Pregame:

Win or go home.

[smilie=uzi.gif]http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20060518/thumb.e200db8be53e48dfac2d2a08ffdbf032.cavaliers_p istons_basketball_dtp140.jpg[smilie=shootingsol: http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20060518/thumb.a8c881c739a945c0a1cde41ce1643668.cavaliers_p istons_basketball_dtp141.jpg[smilie=shogun.gif]http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/sp/getty/thumb.getty-57540070gs010_cavs_pistons.jpg

I choose win.

Cavs win by 5. Pistons go home. All hell breaks loose.

Even if we win, we have to go home.

Even if we win, we have to go home.
i shake my fist in your general direction, sir. damn, you and your semantics.

and now, an underappreciated emoticon.

[smilie=privateeye.:

Game 6 on the road? LeBron's home court?

We're going to have to win this one 5 on 8.

Game 6 on the road? LeBron's home court?

We're going to have to win this one 5 on 8.
the refs have been fucking us the whole series. unfortunately we havent been playing well enough to make it irrelevent. and dan crawford is still a bad luck ref after last nights debacle.

Friday cant come fast enough.

I fully expect us to break out of this shit and put a whoopin on us. If not....Man...

if we dont win by 15 or more, then we haven't learned shit IMO. thats how much better we are. and how badly we've played to be where we are.

i'm moving all the previous OGTs to the archive. forget all that garbage and let's play game 6, remembering who the fuck we are and who the fuck they are.

How hyped do you think they are in the NBA offices over a potential LeBron vs. Wade (and Shaq) ECF?

How hyped do you think they are in the NBA offices over a potential LeBron vs. Wade (and Shaq) ECF?
oh yea we are battle the refs, the crowd, and possibly the nba's salivating market share oppurtunity. but we are still better than all of that. playing like we are will be a big issue.

How hyped do you think they are in the NBA offices over a potential LeBron vs. Wade (and Shaq) ECF? oh yea we are battle the refs, the crowd, and possibly the nba's salivating market share oppurtunity. but we are still better than all of that. playing like we are will be a big issue.

backs against the wall and all that jazz.

i think i'm going to listen to this one on the radio to hear Blaha. [smilie=scholar.gif]

tv turned down. radio turned up. nothing worse than hearing reggie miller talk about rasheed getting suspended on his 3rd technical. genius. :p

Time to go fishing.

Game 6 on the road? LeBron's home court?

We're going to have to win this one 5 on 8.
the refs have been fucking us the whole series. unfortunately we havent been playing well enough to make it irrelevent. and dan crawford is still a bad luck ref after last nights debacle.

Sorry I can't agree here. Rip and Ben get as money phantom calls as Lebron does. Rips triple lindy backflip dive yesterday earned him an emmy in my book along with 2 of Ben's patented phantom push in the back going for a rebound. Though I do expect Bron to get the calls at home.

Listening to the radio this morning. here's what the talking heads are saying.

Sean Belgian - Doesn't like rooting for this team right now. not the team that endured themselves to the city.

Terry Foster - seems like some intangible is happening in the locker room we don't know about. Maybe no confidence in Flip, maybe Ben's not going to be here or something we don't know.

valenti - Ben's a dog out there. 0-7 on free throws is not acceptable. Flips an issue but the players are mostly to blame.

Not that anyone cares what these guys have to say just thought I would post what I heard this am drive.

Game 6 on the road? LeBron's home court?

We're going to have to win this one 5 on 8.
the refs have been fucking us the whole series. unfortunately we havent been playing well enough to make it irrelevent. and dan crawford is still a bad luck ref after last nights debacle.

Sorry I can't agree here. Rip and Ben get as money phantom calls as Lebron does. Rips triple lindy backflip dive yesterday earned him an emmy in my book along with 2 of Ben's patented phantom push in the back going for a rebound. Though I do expect Bron to get the calls at home.

And don't forget about Ben MAULING Big Z for a rebound in the last minute of the game, then flop so that Z can foul out.


