I think everyone gets and equal cut of the lux tax money. I thought the new CBA ended rewarding teams who didn't spend.
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I think everyone gets and equal cut of the lux tax money. I thought the new CBA ended rewarding teams who didn't spend.
Yes. I have checked.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pharaoh
Teams under the tax get a 30th share based on number of teams in the league. The remainder is spent at the league's discretion and any portion allocated to be disbursed gets distributed equally amongst all teams.
If it wasn't 3:30 AM, I would look up the approx. tax paid, subtract the 1/30th shares and then divide the remainder equally amongst the 30 teams, assuming the league doesn't need it to keep the WNBA afloat or finance fake fans at NBDL games, and voila, we would know exactly how much of the tax the Pistons could pay and would be reimbursed.
Bottom line, there is a cost to being over the LT. It's losing out on that 30th share. But the dollar for dollar stuff is malarky unless the Pistons tax exceeds the payout.
I believe you are correct J. I remember something like being mentioned at the time, but its been so long since the CBA was discussed I'm a little rusty.
True!Quote:
Originally Posted by JS
You could even trade Ben to Chicago for a future second round pick and get a trade exception the size of his salary.
The TE doesn't get us more cap space, because without Ben we're over the cap anyway.
But it does give us another exception to somehow find another player, without using the MLE or BAE.
microwave: Good job.
And you're 100% right.
If we're getting back $3,000,000 in tax from the league, but only paying $1,000,000 then shouldn't the owner be happy?
That's the key for me - I wish you could do the math right now.
If possible could you do it tomorrow?
We'll see when I wake up, I'm already committed to a couple other projects.
It is an interesting project for sure.
Cool - it's not urgent, so whenever you get to it.
That should be a rather interesting find.
Certainly could make Billy D looks bad/worse, depending on what you think of him at the moment.
http://www.suntimes.com/output/bulls...pt-bull01.html
Source: Bulls targeting Wallace as top priority
thats Chandlers contract btw
Tyson Chandler
8,448,845
8,448,845
9,335,974
10,223,102
11,110,231
11,997,360
12,884,488
BYC until 7/1/06 / Counts as $4,801,102 for trade purposes (BYC player) / Signed 9/1/05 for an assumed $64,000,000 for 6 years / Reportedly has incentives not included here
I really worry about a Chandler for Wallace sign and trade.
Chandler is the anti-Wallace. Never had to do anything, silver platter, silver spoon, never even had to bother going to college, lottery pick, big money without producing, back problems, seems slow and lazy out there, drafted several years ago and STILL hasn't lived up even close to potential, always has an excuse, doesn't seem to want to get better, seems content, everyone is STILL waiting for him to break out, and acting like its a given and it will only take time (Joe Smith, anyone?), etc.
Ben - 4 years in a small college w/o fanfare, undrafted, went overseas, bounced around, had to earn a contract, no one gave him shit, fought his way into the league and improved year by year, looks like he would die rather than give up a rebound.
Big difference.
In fact, just think about the head to heads with these two teams, and how shitty Chandler looks compared to Ben out there.
Keep in mind that in the 2005 season, no one knew what the CBA would be like Dumars made the mistake of thinking the current CBA would be worse than the old, and made moves based on that premise.
I guarantee you that at least 75% of the reason they want him is to fuck us over.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Asberry
if you were the bulls you would too. Not to mention his value on defense increases their decent defense to an elite championship level defense possibly.Quote:
Originally Posted by FP22
dude Chandler is garbage. a better version of mikki moore. though being a better version of someone who sucks isnt always a good thing. he can rebound with his length, but can't box out well. He couldnt even crack the starting lineup in chicago with sweetney and some former heat bench player ahead of him. Trading someone who can't score much but plays great game changing defense for someone who can't score much, play defense, or box out(but can block shots) isn't a happy deal to me.
Yes players you dont hate as much, yet hate them nonetheless are a great pickup. [smilie=blaha.gif]Quote:
I don't hate Chandler nearly as much as some seemingly do here. I think a change of scenery could be a good thing for the kid, along with the fact that he'd be playing on a veteran team for the first time in his career.
Ummm you must've ran out of decent bullshit to sell this. [smilie=rofl.gif] Who gives 1/10 of a shit about that? all this means is they'll all smoke weed together.Quote:
Also didn't he play highschool ball with Tay Prince?? (Along with Acker, we'd have three Compton boys on our roster).
