The Official Fire Joe Dumars Thread

[Atticus771]

To be honest, this thread kinda makes me ashamed to be a Pistons fan, since that's what most of you guys consider yourselves. The draft was definitely not as bad as you're all making it sound.

First, I think Stuckey can be a fine player for us if we use him the right way. The only thing Young has on Stuckey is three point shooting, and we all know we don't need that. We need someone who can put the ball on the floor and drive into traffic, and Stuckey CAN do that.

Afflalo DOES address what we needed in terms of a backup for Tay. He is a good defender and was UCLA's leading scorer. Personally, I'm very confident in what he can do backing up Tay. Plus, there is still the possibility of someone else coming in through a trade (dumping Flip Murray, Nazr).

The sky isn't falling, everyone. Relax. I know the natural reaction is to freak out when things don't exactly go our way. But look at last offseason. We lost Ben, who was "the heart and soul of our team," and most people predicted we'd finish in the bottom half of the East playoff teams. Instead, we had the best record and came within one freak LeBron performance from another Finals berth. It's clear enough to me that to doubt this team is not usually a good plan.

[micknugget]

I'm not saying that you have any control over his job security.

What I am saying is that teams go through ups and downs. The Pistons have been the best team in the East for 4 years now. The last two years have been trying because our expectations have been high - and rightfully so. We have had the best starting lineup in the league since we acquired Sheed. That's all Joe - he has put us in position to be great. He may not be the best drafter, but we all knew that.

The problem is our coach - Saunders cannot coach nor motivate. We overachieved with the two previous coaches, and have underachieved with Saunders. Now you can say it's Joe's fault for keeping Flip - and I agree. But let's not fire the guy that has been the key to Detroit's success for the last 20 years.

You have some very valid points. Expectations are high but at the same time, this team has/had the pieces in place to truley be something special. I give Joe a ton of credit for building up the Pistons into a great team but now he and the team appear to be slipping. If he isn't great at drafting, he should bring in someone who is to help out.

If a business owner does great job of building up his company but then later makes choices that cause it to crumble, was he ever successful? Joe D has helped up to two finals but our team is slipping. Several other teams in the East get stronger as we stay even or get worse. We currently have several gaping holes and this off-season will be very important. As of now, I see Detroit (with Billups) as the 3rd or 4th best team in the East and sliding. My anger towards Joe is the fact that he isn't doing enough to make the team better. In the end, time is always the best judge.

[Higherwarrior]

firing dumars is going WAY overboard. but i was disappointed with both picks after stuckey, who i REALLY like.

afflalo struggles to do the same thing rip can't do- beat people off the dribble and make his own shot. i have to hope he somehow improves that or he's a nice kid who works hard but can't give us what we need.

i'm only hoping he can surprise me like maxiell has.

[b-diddy]

To be honest, this thread kinda makes me ashamed to be a Pistons fan, since that's what most of you guys consider yourselves. The draft was definitely not as bad as you're all making it sound.

First, I think Stuckey can be a fine player for us if we use him the right way. The only thing Young has on Stuckey is three point shooting, and we all know we don't need that. We need someone who can put the ball on the floor and drive into traffic, and Stuckey CAN do that.

Afflalo DOES address what we needed in terms of a backup for Tay. He is a good defender and was UCLA's leading scorer. Personally, I'm very confident in what he can do backing up Tay. Plus, there is still the possibility of someone else coming in through a trade (dumping Flip Murray, Nazr).

The sky isn't falling, everyone. Relax. I know the natural reaction is to freak out when things don't exactly go our way. But look at last offseason. We lost Ben, who was "the heart and soul of our team," and most people predicted we'd finish in the bottom half of the East playoff teams. Instead, we had the best record and came within one freak LeBron performance from another Finals berth. It's clear enough to me that to doubt this team is not usually a good plan.

who was predicting we'd be in the bottom half of east playoff teams?

imo, the sky already has fallen. it did last summer, when we converted from a annual champion contender into the sac kings east. if we're just trying to avoid letting the bottom fall out, joe's doing a great job. if thats all you want, great. but no pouting when we get swept by the cavs, or the bulls next year.

[defrocked]

Holy crap. I came here wondering what the reaction to the draft was going to be and this is what we get? Seriously, guys. It was a nice draft for us, as we got solid guys who can contribute next year. Mejia isn't worth getting upset over as there wasn't anything else there I was dying to get.

I came away from the draft pretty happy with our haul. Afflalo wasn't what I was expecting, but I think he'll be a solid role player for years to come. Can't expect too much more with a late first.

[Glenn]

who was predicting we'd be in the bottom half of east playoff teams?

Your boy Hollinger for one. He said we'd lose 20 more games than the year before, Jinxy.

[JS]

I am sorry but to say Joe has done a above average job or that ownership has done whatever it takes to be an organization similar to SA is a joke. The past three years have been disgusting, sure the bottom hasn't fallen out but, my expectations are greater than that.

I don't believe that people's reps should live on by what they did 3 years ago if they haven't continued to do what made them great. Joe hasn't taken risks or done the things that brought this team back.

Time after time the team has made moves motivated by the luxary tax, sometimes two and three years out. You can't win now if you live three years from now. The Corliss trade was about paying the luxary tax in 05-06, not the following season, however the NBa raised the cap and the tax threshold for that season. Joe held on to Darko for no great reason but then sold him to Orlando to avoid the tax when we resigned Ben, but Ben didn't come back. Joe wouldn't take back Chandler in a sign and trade because of his salary but he would have been a far wiser investment compared to Nazr and Flip.

I refuse to give Joe a free pass when the motivation appears to be more business than sport, and the bottomline is the fans deserve more. The frustration is not just about the draft it is about the lack of direction. I don't care Mr. D is a billionaire who owns a team spending 75 million isn't going to put him in the red and cause him to be bankrupt before death.

I am sick of fans and Presidents telling me to be patient we are headed in the right direction after every questionable turn, yet mess after mess is the only result I see. I am supposed to be unwavering in my support, anything less is not being a true fan, questioning the lack of progress and direction is unacceptable.

[Glenn]

Great post JS, I couldn't agree more.

[metr0man]

nobody can convine me that Joe Dumars has been a good GM the past 3 years.

-Hiring Flip Saunders: Worst move he's ever made.
-The Darko trade was a bad deal, particularly since one of the motives was to clear cap room for...
-Ben Wallace leaving...
-No decent backup point, now for the 3rd straight year!
-still a weak bench
-signed Nazr who SUCKS ASS
-gave up Delfino for NOTHING.
-this draft.

Shitty move after shitty move. Drafting Maxiell was a pretty good pickup. CWebb was all luck that Philly dropped him.

I'd go so far as to say in the past 3 years, Joe Dumars has been a BAD GM.

[DrRay11]

I have not bitched too much about the draft--although I don't think Afflalo or Mejia will amount to much, hopefully Stuckey does. I'm just pissed that Joe has basically sat on his laurels the past few years while our team has wilted.