but one can hope.

:cornbread:

I love OJ Atogwe, dude is like a poor mans Ed Reed.

and I like Angelo Crowell, he missed all last season due to an injury so he could be a nice 'buy low' guy...

I guess the Lions had a meeting last night with all of the season ticket holders and the staff. I'm not sure what came out of it, but I know the topic of getting rid of their ridiculous uniforms was brought up and actually considered.

Adam Schefter said that the coaching staff said there is only 3 players that are "untouchable" this offseason...CLIFF AVRIL was on that list...

so the staff has penciled in Avril to start at right defensive end, which will allow Dewyane White to move to the left which is where he was best at...

So I think this is a hint that we're planning on staying with the 4-3, since Avril could never play end in a 3-4.

Avril would play OLB in a 3-4, where I think he would actually excel getting down on the line, too, from time to time... Time will tell. But yeah, if I had to guess, I see us sticking with a 4-3.

I really hate to ruin this great thread because I love reading it, but can we stop the "Backus to guard" or "Cherilus to guard" talk. It simply is not going to happen EVER. There is also almost no chance that we cut Backus so we all have to get prepard to go into the season with Backus, Raoila, Cherilus and which ever two guards we decide to pull out of the bag. I know that it makes sense to all of us to put Backus at guard, but based on his ability and the amount of money it just won't happen.

The #1 pick is either Stafford or Curry right now with Stafford holding a 60/40 edge probably. I would prefer Curry, but I don't think Stafford is the worst decision ever. (I almost vomited saying that last part tho)

Yeah, I agree, there is about a 5% chance of moving Backus to a different position. I think if we draft an OT then we cut Backus.

For the majority of the bowl game against MSU, Stafford looked about as good as Steven Threet. I want no part of that.

As for one of the tackles moving to guard, why not? If Millen were here it wouldn't happen because the organization would be too embarrassed. Listening to Schwartz, I get the feeling he doesn't care who he pisses off. If you make a lot of money but suck balls at your position, he won't let you kill the team by continuing to suck. He's a stat freak and if crunching some numbers no one else has even heard about suggests that someone could be an asset at a different position, he'll try it. It's not like Backus and his dumbass contract are killing our cap right now.

wdfn (well, the crappy new version of wdfn) just said they released Mike Furrey

wdfn (well, the crappy new version of wdfn) just said they released Mike Furrey


Not surprised. Kind of hard to believe he led the entire NFC in receptions just two years ago...

Regardless, he was useless once Martz left.

I hope he latches on somewhere...

John Standeford's happy...

Furrey wasn't a bad receiver. He would have been a decent #3 for us.

Detroit News:

(Gunther) wants to attack quarterbacks and disrupt opposing offenses with a beefy front line and aggressive scheme.
We have FAR from a beefy front line, so I assume we're going after a big NT either in the draft or free agency. Right now we're actually pretty small up front, especially if Avril is now the starter.

Raji number 1?

--yes we are very small up front right now. The Haynesworth talk is likely a pipedream, but he would be a perfect acquisition so as not to have to draft a nose early (if at all).

-- I also want to see for sure what kind of scheme we are going with, that would make it much easier to speculate personnel. However, 3-4 or 4-3, we need a big, fat nose tackle, and a good one.

I still would rather see us go to a 3-4, as long as we could get a nose tackle. I think I'm just stuck on the idea though, I'm not sure if it actually fits us better or not, I always find ways to make it sound good to myself though.

B.J. Raji's stock is growing like on a torrid pace...

No doubt. Just two weeks ago it was realistic that we could get him at 20. Likely not anymore.

Take him with the first pick!

Well, I say it every year, but a trade down certainly makes sense this year. I count no fewer than 11 players I would be happy with as the Lions' first pick. If we could give up the pick and add an early 2nd rounder or maybe even a future 1st I would take it.

Problem is, who would move up?

Free agency is also a huge factor in who we pick, but there are certainly several players who can help us immediately.

As I look at different projections (which will change 2,000,000 times in the next 3 months) it's impossible to speculate who will be available where. Some have Raji as high as 3 and as low as 21, while others have that for Oher. Some have Stafford as the only QB taken in the 1st round and 1st overall still, while others have Sanchez ahead of him. Maualuga is anywhere from 4 to 25. Curry from 2 to 13. Etc, etc.

Either way, there's easily 35 guys in the draft that I would be thrilled with in the first round (assuming they came at the right point) so the idea we could end up with 3 of them without trading down excites me. The idea that some may even be around in the 3rd is even better.

And yet, I still have this sneaking suspicion that Mayhew will blow it. I wish Schwartz had more say in the war room.