Hate to break this to ya, but we're screwed either way. chandler isnt even a starter IMO. And Starting Mcdyees is a serious gamble. I'd just as soon rather take someone like Gordon, Nocioni, and/or deng and trade them for a big of starter quality.Quote:
I think we could still be an upper echelon team with Chandler coming our way, but if Ben walks for nothing, I think we're screwed.
well, bringing in chandler probably means that sheed would be next on the chopping block. maybe pharoah's idea of sheed for rose and frye.
i know i was adamant about moving sheed, but this whole offseason looks like its going to be very depressing to me.
trading sheed=officially rebuilding. get ready for two more seasons of the heat winning titles with an old fat geezer shaq and dwayne wade, with no one but chicago and cleveland to challenge them.Quote:
Originally Posted by b-diddy
of course i doubt that we lose sheed or ben wallace. if the bulls only offer 15 million, i think we probally match it. its 17-20 million that takes us out of the running.
I agree with Pharaoh
Pharaoh is right about everything.
Thank you for saving me some brain power and key strokes.
Ben goes - we're fucked. Simple as that. I dont even know where Kstat is coming from. 12mill is perfect. The only NBA plyer that couldnt score the ball and made more money was Rodman. And as good as Ben is, Rodman was better. STFU sign the contract and play. All along you've been saying its not abou the money, but who gives you a chance to win. Heres your $12 mill, go block a shot.
i thought the max base salary ben could get was 14?
I really hope Ben fucking leaves, he pisses me off.
Even if Ben goes, I could see Pryzbilla as being a pretty decent substitute. If we get another good big man in a S & T in Ben we might actually come out about even.
thats some serious hope. we could maybe increase the depth. but that doesnt equate to coming out even, except against shaq. But otherwise pryzbilla is pretty flat footed. I'd prefer someone more athletic and not skinny as a toothpick like chandler is.Quote:
Originally Posted by micknugget
The problem with Przybilla is that he's constantly injured. Look at his games played over his career. It's pretty ugly.
$16.8 million for a 10 year veteran.Quote:
Originally Posted by b-diddy
As much as Chandler bashing seems the in thing to do, I won't. With fear of copy right infringement, until Chandler got hurt in the playoffs he really came into a new level of play, like he got it. Secondly the number to remember is 23, Chandler is 23 not 32, if we wrote off every guy who hasn't hit his stride by 23 well Ben would have never been on the Pistons. Also unless you think Eddie Curry counts, Chandler never played with a decent front court SF and PF. I think putting Chandler out there to board and play defense and asking him to put up Ben numbers is not impossible. No question you can't replace the intangibles of Ben but I think you can fill his numbers void. Plus the likleyhood of a Noiconi be included in a deal is high. Assuming Delfino is ready to set up, Nocioni, Delfino and Dice and having the MLE and BAE to add a PG or C is far more appealing than losing Ben for nothing and having to get depth with the MLE and BAE.
Chandler & Noc for Ben?
Sign me up!
If we can get Deng or Nocioni in return for taking chandler off their hands, i'd do it in a heartbeat.
chicago rolled the red carpet out for ben. that's what i heard tonight...
i think in some ways he would be smart to go there. he would help them and they also have a bunch of young talent. so they could legitimately be a contender with another move or so.
plus he would get paid bigtime...
as for us, if ben leaves and we can't do a sign and trade, we only have the MLE and veteran's minimum to use. so it's not like we'll have cap room to pursue whatever other crappy FAs we might want to fill ben's shoes.
so yeah, we sort of our screwed if ben leaves. but then again, would we win a title if he came back? that's very questionable too.
so perhaps his loss might spark another trade or 2 which would give us a better chance down the line. who knows.
it just sucks so bad we don't have darko now. not that he could be our savior or anything close. but he has phenomenal talent and instead of possibly replacing ben, he'll be emerging as a bright young player in another team's jersey.
Exactly what does one have to do with the other?Quote:
as for us, if ben leaves and we can't do a sign and trade, we only have the MLE and veteran's minimum to use.
if all they offered was 15 million. Ben stays. i dont know if that rumor is true or not though.
I heard Ben was in Chicago after midnight.
Tellam probably is paying ben's hotel fee to be there all weekend.Quote:
Originally Posted by JS
The more it looks like ben is thinking chicago, the more it favors him getting more money from Joe D.
If I were tellam, I'd script this to looks exactly like the grant hill orlando visit, which is how things are shaping up.
Tellam's job is to drive up the market price for ben wallace. That's exactly what he's doing, and the way to do that is to use scare tactics on Joe. I expected no less.
Maths done.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pharaoh
Cap-heads will get this. For everyone else I plan on writing it up (with escrow calculations) and posting later.
I used StoryTeller's salaries.
Based on last year with pre-determined and fixed Cap @ $49.5 million and Tax at $61.7 million (per Coon) teams 12 teams paid $169,302,702 in tax.
The 18 teams under the tax limit each received a 30th share of $5,643,423.40.
The remaining money (assuming the league did not take any for investment) was split equally 30 ways with all of the franchises.
That was $2,257,369.36.