It seems like everyone here is into that referee conspiracy theory bullshit and think that this team can do no wrong at all.

Varejaeo is the new incarnation of Manu Floppobili, IMO.

How many times did that dude pretend that he got hit in the mouth?

He's like a big fish flopping on the beach.

Arch - I think people are just trying to think of any excuse because it doesn't make any sense how these Pistons are losing to the Cavs. I think there's only one thing to blame it on: These Pistons have no heart. Yes I said it. They just don't care enough to win.

Game 6 on the road? LeBron's home court?

We're going to have to win this one 5 on 8.
the refs have been fucking us the whole series. unfortunately we havent been playing well enough to make it irrelevent. and dan crawford is still a bad luck ref after last nights debacle.

Sorry I can't agree here. Rip and Ben get as money phantom calls as Lebron does. Rips triple lindy backflip dive yesterday earned him an emmy in my book along with 2 of Ben's patented phantom push in the back going for a rebound. Though I do expect Bron to get the calls at home.
last i checked most of rips flops were no calls or fouls on him. and lebron is using his off arm on 80 percent of the time. i cant one on one hand how many times he's used it to get space. even on that mo evans burnage 3 pointer at the buzzer in cleveland he used it. it has almost never been called. in fact i rephrase that. it quite possibly has never been called for the whole series period. with that said its still irrelevent to us losing. we had the biggest hand in that.

Arch - I think people are just trying to think of any excuse because it doesn't make any sense how these Pistons are losing to the Cavs.
since this started from my original comment. let me say that no one is paying attention to the fact that i said the refs in spite of the shitty calls are irrelevent if we played like we had some balls..

Yes, the major problem appears to be that the Pistons have lost their passion, for some as of yet unexplained reason.

Game 6 on the road? LeBron's home court?

We're going to have to win this one 5 on 8.
the refs have been fucking us the whole series. unfortunately we havent been playing well enough to make it irrelevent. and dan crawford is still a bad luck ref after last nights debacle.

Sorry I can't agree here. Rip and Ben get as money phantom calls as Lebron does. Rips triple lindy backflip dive yesterday earned him an emmy in my book along with 2 of Ben's patented phantom push in the back going for a rebound. Though I do expect Bron to get the calls at home.
last i checked most of rips flops were no calls or fouls on him. and lebron is using his off arm on 80 percent of the time. i cant one on one hand how many times he's used it to get space. even on that mo evans burnage 3 pointer at the buzzer in cleveland he used it. it has almost never been called. in fact i rephrase that. it quite possibly has never been called for the whole series period. with that said its still irrelevent to us losing. we had the biggest hand in that.

The off arm no call is something that everyone in the league will get have to get used to and overcome for the rest of Lebrons career. The league has deemed that acceptable for LeBron to do, I have accepted that one manuever as well. I personally think the reffing is the least of what is in play here.

Yes, the major problem appears to be that the Pistons have lost their passion, for some as of yet unexplained reason.

Could they of <gasp> "Jumped the Shark"?

tv turned down. radio turned up. nothing worse than hearing reggie miller talk about rasheed getting suspended on his 3rd technical. genius. :pI can't take TNT anymore. If it's not Reggie adding his insightful analysis--"Woweeeee.... Wow.... oh, wowwwwwww!--then it's Dick Stockton saying Anderson Verejao's name once every 3 seconds. He's loving it, he's finding any excuse to say it, he's trying out different pronounciations on the air, making love to each variation--
"Varejo... Anderson Ver-uh-szean.... Anderson Veruh-ho...."
"Wowwwwww..... oh, wowwwwwwww....woweeee... "

Dick Stockton saying Anderson Verejao's name once every 3 seconds. He's loving it, he's finding any excuse to say it, he's trying out different pronounciations on the air, making love to each variation--
"Varejo... Anderson Ver-uh-szean.... Anderson Veruh-ho...."

You just wish that you were going home to bang Leslie Visser like he does.