^ Which is why (no trading partners for #1) I think Gunther, Schwartz and Linehan should get together and each pick the player they like out of the top 10 players.

Prioritize the players and have Mayhew and Lewand call the agent and start negotiating. Try to get them to take #3 or #4 money...especially if you pick a player that is projected 8-12ish. Then spend some of that money on a FA.

There is no clear #1 this year, imo.

And how great it would be if two of the three picked the same player.

^ Orgasmic...well it would be really really cool.

The Bears did that 10 years ago or so. They were drafting 20ish. They called a db, iirc, and split the difference with him and they were happy, he was happy to be drafted earlier than expected, etc.

Seems like the player was from San Diego or something.

Jeth, that is why I think this is the worst year to have #1.

Trading down makes all the sense in the world for the Lions, but nobody will want to trade up.

Let's hope one person's stock EXPLODES at the combine and someone wants to jump up from the 4-8 spot to get him. Someone like Curry, Crabtree, one of the OTs...

Philly has two 1st rd picks at 22 and 28...would you trade the #1 for both of those?

giving you 4 of the first 33 picks...

quality or quantity?

I'm not sure I would...but food for thought...

I think I would if I were the Lions.

Not only do you get two first round talents, but you don't have to commit that monstrous #1 pick salary/signing bonus to a single player.

I doubt the Eagles would do that, actually.

Philly has two 1st rd picks at 22 and 28...would you trade the #1 for both of those?

giving you 4 of the first 33 picks...

quality or quantity?

I'm not sure I would...but food for thought...

That's a pretty lowsy deal IMO. If you were picking around 8-10 range then it would be a good deal to trade for the two picks.

I would defenitely do the deal if you could swing another trade down prior to that. Say you got a team in the 7-10 range that really wanted Curry or Crabtree and felt there would be a huge drop off in talent for those positions before their pick. They could pick up a 2nd and 3rd for dropping down and then do your deal.

They'd have #22, #28, 3 2nds and 3 3rds.

I agree with Glenn. I don't think Philly would do it but it would be worth it for the Lions.

That's a big drop off from 1 to 22 and 28. If they had a pick in the teens then it would be something to consider. If, like Chris said, they'd already swung a deal to move to the 8-10 range it would be more appealing, but even then I think I'd rather have that 8-10 guy (someone like Raji or one of the OTs). I guess it all comes down to how well you think Mayhew will do with his draft picks. Will he get some diamond in the rough picks or will he be better at sure thing picks.

I think that's a fair question but with such a huge depth problem like the Lions, would you rather have the chance (no matter how slim it is with the Lions drafting) to get two very good to great players in the first round rather than one great player?

Well, with the number of picks they have (chances to get good players later) I think they need to get that great player at the top of the draft.

it really depends on whether you think you'd still get a great player wherever you trade down to.

That's why I think going for something in the mid-teens would be acceptable (depending on what else we got with it). Any lower than that and it starts to get iffy. In that range, they could grab someone that they still really like a lot, because it seems that there's some solid fits with a group of players that will be scattered throughout the top 15 but won't quite drop to 20.

That's a big drop off from 1 to 22 and 28. If they had a pick in the teens then it would be something to consider. If, like Chris said, they'd already swung a deal to move to the 8-10 range it would be more appealing, but even then I think I'd rather have that 8-10 guy (someone like Raji or one of the OTs). I guess it all comes down to how well you think Mayhew will do with his draft picks. Will he get some diamond in the rough picks or will he be better at sure thing picks.

Agree. If we had a great front office I'd prolly take that chance, but our chances increase to get a good player (with the current clowns) drafting in the #1 spot.

Normally I would totally agree with you but a few things stick in my head:

I'm just going to assume that our crack, expert football management team can get a draft right. I may not believe it but I'm going to assume it. I think you have to assume it so that you can honestly figure out what would be best for the Lions. If not you start hoping the Lions make moves that are not as good but less risky, you're automatically conditioning them to miss out on getting the best draft possible.

I totally understand where you all are coming from and there's no doubt that a top ten pick would give the Lions a much better chance at a great player or an impact player than two in the 20's.

However I'm only concerned with overall depth. Impact players are great and can win you games. But it's depth that gets you in the playoffs and beyond. I remember something Peter King said years ago about the Patriots (whom he has a huge hard-on for, but I still really like his MMQ column). He said, more or less, that they were so great because their 45th man was better than the 25th man on every other football team and that most fans don't realize how important that is. That was how they were able to plug 2nd or 3rd string receivers in as DB's and still make it work. They overcame tons of injuries as well. Now I also think great coaching is a big help too, but they got the most out of their depth.

Applying this to the Lions you could almost say that every other team's 28th player is better than Detroit's 8th player. The Lions have starters that would be 3rd stringers on any other team. You can't play well consistently with that.