So theoretically, teams under the tax limit (like the Piston) stood to make $7,900,792.76 in repayments. Teams over the tax limit only got the $2,257,369.36
If that held true this season, an owner could exceed the tax limit approx. $2.25 million and get reimbursed for the overage. Of course if they come in one dollar under the cap, they stand to walk away with a cool $7.9 million in found money.
So if Bill D. spends $61.6 iin salaries with a tax limit of $61.7, his actual salary costs are $53.7. And escrow could bring it even lower.
Intentional double post.
The above really brings into focus the amount of money to be made (saved) by staying under the tax limit, and how teams over the tax limit are truly spending head and shoulders more on their roster than the responsible (sic) owners.
Question about the over 36 clause...Does it only apply to max deals? The reason I ask is how can anyone offer a 5 year deal if Ben will be over 36.
Thanks for the math, microwave.
So we've got an billionaire owner that thinks it's not worth $8 mil/yr. to help win 1 maybe 2-3 additional championships.
The math clears that up nicely.
Do you think he'd recover that $8 mil if we won them?
Ben isn't worth $15-16 million. He just isn't. Re-signing him at that price won't help us win anything.
We also need additional pieces OTHER than ben wallace, and thats costs money too.
And yes, Obviously there's a no-tax edict from davidson, i mean he must talk personally to some of you guys, you seem to know exactly what he thinks....
The Detroit Pistons started their free agent negotiating period by offering Ben Wallace a 4 year, $48 million dollar contract, according to Michigan Live.
The deal, if Wallace accepts, would make him the highest-paid player in Pistons history.
via Michigan Live
So Philly wants to make an offer.
What could they offer us? Samuel Dalembert? Possibly AI? lolQuote:
Courier Post Online - On the first day of free agent negotiations, Sixers GM Billy King was on the phone reaching out to the representative of at least one high-profile free agent: Detroit Pistons center Ben Wallace, according to the Courier Post Online.
According to ESPN.com, the Pistons are "reluctant" to offer Wallace, who turns 32 in September, anything more than a four-year deal, although it would start at between $11 and $12 million.
Assuming Joe resumes his talks from Wed, and let's assume AI is on the radar. What do we do if a deal could be reached? I mean do we then have a cough cough deal ( I don't mean illegal) to trade seperately Rip for Dally? I mean assuming Detroit gave Ben 14.7 or more in a S&T Detoit could take back AI's 18.3 million. Rip for Dally works straight up.
Ben for AI with no secondary deal in place makes no sense.
I would do Ben for Dalembert and Igudola, not sure Philly would.
Link: http://www.mlive.com/pistons/stories...110.xml&coll=1Quote:
Originally Posted by Cross
Quote:
Pistons offer Wallace 4-year, $48 million deal
Sunday, July 02, 2006
By A. Sherrod Blakely
AUBURN HILLS -- The Detroit Pistons got the ball rolling on negotiations with Ben Wallace on Saturday, offering the unrestricted free agent a four-year contract worth $48 million.
In presenting the proposed deal to Wallace's agent, Arn Tellum, Detroit offered Wallace a contract that would make him the highest-paid player in Pistons history.
Tellum was one of the few agents the Pistons spoke with on Saturday, the first day of free agency in the NBA. That's because the Pistons have to determine whether they can re-sign Wallace, a four-time All-Star, before they pursue other free agents.
Aware of the Pistons' priority regarding Wallace, agents didn't expect a call back from Detroit on Saturday.
Bill Duffy represents several of the more prominent free agents this summer, such as ex-Piston Mike James, Drew Gooden, Fred Jones, Michael Olowokandi (who played for Pistons coach Flip Saunders in Minnesota), and Speedy Claxton, who Joe Dumars, Detroit's president of basketball operations, is interested in.
"Joe's inundated with Ben Wallace right now," said Duffy, who also represents Pistons forward Tayshaun Prince. "That's where his focus is right now. We agents understand that."
Dumars' commitment to taking care of his own players, Duffy said, is among reasons other players are attracted to Detroit.
"That's one of his children, so you can understand why that's something Joe is really focusing in on right now," said Duffy, referring to Wallace. "He knows that part of the appeal to coming to Detroit is playing with Ben Wallace."
Still, William Phillips, who represents Bonzi Wells, said he was contacted by the Pistons regarding Wells.
A former Pistons draft pick, Wells had a great playoff series for Sacramento this spring. Although the Kings lost their first-round series in six games to the San Antonio Spurs, Wells was arguably the series' best player. The 6-foot-5 guard averaged 23.2 points and 12 rebounds per game while shooting 60.9 percent from the field in the series.
The Pistons may be willing to offer Wells a multi-year contract that would start at the mid-level exception, which should be about $5 million next season. However, because of Wells' strong postseason, other teams may be willing to pay him more than that.
Another player the Pistons may pursue later this summer as a backup point guard is ex-Piston Chucky Atkins. They also could re-sign Tony Delk or Lindsey Hunter.