The off arm no call is something that everyone in the league will get have to get used to and overcome for the rest of Lebrons career. The league has deemed that acceptable for LeBron to do, I have accepted that one manuever as well. I personally think the reffing is the least of what is in play here.
i never said it was the major factor. i dont even feel its a legitimate factor. i just feel its sucked ass in clevelands favor. but it doesnt matter. i expected it to. i expect the same for miami. its us. its not the refs. we have sucked.

the real point i'm making is that cleveland isnt even close to us. so the close games we've played with them have been a reflection of a serious bunch of lame gameplanning, execution, and flat out suckage.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d178/ojay_/nba/switch.jpg

the real point i'm making is that cleveland isnt even close to us. so the close games we've played with them have been a reflection of a serious bunch of lame gameplanning, execution, and flat out suckage.

Good point but think of this. It was trendy for everyone to say that when the Pistons lose it has more to do with the Pistons than it does the other team. Meaning that the Pistons were beating themselves.

The tide might be turning and there becomes a tipping point where we have to start wondering if the Cavs are indeed beating the Pistons.

Terry Foster said the Pistons are choking and I agree. Mike Valente mentioned that the Pistons jumped the shark the minute they hung their hat on their offense instead of the defense (which I agree with).

You can slice this up 30 different ways and at some point you have to give the Cavs some credit and say they are playing better ball right now. It's not every series in every sport where the better team always wins. It's the team that is playing the best at that moment and I surmize here right now that the Cavs are better at this moment and are beating the Pistons rather than the Pistons beating themselves.

Cleveland is closer to us than anyone thought. You cannot be a crap team in the NBA and come into someone else's gym and beat them, let alone 3 straight times. You cannot be a crap team when your 3rd and 4th options and bench players are making plays on the road no less! Geez, Flip Murray looked like Kobe Bryant out there in the 4th.

Geez, Flip Murray looked like Kobe Bryant out there in the 4th.
i'm sorry but thats not flip murrays fault. you can slice it whatever way you want. but that statement alone is a reflection of our own chokage. cleveland gets credit for capatalizing. but they arent THAT good. and if it takes miami laughing their way through them to reflect it. then so be it.

is it Friday yet?

What's Ben's role in all of this. The 'Ben hired Tellem" thread has several posts that say, he is the heart and soul of our team. So if he is the heart and sould shouldn't he be catching some shit right now?

If he is our leader, shouldn't we be looking to him for a response? Shouldn't this be on his shoulders like it was on MJ, Zeke's or Magics shoulders of other great teams?

If he wants the big bucks, then he has a responsibility to make this team perform too.

PS I love Ben, but something aint right with my boy. Won't go back into a game, hired Tellem, tirade??? And the biggest of all....going down 3-2 to the Cavs....Aint the Ben that I knew.

I have a feeling that Ben is going to have something to say to the boys. Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if Dice did too.

I know that Dice is a soft spoken guy, but he was supposedly crushed last year when we lost game 7. He really wants a championship to complete his career, and I think if how he looked on the bench last night after the game is any indication, he knows that this might be his last shot.

Well, really, its up to the boys to decide whether they want to win this series or not. Everyone on this team has to make a collective effort and....well....Play the right way. If there is a team in the NBA that can rally from down 3-2 it is this team. Will they do it is the question.

Well, really, its up to the boys to decide whether they want to win this series or not. Everyone on this team has to make a collective effort and....well....Play the right way. If there is a team in the NBA that can rally from down 3-2 it is this team. Will they do it is the question.The players should watch the '04 championship DVD for inspiration.

^still gives me chills when I watch it, maybe I'll watch it tonight in fact


(although it might make me miss LB even more)

I've heard rumor that Hughes might be back for game 6. That's the best news a Pistons fan could hear. Even better news would be that Hughes is starting.

