Fire GM Joe Dumars

[Laxation]

So this Okafor guy everyone's talking about...

What makes him so fucking special that Dumars should be fired for not getting him? Career 14+10 guy isn't THAT great.

[yargs]

So this Okafor guy everyone's talking about...

What makes him so fucking special that Dumars should be fired for not getting him? Career 14+10 guy isn't THAT great.

A special thanks to laxation for getting it. Troy Murphy averaged more points and rebounds than okafor last year. He's a nice player but is severly over-rated especially by folks on this board.

Tyson Chandler when healthy is a better player than okafor (or I should say a much more dominant rebounder and help defender). Neither are very good offensively but honestly I'd much rather have Chandler's athleticism. The hornets are stuck with a pretty good power forward masquerading as a center. Good luck to them.

[micknugget]

The trade is predicated on Chandler passing the physical (which he couldn't pass at OKC or Phoenix) or Charlotte waives it. If he's really that injured, I woudl think that the trade won't go thru.

[Glenn]

I guess we can at least hope for that.

Also,I see that we've reached the part of the discussion where we disparage the guy we didn't get.

[micknugget]

I still want Okafor. I still want Joe D fired. If you make some good moves and then keep making bad moves, at what do you hold him accountable? Joe has been a below average GM the past three or four season now. Where does it end?

[DrRay11]

wahhhh, wahhhhhh.

What was it, six or seven straight ECF's?

Every team needs to rebuild, idiots.

[micknugget]

wahhhh, wahhhhhh.

What was it, six or seven straight ECF's?

Every team needs to rebuild, idiots.

That's cool. I guess your definition of repeated questionable or bad moves is "rebuilding". It's ok if you are perfectly happy with Joe D. and call those of us who want the team to be better whiners. Just don't bitch about one single move that Joe makes since you think he is such a great GM. You wouldn't want to become one of us "idiots"!

[Zekyl]

3 or 4 years? Let's take a look then.

Good:
First and foremost, if you're making repeated poor decisions, you don't get to the ECF 3 of the 4 years in question.

Drafted Max - not a bad move. Yes, a few guys after him turned out better, but quite a few before him turned out much worse. In the mid-20s we got a solid bench/energy guy.

Traded Darko and Arroyo for 1st and Cato (expiring) - Good move.

Signed Webber - Webber wasn't what he used to be, and you can complain about that all you want, but we signed the guy for pretty much nothing and he filled a need. That was a good signing.

Drafted Stuckey and Afflalo - Both good picks. Afflalo isn't here anymore, but he was a solid draft pick for where we got him.

Resigned Dice - Good move, his contract was a great deal for the Pistons

Let Ben walk - Great move

Signed Flip Murray - I wasn't a fan, but for the price he was a good signing.

Traded Nazr - Good move. I don't even care what we got in return, it's off the books. Good move (doesn't make up for the bad move of signing him)

Signed Ratliff - cheap signing, good move

Signed Kwame - I was skeptical, but he's been a solid backup. Not a bad move.

Bad:
Signed Nazr - Bad move, no question.

Hiring Curry - Terrible move.

Firing Curry - Great move

Draft Walter Sharpe - Zzzzzzz

Failed to replace Ben - This is our big issue right now

Failed to get Tay a quality backup - We complained about this every offseason

Wait-and-See:
Max's extension - may turn out to be a bad move (most likely, but I'll give him a chance to prove himself this season).

Rip's extension - may turn out to be a bad move, but that's another wait and see. No one seemed to think it was when we gave it to him.

Trading Billups for AI - wasn't a terrible move because of the space it gave us. Yes, it was one terrible season, but it potentially got us off the hook for more bad seasons to come.

CV signing, Ben Gordon signing, Wilcox signing, 2009 draft - We can't judge any of these yet.


He's obviously made some bad moves in there, there's no questioning that, but if we did this for all GMs in the league, he'd be above average. Is he the best? Heck no. Is he bad? Not in my opinion.


Feel free to add in anything I missed in there.

[micknugget]

That's a well thought out list. I would like to add or disagree on a few things though.

Maxiell was not a good draft pick. Based on needs and players available it was a very questionable pick.

The Billups trade was bad. We could have and should have gotten more for him. We didn't really have a spot of AI and it caused a bunch of turmoil. We also lost Dice for a good part of the season and could have lost him permananetly.

Not firing Flip a year earlier was a bad or questionable move. He had already lost the team and it was pretty apparent. Especially as other good coaches became available. I would have loved to have gotten Adelman(sp?)

Keuster is a questionable hire but time will tell as to it being goood or bad.

Not re-signing Dice was a bad move. We really need his interior D and rebounding.

Dumping Afflalo for a weak 2nd. Bad move making a weak defensive team even weaker.

Kwame was not a good signing. It was questionable at best. The fact that most of us were hoping that he would opt out proves my point.

Add to this a bad or at the very least questionable off-season by missing out on deals, overspending, and leaving the team with no to little defense and a gaping hole at Center. If Rip stays, how long before there are gripes and conflicts on who should start or play more. We can already see a potential problem there and the season hasn't even started.

Can you repeated poor decisions, yet still get to the ECF 3 of the 4 years in question? Yes because Joe made some great moves to put together a very good core. I never said that Joe wasn't a great GM at the beginning. He was one of if not the best. It is the past few seasons where is decision have become worse or more questionable. At what point does it get bad enough to make a change? How many free passes do you give him based on past performance? That is the question.

[Fool]

I feel bad that Z had to go to the trouble. You guys are pussies.