Which is why, in this long-winded post about a hypothetical scenario, I'd take the Philly deal posted here in a heartbeat.

Normally I would totally agree with you but a few things stick in my head:

I'm just going to assume that our crack, expert football management team can get a draft right. I may not believe it but I'm going to assume it. I think you have to assume it so that you can honestly figure out what would be best for the Lions. If not you start hoping the Lions make moves that are not as good but less risky, you're automatically conditioning them to miss out on getting the best draft possible.

I totally understand where you all are coming from and there's no doubt that a top ten pick would give the Lions a much better chance at a great player or an impact player than two in the 20's.

However I'm only concerned with overall depth. Impact players are great and can win you games. But it's depth that gets you in the playoffs and beyond. I remember something Peter King said years ago about the Patriots (whom he has a huge hard-on for, but I still really like his MMQ column). He said, more or less, that they were so great because their 45th man was better than the 25th man on every other football team and that most fans don't realize how important that is. That was how they were able to plug 2nd or 3rd string receivers in as DB's and still make it work. They overcame tons of injuries as well. Now I also think great coaching is a big help too, but they got the most out of their depth.

Applying this to the Lions you could almost say that every other team's 28th player is better than Detroit's 8th player. The Lions have starters that would be 3rd stringers on any other team. You can't play well consistently with that.

Which is why, in this long-winded post about a hypothetical scenario, I'd take the Philly deal posted here in a heartbeat.

I agree that depth is important, but I think the idea is you can get the same amount of depth with better talent. Let's say, for example, that Al Davis got addicted to a player that may be gone by #7 and there were hints that he may even go #1. Typically jumping from 7 to 1 would cost you this year's 2nd round and 5th round plus next year's 1st or 2nd. The value calculator is rather high. But if Maypuke spoke to Davis and said "Look, it can be yours for only the #7 overall and the #39 (assuming the Raiders haven't dealt their 2nd round)." I think a guy like Al Davis may take that.

So you still get 2 players, just like the Philly deal. However, the drop off from 7 to 22 would be huge. 7 gets you an elite player. 22 gets you a very good player. Meanwhile, the dropoff from 28 to 39 is notable, but not as extreme as the other. The talent difference is minimal.

I think the Oakland style deal is much closer to what posters here are thirsting for. Builds the exact same quantity of depth, but the combined quality of depth should be much higher.

I agree that depth is important, but I think the idea is you can get the same amount of depth with better talent. Let's say, for example, that Al Davis got addicted to a player that may be gone by #7 and there were hints that he may even go #1. Typically jumping from 7 to 1 would cost you this year's 2nd round and 5th round plus next year's 1st or 2nd. The value calculator is rather high. But if Maypuke spoke to Davis and said "Look, it can be yours for only the #7 overall and the #39 (assuming the Raiders haven't dealt their 2nd round)." I think a guy like Al Davis may take that.

So you still get 2 players, just like the Philly deal. However, the drop off from 7 to 22 would be huge. 7 gets you an elite player. 22 gets you a very good player. Meanwhile, the dropoff from 28 to 39 is notable, but not as extreme as the other. The talent difference is minimal.

I think the Oakland style deal is much closer to what posters here are thirsting for. Builds the exact same quantity of depth, but the combined quality of depth should be much higher.
In a scenario like this, you could probably then trade the 7th for the 22nd and 28th if that's the route you really wanted to go. You're still playing with a top-10 pick, which is worth quite a bit. In this draft, I'd think that the #7 pick is almost as valuable as the #1. You're still going to get a potential stud and you're not paying him nearly as much.

During an ESPN radio gig, Kiper was talking about Stafford and how he's been aware of him since he was in high school. Some of you might have been aware of this already, but then I heard Kiper say that he predicted at that time -- when Stafford was in high school -- that he would one day be the No. 1 overall pick of the NFL draft.

So why would Kiper, at this stage of the game, drop Stafford to third or eighth in the draft order -- like other analysts have -- when he can reasonably keep him at No. 1? It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

It all makes sense.

http://superbowl.fanhouse.com/2009/01/29/steelers-linebacker-wants-to-be-a-lion/


Steelers Linebacker Wants to Be a Lion

A decade ago, a Steelers inside linebacker opted to leave Pittsburgh, and a year later ended up in Detroit -- Earl Holmes was never heard from again. Could history be about to repeat itself?

Larry Foote, a starter with the Steelers for three seasons, supposedly would happily leave Pittsburgh to come back home to play for the Lions. A friend of Foote's told the Detroit Free Press that Foote is hoping to come back to Detroit before too long, even if that means playing for the worst franchise in pro sports.

