Best season ever for Izzo?

[Wizzle]

Izzo just used the oldest trick in th book, lower expectations as far as you can so that if/when something good happens, you look that much better for it. Don't fall for it.

OH MY GOD......so that's where Tre picked up that trick.......it's all starting to make so much sense now

[Zip Goshboots]

Vinny:
that's a good point. I hear that for next year Izzo is saying he'll be lucky the Sparties can beat a team consisting of a garbage can and four frogs.

[Hermy]

Roy Williams didn't recruit for 4 years at UNC as of last year. He lost a player or 2 or 5 early. He got a 3 seed. He finished 2nd in a great conference. UNC fan/program kept expectations high despite national disrespect.

Awful example. Izzo lost one guy, one year early.

[Baker]

Roy Williams didn't recruit for 4 years at UNC as of last year. He lost a player or 2 or 5 early. He got a 3 seed. He finished 2nd in a great conference. UNC fan/program kept expectations high despite national disrespect.

Awful example. Izzo lost one guy, one year early.

You showed how little you know with this post. Izzo lost Shannon Brown early to the NBA, lost Ager and Davis to the NBA (doesn't matter if they left after senior yr, still impacts team, lost Trannon to NFL prep, lost Rowley to moving on beyond bball. That is 5 guys and all of them played. 4 of them played significant minutes. Yet, you want them to come back and go to the final four this year. No wonder Michigan sucks at basketball, there fans don't even know the sport.

[Hermy]

You showed how little you know with this post. Izzo lost Shannon Brown early to the NBA, lost Ager and Davis to the NBA (doesn't matter if they left after senior yr, still impacts team, lost Trannon to NFL prep, lost Rowley to moving on beyond bball. That is 5 guys and all of them played. 4 of them played significant minutes. Yet, you want them to come back and go to the final four this year. No wonder Michigan sucks at basketball, there fans don't even know the sport.

I'm a state fan. I fly a spartan flag in my yard. I have spartan drapes in my garage. I wear spartan shit to the gym.

I don't want them to go to the final four. I want them to compete at an elite level. They aren't. I am disapponted in Izzo for not preparing knowing that at the very least Ager and Davis would be gone. Losing a Junior isn't exactly a crushing defeat to a roster either. I don't want him fired, or am even really mad at him, but I have the clarity to see this for what it is. Its a blemish, a hiccup, but one that could have been avoided if we were truely A1. Its not to be celebrated.

I'll still enjoy the year, my take was as much of a dig on UM fans and their overreaction to Carr's occational mediocrity as a condemnation of Tom, but you're still asinine to fly this superior coaching job banner when so much of his job as a director of the program is to make sure that precisily this doesn't happen.

[Baker]

I'm a state fan. I fly a spartan flag in my yard. I have spartan drapes in my garage. I wear spartan shit to the gym.

I don't want them to go to the final four. I want them to compete at an elite level. They aren't. I am disapponted in Izzo for not preparing knowing that at the very least Ager and Davis would be gone. Losing a Junior isn't exactly a crushing defeat to a roster either. I don't want him fired, or am even really mad at him, but I have the clarity to see this for what it is. Its a blemish, a hiccup, but one that could have been avoided if we were truely A1. Its not to be celebrated.

I'll still enjoy the year, my take was as much of a dig on UM fans and their overreaction to Carr's occational mediocrity as a condemnation of Tom, but you're still asinine to fly this superior coaching job banner when so much of his job as a director of the program is to make sure that precisily this doesn't happen.

If you are truly a State guy, you'd be happy that Izzo has MSU back in the Top 25 again with the #5 recruiting class in the country coming in next year.
Here is what you guys aren't getting though: Sure Izzo could have brought in a few good freshmen guards and had higher expectations this year, but he knew that the following crop of freshmen were much more talented. He planned his schollies so that he could bring in several more talented freshmen next year and more the following so that he could build a NC calibur team. Had he went your route, he would have missed out on somebody like Lucas/Summers/Allen because there wouldn't have been enough schollies.

[Glenn]

Do they make a Fathead that is just a huge pic of Tom Izzo's face?

[JackTalkThai]

I'm a state fan. I fly a spartan flag in my yard. I have spartan drapes in my garage. I wear spartan shit to the gym.

I don't want them to go to the final four. I want them to compete at an elite level. They aren't. I am disapponted in Izzo for not preparing knowing that at the very least Ager and Davis would be gone. Losing a Junior isn't exactly a crushing defeat to a roster either. I don't want him fired, or am even really mad at him, but I have the clarity to see this for what it is. Its a blemish, a hiccup, but one that could have been avoided if we were truely A1. Its not to be celebrated.

I'll still enjoy the year, my take was as much of a dig on UM fans and their overreaction to Carr's occational mediocrity as a condemnation of Tom, but you're still asinine to fly this superior coaching job banner when so much of his job as a director of the program is to make sure that precisily this doesn't happen.

Bullshit. The coach of a program only has so much control over who stays, who leaves, who verbals, who commits, etc...

