2008 campaign for the Prez

[Uncle Mxy]

Tell us about your brother Mxy. Was he an older brother? Did he beat you up a lot as a child? Does your love of politics stem from the fact that you feel they can protect you from brotherly abuse? Would you vote for McCain because he's a war veteran that can kick your brother's ass?

No, not an older brother.

No, he couldn't beat me up while we were growing up.

No, but it's a leading question. I happen to "love" politics this year, in a trainwreck reality TV kinda way, but that's not generally true. The last time I really "loved" politics was 1992, when Perot was running. I've been uppity since 2004 because of Bush suckage, but this year has been different for me.

No, but it's another leading question. I doubt that even a prime 5'7" 130 lb. pre-torture John McCain could kick my brother's ass -- not in a fistfight. And I didn't mention whether or not my brother was a war veteran, did I?

[Tahoe]

That's the great thing about living in a republic - we don't actually need our elected officials to be geniuses or saints. Truthfully as long as the Constitution is held in high regard, it doesn't matter much who leads us. It's not entirely idiot-proof, but it's close.

That's why the single most important characteristic of who I want my elected officials to be is: do they respect the Constitution in practice? This is the single question that makes me extremely reluctant to support any Republican who has been a Senator or Congressman over the last 8 years. The President has been asking everyone to ignore the Constitution's restrictions on the power of the Presidency, and his party's legislators have enthusiastically jumped on board. They do not respect the Constitution. They would rather have a system where decisive power is concentrated in the hands of a single person. History has been down this path before, and it leads to incoherent chaos.

If you want to say our EXECTUTIVE, Senate and House are full of lazy, rich, elitist, self-serving douches, I don't know what to tell you other than "you may be right." But as unpleasant as those people may be, the powers of the Congress MUST be respected no matter what you think of the people who run the place. They are the institution of democracy at work, and they serve to exercise the real wishes of the citizens of the states and districts that elected them, on a scale that a President can only pretend to do.

[Tahoe]

I don't think your opinion is fucked up, Tahoe. I think it's valuable, even when I don't always get where you're coming from. You brought up the health plan thing, so I'd like to hear more.


On some issues, I'd agree with you. Provide:
1) a specific actual issue (e.g. his health plan, not "does he ask for orange juice or coffee with his breakfast")
2) how Obama specifically got it wrong, and
3) what specifically the right answer is


Because you're the one saying "This is the best we have to choose from?" (or in Evil Tahoe-speak "This is the fuckin best we fuckin have to fuckin choose from?!") Oooh colors!

Provide a real human being's name that's better than the ones we have to choose from, and some idea of why you think they'd be better. Let's see if people agree with your choice, or have better choices. The only reason I specified known people was to make things interesting. If I told you that my brother would make a good president, that'd be a real short conversation since no one here knows anything about my brother.

Well I"m not gonna name anybody. Its my thread, I make the rules. Its my opinion that there are 100,000 better peeps out there than these 3 (I'm not going to name them). But because of this fucked up process that has evolved in our picking a prez, they won't be drafter or will not apply because of it. 99,999 of them we prolly don't know. If you don't get where I'm coming from, so be it. But this isn't about a debate about a single person I name.

I say BO is green. So thats the fucking way it is. I form my opinion way different than you. So I'm not doing things your way. Like I said, its an opinion formed over time, reading, listening, concluding.

[Tahoe]

I don't think your opinion is fucked up, Tahoe. I think it's valuable, even when I don't always get where you're coming from. You brought up the health plan thing, so I'd like to hear more.


On some issues, I'd agree with you. Provide:
1) a specific actual issue (e.g. his health plan, not "does he ask for orange juice or coffee with his breakfast")
2) how Obama specifically got it wrong, and
3) what specifically the right answer is


Because you're the one saying "This is the best we have to choose from?" (or in Evil Tahoe-speak "This is the fuckin best we fuckin have to fuckin choose from?!") Oooh colors!

Provide a real human being's name that's better than the ones we have to choose from, and some idea of why you think they'd be better. Let's see if people agree with your choice, or have better choices. The only reason I specified known people was to make things interesting. If I told you that my brother would make a good president, that'd be a real short conversation since no one here knows anything about my brother.

Well I"m not gonna name anybody. Its my thread, I make the rules. Its my opinion that there are 100,000 better peeps out there than these 3 (I'm not going to name them). But because of this fucked up process that has evolved in our picking a prez, they won't be drafter or will not apply because of it. 99,999 of them we prolly don't know. If you don't get where I'm coming from, so be it. But this isn't about a debate about a single person I name.

I say BO is green. So thats the fucking way it is. I form my opinion way different than you. So I'm not doing things your way. Like I said, its an opinion formed over time, reading, listening, concluding.

[geerussell]

T The President has been asking everyone to ignore the Constitution's restrictions on the power of the Presidency, and his party's legislators have enthusiastically jumped on board. They do not respect the Constitution. They would rather have a system where decisive power is concentrated in the hands of a single person. History has been down this path before, and it leads to incoherent chaos.

Wartime always provides a pretext to gather power under the executive. In the post-9/11 world we have war without end. With anyone. Or no one.

In the past, the draft and the budget served as natural checks which have been negated by a professional military and a national credit card. Now we can have a wartime president every term for a generation.

The two ongoing occupations are going to take at least another term or two to play out and the nebulous "war on terror" will have legs for at least as long as the war on drugs and the war on poverty. With similar results.

[Tahoe]

And BO not knowing the detail is not alone. I didn't mean to single his green ass out. HIll and JM don't know either.

Clinton knew his shit. He knew details. Before him Nixon knew his shit too. I don't remember that much about Johnson but from what I do he was pretty good too. Some of my Johnson recollection is from tape.

Carter, Reagan, Bush, Bush forget about it.

[Tahoe]

Wartime always provides a pretext to gather power under the executive. In the post-9/11 world we have war without end. With anyone. Or no one.

In the past, the draft and the budget served as natural checks which have been negated by a professional military and a national credit card. Now we can have a wartime president every term for a generation.

The two ongoing occupations are going to take at least another term or two to play out and the nebulous "war on terror" will have legs for at least as long as the war on drugs and the war on poverty. With similar results.

So you're saying your not going to vote for McCain?

[Glenn]

This EvilTahoe fellow is kind of scary.

[Tahoe]

This EvilTahoe fellow is kind of scary.

You better watch it or I'll get a bunch of my nutjob rightwing peeps to join this site and take over the poli forum. You libs would be running for the hills.

[geerussell]

So you're saying your not going to vote for McCain?

I'm saying that neither McCain, Clinton or Obama is going to undo the executive power grab of the last eight years.

Congress will restore its power when it is in a position to take it and they've got nothing to counter the "wartime" trump card.