Foote actually has a pretty good head on his shoulders. He's not crazy; he just has a lot of ties to the Detroit area. It's his hometown (not that anyone noticed during Super Bowl XL week, it seems a certain Steelers running back was also from the Detroit) and Foote is still is very active in trying to help with charity work in Detroit during the offseason.

So apparently 0-16 might not deter Foote from heading home.

"He wants to come back here," said Brian Blackburn, a friend of Foote's. "This is the last year of his contract, and he wants to come back here and play for the Lions for about four years and call it quits after that."
Foote's current five-year deal will expire after the 2009 season. With James Farrior signed for five years and 2007 first-round pick Lawrence Timmons breathing down his neck, it's likely that next year was going to be Foote's last year in Pittsburgh anyway.

Wow, if true, that would be huge for the Lions and horrible for the Steelers.

Foote is a bad ass.

So let me get this straight -- is he under contract for one more year in Pitt after the Super Bowl?

I'm not sure. I think his contract is up or he'll ask for his release.

He's an OLB in Pittsburghs 3-4, would he be a MLB in a 4-3?

Bart Scott also said on Rome he'd love to come back and play here.

So the LB free agent market could be kind to us...

Foote
Scott
Vilma
Spikes


So maybe we can cross off LB in the 1st round and get a corner (Alphonso Smith)...?

Unless I am missing something, Foote has another year in Pitt.


Foote's current five-year deal will expire after the 2009 season. With James Farrior signed for five years and 2007 first-round pick Lawrence Timmons breathing down his neck, it's likely that next year was going to be Foote's last year in Pittsburgh anyway.

So it would have to be a trade that brought Foote here this year. If Pittsburgh is kean on his backup and he only has that one year left, how much do you think the Steelers would demand in a trade?

I'm guessing the answer is a draft pick or collection of draft picks.

Probably not more than a 3rd rounder, maybe even less.
I never understand the perceived value of players vs picks in the NFL. Sometimes a great player only requires a 2nd day pick. Other times a mediocre player brings in much more.
Example, compare what the Raiders got for Moss vs what Detroit got for TRRW.

Contract/salary situation, perhaps?

The draft picks we got from Jones seems way out of whack to me. Way too much, imo.

I do think we might have been able to move him to the Giants this offseason, but we wouldn't have rec'd that good a package from them.

And if Dallas does release TO, like Jones son wants, the Giants will snatch him up.

Foote will surely be released...

Timmons will be the starter, so Foote will be a cap casuality.

I'll believe it when I see it.

I guess we don't know what defense will be run, but Scott could come here and play ILB. That would be a big upgrade over Paris Lennon.

They wouldn't go after Foote unless he was cut.

Here is a trade value chart but obviously doesn't include players on rosters.

Its interesting though.

http://www.thehuddlereport.com/Free/tradechart.shtml

According to that chart, both of Philly's 1st rounders wouldn't even equal HALF of the value of the #1 overall pick.

780 + 660 = 1440

Interesting.

I've seen that chart before, I think it's used around NFL front offices.

I think that chart is accurate for some, but not all drafts.
In this draft where no one can say which of the top 8 guys should really be #1, how can the top pick truly be 3000 but #8 be 1400? According to that chart, 7 and 8 combined would not equal the top pick. It would have to be 7 overall, 8 overall, and the 4th pick of the 4th round to equal #1 overall.

I'm guessing if some multi-team deal was thrown at Mayhew that equaled that, even HE would take it.

A team I keep looking at is Buffalo. They have the #11 pick. I keep wondering if there is a deal there with them. They're likely to resign Jabari Greer (which sucks because I would love to see him here) and start him across from McKelvin. That leaves Terrence McGee out, and in the final year of his contract.

Would Buffalo trade the #11, their 3rd or 4th rounder, and McGee to move up and take Curry (OLB is arguably their biggest need and they make think he's the difference maker to put them into the playoffs).

Value-wise I would be good with that from Detroit's perspective. We get a guy that is a Pro Bowl caliber return man and a good starting corner, plus at 11 we still get a starter (possibly Maualuga, an OT, Orakpo, or maybe even one of the two QBs because I imagine one of them will drop if we don't take them) and we get another pick in the 3rd.

Frankly, I think Detroit would jump on it and I have a hunch it would be good enough for Buffalo - unless they feel Curry and Maualuga are on the same level and one of them may still be there at 11.

I'd as for their 2nd rounder with that, at the VERY least the 3rd plus another late rounder, the 4th just seems too low.

But would Buffalo give up that much to get a player not that much better than what they are going to get at #11 and have to pay that player an astronomical salary/bonus to boot?

What did Dallas give up to get Roy? I wonder what those picks add up to?