Some things can be planned for, like Davis and Ager graduating (see the recruiting class of Herzog, Morgan and Dahlman) and some things can't exactly be planned for (see Brown leaving early or Devendorf backing out of his verbal or Cotton transferring or Rowley quitting basketball or Trannon deciding not to play hoops). You recruit these elite players when they're sophomores and juniors. When a sudden and unexpected need arises, contrary to your belief...a coach can't just up and go grab an elite recruit when he's a senior in high school.

Fact is, if Shannon Brown hadn't left a year early...MSU would be a top 15 program this year and you wouldn't be calling this year a hiccup or a blemish or whatever the fuck else you feel like calling it. But Brown did leave and FACT remains that Izzo is doing the absolute most with what he's got. His team is in the process of exceeding the expectations of every single preseason prognostication out there.

It has been an impressive display of pure coaching by anyone's definition.

[Jethro34]

Sure Izzo could have brought in a few good freshmen guards and had higher expectations this year, but he knew that the following crop of freshmen were much more talented. He planned his schollies so that he could bring in several more talented freshmen next year and more the following so that he could build a NC calibur team. Had he went your route, he would have missed out on somebody like Lucas/Summers/Allen because there wouldn't have been enough schollies.

Bullshit. The coach of a program only has so much control over who stays, who leaves, who verbals, who commits, etc...

Some things can be planned for, like Davis and Ager graduating (see the recruiting class of Herzog, Morgan and Dahlman) and some things can't exactly be planned for (see Brown leaving early or Devendorf backing out of his verbal or Cotton transferring or Rowley quitting basketball or Trannon deciding not to play hoops). You recruit these elite players when they're sophomores and juniors. When a sudden and unexpected need arises, contrary to your belief...a coach can't just up and go grab an elite recruit when he's a senior in high school.

Fact is, if Shannon Brown hadn't left a year early...MSU would be a top 15 program this year and you wouldn't be calling this year a hiccup or a blemish or whatever the fuck else you feel like calling it. But Brown did leave and FACT remains that Izzo is doing the absolute most with what he's got. His team is in the process of exceeding the expectations of every single preseason prognostication out there.

It has been an impressive display of pure coaching by anyone's definition.

Ok, I really must comment on a few things here, because like we always do, this conversation has become heavily skewed.
First Tre is talking about how Izzo planned his scholarships. First of all, Izzo could have done better the year before with his 2 schollies than to bring in Joseph and Walton. That was a horrible recruiting class and probably the biggest reason the team "has low expectations" this season. I don't care that it was only 2 scholarships, a guy like Izzo should be landing 4 star guys, anbd he got 2 three stars. That's a killer. Then, this past year he got 3 recruits. 2 are 4 stars but you're only expecting anything out of one of them, and then another 3 star. So that's a two-year run of recruits that could have been much better. The fact that YOU don't expect much of anyone other than Morgan (and the pleasant surprise of Walton and Joseph - it's THEIR contribution that probably sparked this thread in reality)

Now Jack. You talk of what can or cannot be planned for. First of all, this is college basketball. When your coach is so well known for making players better, you SHOULD be planning for any 5 star recruit to leave after 3 years. So they were lucky they even had Davis last year, and should have been expecting Brown to leave exactly when he did. Rowley and Trannon both should have been seniors last season so you should not be bitter about not having them. And how long has it been since Cotton transferred? Dude, there's dust on that argument. Devendorf backing out. Wow. Ok, so you have to give Michigan credit for any production that Crawford and Horford have made now, right? I'll tell you what Izzo didn't plan for. He didn't plan that Marquise would go from 5 star HS player to 2 star college player in two short years. But ultimately, who should have seen that coming and known from heavy recruiting and watching that it would have. Izzo. So that can be tied directly to expectations for this season. He's got a guy that could have been a 5 star stud playing his junior year right now. That's something to build upon, but it's something he doesn't have. So 2 substandard recruiting classes when 5 scholarships were in fact given out, combined with a 5 star who wasn't, are the reason there are few expectations. But should there be? Could there be? Absolutely. You can talk all you want about down years for elite programs, but at the end of the day those programs never have to climb their way barely into the top 25 in week 5 of the season.

[Baker]

Let us review:

• You posed a question about MSU basketball.
• You provided your answer for said question.
• I provided a response that differed from your answer.
• You had a tantrum and started calling me names.

I never said there couldn't be lowered expectations for a basketball program, I never said it wasn't acceptable, I said that in such a season, you couldn't then consider it the coaches "Best Season Ever" because it's not. You really need to consider going to an MSU only board because it's becoming increasingly obvious that you don't want to listen to anyone who disagrees with you.

Same exact thing can be said about every single UM fan here on WTF. I shared my opinion that I felt Florida deserved to be in the title game and I was absolutely attacked in several threads. So don't give me this garbage about going to a MSU only board.

If you would have said you dont' think its his best and given reasons, I would have took part in the discussion. But, you called this season a failed season and played the old Michigan fan trick of putting ridiculous expectations on MSU so you can blast them later.