I've heard rumor that Hughes might be back for game 6. That's the best news a Pistons fan could hear. Even better news would be that Hughes is starting.

i was wondering about that. i mean, it really sucks for his loss and maybe i'm being calloused by even mentioning it, but i think it might be to our advantage. Hughes hasn't played in like a week and right now, the Cavs seem to have good chemistry going. whatever works, at this point.

http://www.mlive.com/cgi-bin/prxy/photogalleries/nph-cache.cgi/cache=3000;/mlive/images/3000/32.jpg




Remember the agony of defeat.

Remember the thrill of victory.

Remember what it takes to win.

Let's do this.

The Pistons need to do the following to beat the Cavs...

1) Do not settle for perimeter shots...be aggressive and get those stupid Cav players in foul trouble.

2) Limit Lebron's points in the paint

3) Guard the 3 point arc...stupid f%$#*ng Damon Jones and Donyell Marshall.

4) Rasheed Wallace needs to stay out of foul trouble

I am wondering why Carlos Delfino is not getting any minutes, he is an excellent shooter. I don't like what I am seeing from Maurice Evans. So far, Tayshaun Prince and Antonio MyDyess have been the most consistent players.

I live in Miami and I have to put up with so much cheap talk everyday. People here are saying, "Go Cavs!" Even worse, my high school's mascot is a stupid f*$#ing cavalier!!!! People here in Miami are so obsessed with the Heat since there is nothing else good happening for this city except tourism. Seriously, without sports, Miamians would have nothing to look forward to as they have to deal with rampant unemployment, high poverty and AIDs rates, and one of the worst school districts in the country (where every other teacher is a child molester or ex-convict). Thank god these are my last weeks in this sorry excuse for an American city (3rd world American city)...then I am off to Troy...Troy, NY that is.

delfino is a solid defender. but i cant agree with him being a excellent shooter. but he is a damn good passer and ball handler. but since flip is nervous and stubborn. we arent gonna change much tomorrow.

Welcome. Great opening post!

I agree with IHateMiami that foul trouble will be key. Sheed needs to be on the floor, and Ben needs to able to be aggressive in the paint.

I hope we don't get it up the ol' poopshot again tomorrow...

Also. Where is Ball Movement? Did he run away?

I hope we don't get it up the ol' poopshot again tomorrow...

Also. Where is Ball Movement? Did he run away? He was benched in favor of Exploit One-On-One Matchup. Unfortunately.

We shouldn't have signed Exploit. He sucks.

lol, welcome to WTFDetroit, IhateMiami

Can I chime in here?

Mmmmmmmmmkay, thanks.

I'm not happy with the players, or the coach, or the officiating.

There's enough blame to go around here.

First, if its true that NBA benches typically play well at home, and poorly on the road, then why did Tony Delk and Mo Evans play so much in game 4 in Cleveland, but not play in game 5 in Detroit? Moreover, they would have won if Flip would have put Dice back in with four fouls in the fourth quarter, instead of Mo Evans...

And in game 5, the offense that Tony Delk could have provided would have spelled the difference in that two point loss, if only he would not have been a DNPCD.

Finally, he has not forced the players to keep running the plays that have been successful (Tay and Sheed in the post, Rip off screens, Chauncey to the rack, etc.)

So, the coaching has been terrible.

But the coach is not responsible for Ben making at least 50% of his free throws. Shoot, without a calculator, I'd bet if Ben went his typical 40% from the line last night, instead of 0-7, we would have had enough points to win the game.

40% of 7 free throws = .............. 3 points... right?

We lost by two points, right?

So if Ben hit a LOUSY 40% of his free throws, we would have won!!!

And Chauncey has been totally passive for three games in a row. He waits until the fourth quarter to even try to take it to the rim and draw fouls. He' s not "getting others involved". He's playing lazy.

And Sheed has been garbage, even before his injury. He simply is not willing to work hard enough to establish position in the post. He's a floater - although some of that is the officiating, as discussed below.