If I did it right, Dallas gave up aobut 758 in trade value for Roy which is close to the 23rd pick.

We got their 1st, they rec'd our 4th and we rec'd their 6th.

According to this chart anyway.

And they got our 7th, I thought.

Did we not get their 3rd?

But would Buffalo give up that much to get a player not that much better than what they are going to get at #11 and have to pay that player an astronomical salary/bonus to boot?


All depends on if they think Curry is that much better or not. Also, many mocks are seeing Maualuga rising up the board and possibly not being there at 11. Some buzz reflects the possibility that by the time we get to the draft both OLBs are taken in the top 6-7, meaning Buffalo would be forced to move up (not all the way to 1, necessarily) in order to address that need.

Also, as for the salary, McGee's cap number last season was over $4 million. Not sure what it will be next season, but losing that helps get through the difference in rookie contracts between #1 and #11.

What's the value of a franchise LB?

Buffalo doesn't spend money like that. They pick up the scraps like the Lions. It would really surprise me.

Make that 913 which makes it between the 17th and the 18th.

Add another CB to the list of our needs... Bodden's been cut.

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090204/SPORTS0101/902040460/1126

Not really a fan of this as we both lose talent and bring back the possibility of a zone scheme...

This move is somewhat like one of Millens 1st moves...letting Hartings go.

I'm hoping for a different outcome this time around.

Lions made a huge mistake with Leigh Bodden and now he's gone

by Tom Kowalski | Opinion Wednesday February 04, 2009, 5:29 PM


There are going to be a lot of reasons given why the Detroit Lions informed cornerback Leigh Bodden that he won't be back with the team next year. There will be the roster bonus (which was huge), his performance (which was mediocre) and his post-season comments (which were the final nail in the coffin). All of these are legitimate reasons why Bodden won't return, but the real blame for this failure belongs squarely on the shoulders of the Lions.
Bodden was acquired in the trade that sent Shaun Rogers to the Cleveland Browns and it appeared to be a great deal at the time. In addition to a draft pick, the Lions were beefing up their thin secondary with an up-and-coming player like Bodden.
Former head coach Rod Marinelli and defensive coordinator Joe Barry, though, completely mishandled the situation. Bodden is a brash and confident young player who thrives on success but the Lions messed with his head from the very beginning. Marinelli's custom of having new players "earn'' starting positions was ridiculous -- and that's been pointed out many times in this blog. It was especially foolish in the case of Bodden, who was a three-year starter with the Browns and had six interceptions last year.
Still, Bodden was delegated as a No. 2 cornerback behind Travis Fisher for the entire training camp and preseason. It was embarrassing to Bodden. The Lions plunged the dagger in even deeper when they made Fisher the starter for the season opener in Atlanta. Bodden quickly entered the game when Fisher gave up some big plays, but the damage was done.
During the season, the Lions -- after making an even bigger mistake by signing Brian Kelly -- switched Bodden over to Kelly's spot on the left side of the defense. It's a move that Bodden resisted, but the Lions didn't want to hear about it.
Now, you can't have players running the locker room and while the coaches have to be the ultimate authority, there is a right way and a wrong way to deal with young players and their egos. There was never a discussion with Bodden about why or any attempt to appease his feelings. Bodden didn't feel as comfortable on the left side but the Lions didn't care. Bodden came into Detroit with a lot of promise and he was treated like a second-class citizen every step of the way and his performance reflected it.
Bodden is due an $8.6 million roster bonus on Feb. 27 and that's one of the reasons he will be cut loose (the Lions will do it officially on Monday). The biggest reason for Bodden's departure, though, is because he's damaged goods. He was a player who might have been able to help turn the team around but he was so disgusted that after the team ended its 0-16 season, Bodden said this about his future: "I want to play football. I don't care where I'm at.''

sigh...

So what are they going to do with all their cap space? probably nothing.

They'll prolly have to overpay for FAs anyway...why not give him something you negotiated in the first place? Give the front office some cred..some worthiness or something.

Who cares if they have to? Spend a little extra to get Haynesworth and Peppers (if able to). Overspending on a couple players won't matter much anyway since the roster is already trimmed down to nothing.

Don't get me wrong...I have NO, zero, ZIPPO problem with overspending on players like you've mentioned.

I just think Bodden is here. Go communicate to him that we're wipping the slate clean and we want him here. It seems like he is a guy on our roster that actually has talent and is somewhat young. Roll wid it.

One final thing...if it was Schwartzy who didn't like his game, then don't let the door hit ya Bodden, but this smells of a Mayhew salary cap mgmt over keeping a good young player move to me with a new coach coming in.

If its Coach, then fine, if its Mayhew, I don't like it.

