Israel vs. Hezbollah

[Taymelo]

Caveat: As usual, lets try to be civil.

I didn't want to do this in the thread about thoughts and prayers, so I started a new thread to discuss the issue.

I'll start this important political discussion... with a joke, of course.

The IDF said Monday it had seized two Hezbollah guerrillas "suspected in involvement in terror activities" in Maroun al-Ras. The guerrillas were taken into custody Sunday and are being held in Israel.

Am I the only one who read that, and envisioned the Israelis holding a press conference, and demanding the return of 9,000 Israelis in a "prisoner swap" for these two Hezbollah fighers, with a straight face, saying "its been done before, so why not this time"?

Or "we were wrong to capture them, and we admit it, but now that we have them, Hezbollah should negotiate with us and give us a bunch of free shit - prisoners, beer, bitches, and money!"

[Anthony]

At least 384 people have been killed in Lebanon, including 20 soldiers and 11 Hezbollah fighters, according to security officials.

Great ratio. Excellent.

Source


Hezbollah has to go, but not at the expense of the country, and the people.

[JS]

What people in power fail to realize is Hezbollah is only one third of the problem. The other two thirds have yet to chime in but that is intentional. The others being Hamas and the PLO. Hamas has tried to legitmize itself, and garner new support for it's millant/millitary wing known as Izz ad-Din al-Qassam, but their terrorist operations and strikes do very little to make them sympathetic figures and help the organization grow, so they need to wait until they can come off as heroes or at least justified in their actions. If the Muslim world appears under attack, new support will arrive and their is a legit cause to rally behind.

Israel's defiance and aggression will serve to be that justification, thus adding to the never ending violence. Every innocent life that is taken becomes the building blocks for the future generation of war and terrorism. Ever child that loses a family member or friend will grow up with hatred and revenge in their hearts and minds, and those emotions will be nutured by terrorist groups looking to cleanse the Muslim world of Zionist and Western influence.

The worst thing that could happen to the region is that Hamas, Hezbollah or the PLO be justified. Hamas has spent the last decade preparing for this day, and soon their day will arrive and the seeds that have been planted will grow into a third full scale war of the world.

Mossad has grown too big and too powerful and is now running Israel because we let it happen, we let them go unchecked just like the terrorists in the region. With any other group will would have intervened but it wouldn't have been PC to get involved it would have come off as anit-Israel, when that couldn't be futher from the truth. Mossad is attacking Hezbollah in Lebanon because they like being the big bad bully who carries a big stick, it has nothing to do with trying to rid the world of Hezbollah. Hezbollah is a far bigger threat in Syria and Iran, but Israel (Mossad)doesn't want to fight a battle they cannot win.

[Taymelo]

Its too bad when any innocent civilian dies. However, it is unavoidable in military operations to root out islamic terrorists living within civilian areas.

Having said that, I don't believe for one second the stats about Hezbollah fighers vs. civilian deaths.

Hezbollah fighters don't wear uniforms, and hide within the civilian population. Moreover, when there is an Israeli bombing, many of the people counting the dead are themselves tied to Hezbollah, which has an agenda to manipulate the numbers for international support, and credibility as "players" in the middle east.

In other words, its a propaganda campaign by Hezbollah against Israel.

In their quest to recruit local pissed off middle eastern teenagers to be future radical islamist terrorists, they claim that Hezbollah has an army that can kill Israeli soldiers, that they are too smart for Israeli soldiers to find and kill them, and that Israel is only hitting poor innocent civilians, which doesn't bother them, because they hate arabs anyway.

I don't buy it.

[JS]

Tay I agree Hezbollah is a threat that are far from victims. Hezbollah are propganda based zealots just any other right wing fundamentalist groups but their are better ways to deal with this situation then the way Israel chose. This situation has a lot bigger implications on the US and the World then what most would like to believe. Further violence no matter the justification that is used to send a missle will only further destablize the region.

[Taymelo]

J:

I agree that each bomb likely creates another terrorist, as does each US bomb/bullet in Iraq. I would distinguish between the two conflicts, however, by pointing out that Iraq was neither an immediate nor future threat to the US, while on the other hand Hezbollah not only fired on and engaged Israel, but also constitutes a real, daily threat to the future of Israel.

Unfortunately, civilians die in war. Unlike USA v. Iraq II, Israel is literally at war with its next door neighbors for its own survival.

So Israel has to kill civilians and unfortunately take a public relations hit with innocent lebanese people and their ancestors, like Anthony.

Every action has a reaction. You kill a terrorist, and hit a civilian, and make their son a terrorist.

I understand that... but you can't just sit there and allow your country to be invaded, so radical islamists can bath in your children's blood and push 100% of your people into the sea - - - can you???

I wouldn't.

Would you?

[Anthony]

I'm sure I know the answer, but heres the question:

Instead of dropping bombs on the country over two kidnapped solders, cant Israel go to the UN and US and whoever else back them and get them to help the Lebanese gov. to disarm Hezbollah? The Lebanon government cant do it them self, because then their messing with Iran as well.

[JS]

I'm sure I know the answer, but heres the question:

Instead of dropping bombs on the country over two kidnapped solders, cant Israel go to the UN and US and whoever else back them and get them to help the Lebanese gov. to disarm Hezbollah? The Lebanon government cant do it them self, because then their messing with Iran as well.

It's a lot like us and Iraq, if you want to fight you can find a way to start one.

[Uncle Mxy]

Note that it's the military wing of Hezbollah that is at issue.

Like Hamas, much of Hezbollah isn't involved with aggressive behaviors toward Israel. They run civilian hospitals, schools that don't necessarily train people to be future terrorists, get food to needy people, etc. They may not care for the state of Israel at all, but they're not the ones doing the attacking.

[geerussell]

Its too bad when any innocent civilian dies. However, it is unavoidable in military operations to root out islamic terrorists living within civilian areas.

It's not unavoidable, it just reflects the reality that foreign lives, while not worthless, are definitely worth less no matter how innocent they are. If those same islamic terrorists were hiding Tel Aviv I guarantee you airstrikes wouldn't be option one. They'd risk as many of their own as it took to do everything possible to avoid even a single civilian death.