And finally, the officiating, especially with respect to LeBron, has been terrible. I have to think long and hard to remember a game in which the officials conspired together so obviously not make sure they didn't foul out a star player who had five fouls, regardless of how many times he initiated contact against his opponents (while at the same time fouling out Chauncey with over two minutes left on a call that could have been called blocking if they were as concerned about keeping Chauncey in the game as they were about LeBron).

And the fifth foul on Sheed was a joke. He grabbed the rebound, and Veraapsodif['aopsjdf9 (sp?) literally ran with his head down into Sheed's elbow. Yes - he literally came out of nowhere and punched Sheed in the elbow with his face.

Key to victory...less mo evans, more Dice. And RIP/Billups need to stop putting their arms up after they get stripped trying to draw a foul. Either get all the way to the basket or stop making those weak drives. Billups needs to start posting up Murray and Donkey Jones like crazy too.

Can I chime in here?

Mmmmmmmmmkay, thanks.

I'm not happy with the players, or the coach, or the officiating.

There's enough blame to go around here.

First, if its true that NBA benches typically play well at home, and poorly on the road, then why did Tony Delk and Mo Evans play so much in game 4 in Cleveland, but not play in game 5 in Detroit? Moreover, they would have won if Flip would have put Dice back in with four fouls in the fourth quarter, instead of Mo Evans...

And in game 5, the offense that Tony Delk could have provided would have spelled the difference in that two point loss, if only he would not have been a DNPCD.

Finally, he has not forced the players to keep running the plays that have been successful (Tay and Sheed in the post, Rip off screens, Chauncey to the rack, etc.)

So, the coaching has been terrible.

But the coach is not responsible for Ben making at least 50% of his free throws. Shoot, without a calculator, I'd bet if Ben went his typical 40% from the line last night, instead of 0-7, we would have had enough points to win the game.

40% of 7 free throws = .............. 3 points... right?

We lost by two points, right?

So if Ben hit a LOUSY 40% of his free throws, we would have won!!!

And Chauncey has been totally passive for three games in a row. He waits until the fourth quarter to even try to take it to the rim and draw fouls. He' s not "getting others involved". He's playing lazy.

And Sheed has been garbage, even before his injury. He simply is not willing to work hard enough to establish position in the post. He's a floater - although some of that is the officiating, as discussed below.

And finally, the officiating, especially with respect to LeBron, has been terrible. I have to think long and hard to remember a game in which the officials conspired together so obviously not make sure they didn't foul out a star player who had five fouls, regardless of how many times he initiated contact against his opponents (while at the same time fouling out Chauncey with over two minutes left on a call that could have been called blocking if they were as concerned about keeping Chauncey in the game as they were about LeBron).

And the fifth foul on Sheed was a joke. He grabbed the rebound, and Veraapsodif['aopsjdf9 (sp?) literally ran with his head down into Sheed's elbow. Yes - he literally came out of nowhere and punched Sheed in the elbow with his face.

I sware, if I wasnt straight, i'd have mad man love for you.

You can rep me any time in a court room (hopefully you wont have to)

chauncy's going for 40, pistons win by 20, and its over in the 2nd qrtr. book it.

Booked


I just got so amped for this shit right now. We're going to win. And you can quote me.

you know i cant believe we are 5 and a half point favs for this game.

Crazy crazy crazy

is it Friday yet?

http://shop.rapbay.com/images/Friday.gif

over at spurstalk.com, they're actually rooting for us as well:

http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=41567

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d178/ojay_/nba/usherbitchass.jpg

Fuck the Cavs and all of their owners.

fred mcleod mentioned on WDFN that folks in the Cleveland media are already talking about playing the Heat.

For some reason, Billupsuntee or Guarancey just don't flow as well as Guaransheed.

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060519/SPORTS0102/605190381/1127


'We aren't going to lose'

Billups says the Pistons remain cool and confident

Chris McCosky / The Detroit News
May 19, 2006

AUBURN HILLS -- The Pistons woke up Thursday morning staring smack in the face of what would be one of the more epic upsets in modern sports history.

