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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermy
If you're calling miami heat a defensive-minded team, I have nothing left to say to you. That may be the dumbest thing I've head in months.
There's no point in arguing with someone that would say something that fucking dumb. Outside of Mourning, not one guy on that team played above-average defense.
Kstats right Riley has never pushed defense.
But overall detroit and the heat defended fairly well. 88 points a game isnt getting lit up every night. and miami holding team to 42 percent doesnt come across as bad defense to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kstat
http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstra...Riley%2c%20PatQuote:
Originally Posted by the wrath of diddy
Quote:
Originally Posted by the wrath of diddy
Great point Diddy. They were 2nd overall in the playoffs in D, but he has preconceived notions and undefendable takes, so we'll let him be. I feel guilty, like I'm arguing with The Kid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gutz Gatsu
Point is, that's as good as any team can possibly play.
The problem is, ben dragged the offense down to a point that we couldnt even score 88. Starting with the Cavs, teams sagged their center all over the court, playing a box-and-1 zone, doubling whoever had the ball.
If he could even hit a FT, this wouldnt be a discussion. Guys like Diop, Dampier and Vaerejo can exist because if you leave them under the rim, they will draw a foul and make FTs.
Ben's a total liability. You can literally leave him under the rim wide open, and his small-ass hands take him 5 seconds to go up to dunk the ball, giving the other team time to hack him, which 4 out of 5 times is the same thing as a turnover.
Fuck, even Diop never gets hacked intentionally, and he's borderline-retarded. A player with no offensive skills who shoots %15 from the FT line is such an easy target, nobody bothers defending him nowdays.
You're right, we scored 91.:rolleyes: [smilie=running.gif] Are we done with the spins?Quote:
The problem is, ben dragged the offense down to a point that we couldnt even score 88.
that sounds like someone who has it in for Ben. Which has been your stance for awhile.Quote:
Ben's a total liability. You can literally leave him under the rim wide open, and his small-ass hands take him 5 seconds to go up to dunk the ball, giving the other team time to hack him, which 4 out of 5 times is the same thing as a turnover.
No, I have it in for a player that can't even make FTs at Shaq's level, and acts offended when he's offered 12 million.
But you're okay with a billionaire getting bitchy about paying a guy another $1-2 million a year.
Thats irrelevent to you on many ocasions hating on ben wallace for most of the season. This just seems like the perfect scenario to vent how much you have a grudge against wallace w/o getting backlashed(so you hoped anyways)[smilie=paca.gif]Quote:
Originally Posted by Kstat
our offense was fine all year, and then game 3 in cleveland happened. that was when we turned off the gas and started playing at half speed. i guess you could somehow blame that entirely on ben, but i dont see how.
He's just jealous of Ben. Kstat made 50% of his FT's in middle school and is angry that Ben's gets paid millions to do worse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gutz Gatsu
Bill Davidson's profit margin's are going up and Kstat is ecstatic.
Like I give a fuck about backlash.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gutz Gatsu
And no, it isn't irrelevant, because Ben is the ONLY player in the NBA besides shaq that gets fouled intentionally (with great success I might add) late in the game, and he makes shaq look like rick barry. That separates him from every other no-offense center in the league, because at least THEY are dangerous when they're standing wide open underneath the rim.
Ben's far too easy to exploit on the offensive end. It's becoming a bigger problem NOW, because the NBA is gearing everythign more and more towards offense.
FUCK!!!!
FUCKQ!!!!!!!
You must have cared if you're trying to hide that you already had it in for Ben from the jump. And yes your bitching about Wallace salary has less to do with wallace being greedy and more to do with you hate ben wallace for his offense. You said yourself that you you've never held value to defense since way back when you played school bball.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kstat
You're giving up some very narrow vision Kstat. I mean do you think Ben's defense has no signicicant high money value to our offense and our team? Heres a better question, is it replaceable?[smilie=reporter.gi:
well, fuck. i dont even know what to say. i dont want to see lets blow the fucker up... but lets blow this fucker up. sheed needs to go. rip, billups, hell even prince is possible.
next year's draft is great. we have to tank.
next year's FA class is great. we have to clear salary.
thats where we're at now.
Too bad we'll have no cap space.
It's quite possible to clear salary, if we're willing to dump good players for expirings and mid-2007 picks.
We already have the Orlando pick coming, so it's in our best interests to help another East team move past them.