Also, if they pay DC, but cut this guy cuz of the bonus ... well I might as well expect that is what they'll do.

Bodden is only 27, but considering he'll be in his mid-30's by the time the Lions can be competitive, who cares?

Just sign UDFA's to be 2nd and 3rd string at every position. Some will play, some won't. Both Superbowl teams had multiple contributors that weren't drafted. Might as well put a whole team on the field for one year that is young and can learn while taking their lumps. Then get #1 picks again next year and have the most talented young team in the league as a base while adding FA's.

Bodden is only 27, but considering he'll be in his mid-30's by the time the Lions can be competitive, who cares?

Just sign UDFA's to be 2nd and 3rd string at every position. Some will play, some won't. Both Superbowl teams had multiple contributors that weren't drafted. Might as well put a whole team on the field for one year that is young and can learn while taking their lumps. Then get #1 picks again next year and have the most talented young team in the league as a base while adding FA's.

He's 27, but consdiering he'll be in his mid-30s by the time the Lions can be competitive? 8 years to get competitive? Mark me down as disagreeing with that. Miami turned it around in 1 year. We won't do that but 8 years?

And the 2nd part is nothing I want any part of either.

Agreed. If you build a culture of inferiority and losing like that, it feeds upon itself. That's what we've been doing forever, it's time to erase that mentality.

Sorry, I forgot the green text.

Lions dumping black third uniforms to go back to the retro jerseys. About time. Sounds like its a Lewand decision.

That should help them in the win column

Word is from looking at a couple Steelers forums that the Steelers might cut Larry Foote since they have Timmons waiting and their cap is a little tight. The statement about playing for the Lions might push Steelers management to give Foote his wish.

That would certainly fill a hole and eliminate the pressing mega huge need for a MLB for a few years... Add a couple of FA's like Dunta Robinson and Albert Haynesworth and we're already looking at a vastly improved team not to mention the draft. I'll keep my fingers crossed. I could certainly better stomach Stafford at number 1 if we have multiple other needs addressed with good young FA's. As it stands, my mock still looks the same as it did but it is hinging on if we sign a DT in free agency. If not, we may need to reach for Brace....

Yeah, if we get a premier D-lineman, a good LB and a good CB then I could see spending the #1 on a QB. With the money in Backus (for now), they would be better served to take OL at #20 or later.

There is always a lot of shuffling after the combine anyway with the big boards.

I'm still not fascinated by the idea of taking a QB even if we fill a few other needs. If we grab a MLB, are we looking at moving Dizon to the outside? If not, we still need an OLB. We'll still need help at D-end even if we have Haynesworth and Redding in the middle, unless you think White and Avril are going to anchor the outside, and even so we'll still need a lot of D-line depth. If we got Robinson at corner, we'd still need another starting CB since we're cutting Bodden. Our O-line is still terrible, even if we can't move Backus to guard and we're stuck with him and Cherilus at the tackles. We've just got to take the best player in the draft, practically regardless of position. We have needs at just about every spot.

THIS IS NOT A BROWNS THREAD

I'm still not fascinated by the idea of taking a QB even if we fill a few other needs. If we grab a MLB, are we looking at moving Dizon to the outside? If not, we still need an OLB. We'll still need help at D-end even if we have Haynesworth and Redding in the middle, unless you think White and Avril are going to anchor the outside, and even so we'll still need a lot of D-line depth. If we got Robinson at corner, we'd still need another starting CB since we're cutting Bodden. Our O-line is still terrible, even if we can't move Backus to guard and we're stuck with him and Cherilus at the tackles. We've just got to take the best player in the draft, practically regardless of position. We have needs at just about every spot.

I didn't say I'd want QB, I just said I'd be better able to stomach it. I still want Curry, Smith, Mack with the first three picks... OLB, CB, and G (C when Raiola leaves). Then another guard (Andy Levitre) with the next pick if we can sign a DT.

DrRay...Chris... who are the skul crackers this year that are LBs or Safeties?

RotoWorld...


Lions beat writer Tom Kowalski believes that free agent SLB Michael Boley could be an "ideal fit" for Detroit's rebuilding project.

I'll take him.

RIDING MICHAEL BOLEY TO THE SUPER BOWLEY

LOL @ Detroit rebuilding project

The Killer also suggests Dunta Robinson as a possiblity at CB.


I used to love Dunta before he tore his ACL in '07... If the Texans just let him walk then that would be an idication that he's not the same player...

RotoWorld...


Lions hired former Jaguars official Shack Harris as Senior Personnel Executive.

So Harris joins Lewand & Mayhew to complete the 3 headed Front Office monster.

That's great. We needed someone else with a history of ineptitude in there.

^ You guys have the Browns. Isn't that enough?