Sheed + Dice to NY for Frye, Nate (or Collins) + Jalen works under the cap.
We also don't wanna deal with Billups next off-season so dealing him is probably a smart thing to do.
Mihm + McKie and the Lakers 2007 first works for Billups straight up.
2006-07 Roster:
Przybilla (full MLE - unfortunately this looks like it's happening)
Frye
Prince
Rip
Nate (LMMFAO)
Mihm
Maxiell
Jalen
Delfino
Hunter
Davis
Amir
Acker
Blalock
McKie (could be waived if we felt the need)
Expiring deals: Jalen, Mihm, McKie, Davis
Free Agents we might want to keep: Amir, Acker, Blalock (possibly)
2007 Draft picks: First Rounders: Orlando, LA Lakers, our own
Team Salary: $33,064,901*
* that's without counting Amir, Acker, Blalock and our 3 firsts.
Holding the rights to Amir, Acker and Blalock is extremely cheap and the picks would cost us less than $5,000,000.
At the most we'd have $40,000,000 in committed salary.
The expected salary cap? $54,000,000+
So, we'd have Max cap space to add to this group:
C: Przybilla
F: Frye/Maxiell
F: Prince
G: Hamilton/Delfino
G: Nate/Hunter
The picks could make a huge difference to that team, too.
With 3 picks we could draft a PG, SF and a C.
In free agency we could either save the money so we can extend our young guys down the road or spend it on an impact player.
BTW, I did this scenario in about 5 minutes, so don't go hating on me for the complete and utter destruction of the team.
thats a pretty good scenario, and along the lines of what im thinking.
i'd even move rip.
the next shaq is going to be going #1 next year. and all the top guys could be superstars.
Let's just trade the entire team and forefit 2007! AWESOME STRATEGY! Purposely losing games ALWAYS works!
2007 Pistons: Let's go in the tank!
Demolishing the team for draft picks never ever works. Period.
BTW, Nothing Oden does is anything like Shaq. He plays a lot like David RObinson, but nothing like Shaq.
Yeah, I don't get the tanking strategies at all. We're still going to be a very good team, maybe still elite, depending on what Joe can salvage from this offseason.
You really need to learn how to read Kstat:
b-diddy mentioned te great 2007 Draft and the 2007 free agent class.
WOD then correctly noted we had no cap space.
I then posted a scenario where we not only had cap space, but 3 first round picks and a team full of young talent.
And you consider a team with Prince, Rip, Frye, Nate, Delfino, Maxiell, Amir, Jalen, Mihm, Davis, Przybilla and Hunter = "forefiting the season"?
I'd call it rebuilding, but whatever.
Maybe we should just be content to be a middle of the road team? Is that what you want?
b-diddy: I didn't move Rip because he's a bargain IMO
And Kilo: I believe New York would make the playoffs with Sheed and Dice on the roster, and I think the Lakers will be in the playoffs as well.
So the pick from LA would likely be in the teens.
Orlando's would be Top 15 or Top 20 (depending on what you think)
And our own pick would be Top 15 (possibly top 10)
3 Top 20 picks in the 2007 Draft? Sweet!
And GD - learn to read.
If people are talking about rebuilding obviously I'm gonna come up with something.
Did I say I wanna tank? No!
I wouldn't mind a rebuilding job, but I don't wanna tank the season.
There is a big difference IMO.
[smilie=sad3.gif]Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt
We agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kstat
Sincerely,
Greg Popovich
David Robinson
Tim Duncan
In most cases, I don't think there is much difference. If the Pistons take on that roster you mentioned with Mihm, they go from still having a chance at winning the central to the 3rd or 4th best team in the Central. Some would call a 42-43 win team a forfeit and some call it "rebuilding", but either way, it's not a team that's going to have much success today.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pharaoh
The entire scenario was done because people were discussing IF we should consider it.
I posted it for consideration, not as my off-season plan.
BTW, when I think of tanking I think of what Portland did last season and what the Spurs did to get Duncan. They allowed players to sit out, even when healthy. They played young guys in an effort to lose games.
When I think of rebuilding I think of trading for expiring contracts and young talent/picks and letting them play their asses off. All out, all the time. See what they can do.
A slight difference? Yes, IMO. We're not making veterans sit or telling them "don't try". We're getting young guys and saying "Let's make some noise"
That's my take on it. Maybe you guys see it differently, but that's cool.