Lions GM Martin Mayhew says Jason Hanson will be franchised if the sides can't come to a contract agreement before free agency.

This HAS to be the Lions low-balling Jason...

New GM Martin Mayhew called the Lions' quarterback situation with regard to Daunte Culpepper and Jon Kitna "probably the biggest personnel decision we'll have to make this offseason."

So does this mean no Stafford?

Seriously, I don't see how Kitna can return. He permanently tarnished his reputation last year in the Green Bay meltdown in Week 2.

At least with Culpepper there is some upside.

Culpepper's upside: he's Daunte Culpepper.

Seriously, only the Lions would have to franchise their kicker.

I think the Falcons and another team are rumored to be too. Pretty fuckin weird though

All that means is that the kicker would get the average of the 5 highest paid kickers. That can't be much. Cops and teachers make more, don't they?

I think it was somewhere around $2.5mil to franchise the kicker. I know the difference between the franchise tag and transition tag was barely anything at all, and who else are you going to franchise on this team? I'd be fine seeing all the other FA's walk.

I think the Titans are going to franchise Bironas, so it's not that uncommon.

It's just strange that they can't find common ground on a new contract.

Daunte Culpepper didn't win a game as Detroit's starting quarterback in 2008, but one of his former teammates says he will have the chance to end that losing streak this coming season.

Ex-Lions wide receiver Mike Furrey said Culpepper will return under center heading into the 2009 campaign.

"I've spoken to a couple of my friends who are backups there and I know [the Lions] are going to name Daunte Culpepper as the starter," Furrey said during a Sunday morning appearance on Sirius NFL Radio.

Signed to a two-year contract last November because of injuries to fellow quarterbacks Jon Kitna and Dan Orlovsky, Culpepper was initially considered a stop-gap at the position. The Lions were 0-5 with Culpepper before returning to Orlovsky for their final three games. Neither player was able to help Detroit avoid becoming the first 0-16 team in NFL history.

Having announced his retirement at the start of the 2008 season, Culpepper was out of shape when joining the Lions and had little time to practice with his new teammates before being thrust onto the field. Culpepper posted a 52.2 completion percentage with four touchdowns and six interceptions while also being sacked 14 times.

The fact that Culpepper is due a $2.5 million roster bonus on February 27 as well as a $2.5 million base salary for 2009 raised questions about his future in Detroit. Culpepper, though, did show flashes of his days as one of the league's top quarterbacks from earlier in his 10-year NFL career. He will now be reunited with new Lions offensive coordinator Scott Linehan, who held the same position in Minnesota during Culpepper's heyday from 2002 to 2004. Culpepper has played with Detroit, Oakland (2007) and Miami (2006) since suffering a serious knee injury in 2005 while with the Vikings.

"He's going to be a leader," Furrey said of Culpepper. "He's had the knowledge to play the game for a long time. He's been very successful. It's tough for anybody to come in toward the middle or end of the season and revive a team that has been downward spiraling the whole time."

Even if Culpepper is pegged as a short-term starter, it doesn't preclude Detroit from selecting a quarterback in late April with the draft's top overall pick. Matthew Stafford (Georgia) and Mark Sanchez (Southern Cal) are considered the top prospects at the position, but both are early-entry juniors who may need more seasoning before being ready to push for starting positions.

Keeping Culpepper will likely lead to the departures of Kitna and Orlovsky. A three-year Lions starter, the 36-year-old Kitna is set to earn a $500,000 roster bonus along with a $2 million base salary in 2009.

Orlovsky is set to leave via free agency. After attempting only 17 passes in his first three NFL seasons, Orlovsky started seven games and played in three others in 2008 when Kitna went on injured reserve with a back injury.

"Danny is looking and ready to go someplace else," Furrey said. "He's done well enough to deserve a chance to start or at least compete for a starting spot somewhere. I know they've asked him to come back and be the backup."

As for Furrey himself, he is optimistic about signing elsewhere within the next two weeks in what will likely be a slot receiver role. The six-year veteran enjoyed his best season with the Lions in 2006 when catching 98 passes for 1,086 yards and six touchdowns. Injuries limited Furrey's production the past two seasons and contributed to last week's release by the Lions.

LOL @ 'Danny'

'Danny End Zone' Unfortunately it was his own.

GOOD I WANT CULPEPPER!!!

FOUNTAIN OF YOUTH, DAUNTE WILL LEAD US TO THE PROMISELAND! (8-8)

I don't mind them keeping DC if they get another QB in the hopper.

The Lions make me a little less sick when they have DC playing QB.[/green]

Culpepper posted a 52.2 completion percentage with four touchdowns and six interceptions while also being sacked 14 times.
It's very sad that I read this and thought to myself "Hey, he didn't do that bad."

Daunte Culpepper has reworked his contract with the Lions, ensuring that he'll be on the roster deep into the offseason.

Lions re-signed K Jason Hanson to a four-year contract.

Hanson's also been resigned to a 4 year deal.

http://www.mlive.com/lions/index.ssf/2009/02/lions_culpepper_restructures_c.html

Edit: Damnit Wil.

Team president Tom Lewand revealed Tuesday that the Lions are in talks with free agent Dan Orlovsky.

Danny End Zone > DC

Danny End Zone > DC

I guess.


Neither cause any reason for excitement.

I just hope they can re-sign Hanson.

I just hope they can re-sign Hanson.


Weak, Glenn.

Lions and Peterman agree on 5 year 15mil, 5.5m GTeed.

J. Peterman?

http://www.movieprop.com/tvandmovie/Seinfeld/peterman.jpg

Guard, Stephen Peterman.

Killer makes a lot of sense here:

Derek Anderson a possibility? (http://www.mlive.com/lions/index.ssf/2009/02/is_derek_anderson_a_possibilit.html)

It would allow the Lions to get two impact defensive players in the first round.

I don't know about that. I have a lot of friends that are Browns fans and they hate him. They all seem to feel he had one fluke season and he never showed anything worthwhile other than that.

I don't know about that. I have a lot of friends that are Browns fans and they hate him. They all seem to feel he had one fluke season and he never showed anything worthwhile other than that.

You really opened a door there.

I don't want DA.... I would agree he had one fluke season.

I know, but I wanted to share what little info I had.

While I wouldn't want to throw a ton of money and resources his way, they are certainly worse options than Anderson.
If I were responsible for defending the guy, I would point out that while Brady Quinn is the annointed, the two had virtually identical passer ratings last year. I would also point out that he was throwing to Braylon Edwards, the #1 dropped passes WR in the league with room to spare (a problem that furstrated many UM fans in the past), Winslow, and absolutely no one else. There's not another WR on that team that deserves a job.
And I'm sorry, you can fluke your way into a lot of things, but 29 TD in your 3rd season isn't fluking. Only Rivers, Brees, and Warner had more than 29 this past season. Only Brady, Romo, Roethelisberger, and P. Manning had more the year before that.

Now, if I were arguing against him, I would point out that even in his best season he had 19 INT's. That sounds like some serious Scott Mitchell stuff right there. But, on the other hand, is it safe to say that Mitchell (scary as it may be) performed better than any other Lions QB over the past 20 years? Who would have thought he would be the standard?

I know, but I wanted to share what little info I had.

So can you tell us why these "friends" soured on him so much?

SI's Don Banks is convinced that the Lions will not draft a quarterback with the No. 1 overall pick.

I've never even heard of 'Don Banks', sounds almost like a made-up name. But interesting nonetheless...

Don Banks is solid.

Schwartzy on NFL Network. I stole this from the Wiley one...not that I don't go to dl.com....just wanted to give cred where cred is due.


http://www.detroitlions.com/

So can you tell us why these "friends" soured on him so much?
Mostly poor decisions and picks. One of them's a big ND/Quinn fan so I take all his comments with a grain of salt.

• Left tackle Jeff Backus (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/5465/;_ylt=AogPIhsJTha0WXuEw4zlBPnsrZJ4) has not spoken with Mayhew about moving to guard, other than a short, casual conversation during the 2008 season. “I have not spoken with Martin since the end of the season other than just crossing paths in the facility and just saying hi to each other,” Backus said today. “There was just a brief moment during practice one day - I don’t even know, November or something - when he asked me if I’d ever played guard before. I said, ‘No. I’ve always played tackle.’ And I go, ‘Why are you asking?’ He just said, ‘There’s a lot of good tackles coming out of college this year.’ That’s as much of a conversation as I’ve had with Martin about playing guard.” Backus has started every game at left tackle - 128 straight - since the Lions drafted him in the first round in 2001.


There's just something not right about this.^^^

Which part just isn't right? The part about their conversations or the part about him starting 128 straight games for us?

Well, both, I guess, but I meant their conversation. It just seems very amateurish.

We can put off getting Center, OG, DE I don't think we need a DE, but thats me, RB, WR

We need Left OT, QB, CB, LB, DT.

No, our biggest need on the o-line is OG. We could get an LT and push Backus over, but as the roster currently stands, we have Peterman there and that's basically it (Man-Ram sucks).

Fair enough, but Backus isn't taking us anywhere near the playoffs imo at left T. With the L OT being the most important position other then QB, its our top, or tied with our top need to rebuild this team.

We'll still have a shot at a franchise LT next year. this team isn't winning 8 games.

Why wait?