The two-time Eastern Conference champions, who had the best regular-season record in the NBA, are down 3-2 to the upstart Cavaliers and face premature playoff elimination tonight in Game 6 in Cleveland.

Their mind-set might surprise you -- then again, maybe it won't.

"We haven't lost this series," Chauncey Billups said. "We aren't going to lose this series."

Though things were quieter than normal at the practice facility -- mostly because Rasheed Wallace was in the back taking treatment on his sprained right ankle -- the Pistons remain defiant.

There was no sense of dread or impending doom. In truth, the mood was one of excitement and eager anticipation.

"Our players are looking forward to this," coach Flip Saunders said. "It's a chance to show how good you really are. When your back is against the wall, you are going into a hostile environment against a team that is playing with a lot of confidence; it can be a good challenge and a great opportunity."

Or, as Lindsey Hunter put it, "These are the moments that define teams."

The Pistons prefer a one-word self-definition -- champion. And that title, that reputation, is what they are playing to protect tonight.

"We made our bed and we've got to sleep in it," Billups said. "It's a one-game series now, man. We've been there before, most of us. We have to win one game. We know if we play every quarter like it's the last, we will have some success."

Billups and co-captain Ben Wallace held a team meeting before practice Thursday. What was talked about, or the tone and tenor of it, wasn't shared. But the Pistons appear to be of one mind and purpose.

"We're all right," Billups said. "I would not say we've lost any confidence. When you are playing well and you are in a rhythm, you will have a little swagger. When you aren't, the swagger's not there. But that doesn't mean your confidence is gone.

"We have a very confident group. You ask anybody in this gym, 'Are you going to win the series?' and you won't find anybody hesitating. We believe it, too. We aren't just saying it. We just have to win one game."

---

Not down for the count

The Pistons admit to being staggered, maybe even a little shocked, by what transpired in the last three games. To come into Game 3 averaging 106 points in the playoffs, and then produce an average of 77.7 points and shoot 38 percent the next three, well, that's a bit unnerving.

"It's like being in a fight where you don't expect to get knocked down and you get knocked down," Saunders said. "You are a little bit groggy when you get up sometimes if you get up and you keep fighting through it, you put yourself in a situation to throw some haymakers back at them. We have to get our aggression back."

Saunders said the Pistons got back on their feet in the fourth quarter of Game 5.

"The energy and effort in the fourth quarter was as close to being where it was most of the year," he said. "We really started going after it again. You could see there was real emotion."

That emotion was undone by Rasheed Wallace's foul trouble and sore right ankle, and Billups fouling out with 2:12 left. But, to the Pistons, it represented a step toward recovery.

"From five minutes left in the third quarter of Game 2 until there were five minutes left in Game 5, we didn't play well," Saunders said. "I thought for the first time in the fourth quarter, we showed more of what we're about. We showed our competitiveness."

After the team meeting Thursday, according to Saunders, the players' approach to practice was: "We know what is at hand, let's get to work and get it done. Show us what we have to do and let's go out and do it."

The Pistons have to solve the riddle of the Cavaliers' defensive strategy. They changed their defensive scheme before Game 3. Knowing the Pistons are a jump-shooting team, the Cavaliers adjusted their defense to take the perimeter away. They started switching on all pick-and-roll plays, leaving a bigger defender on the perimeter against Billups or Richard Hamilton. They are forcing the Pistons to beat them by going to the basket.

Neither Billups, Hunter nor Hamilton are exceedingly adept at dribble-penetration and their attempts at forcing it have helped contribute to 50 turnovers and 49 assists the last three games.

"The biggest thing is, we are trying to score five points in one play," Saunders said. "We have a lot of guys who feel they have the ability to take the game over, and they have tried to do a little too much individually. We are taking something that's there, like an 8-foot shot, and trying to get a dunk out of it."

----

It's time to adjust

The Pistons will make adjustments tonight.

"I don't think we're confused," said Billups, who is averaging 15 points and shooting 37 percent. "We attack certain mismatches and they are prepared for us to attack them. When I get a big man on me and I attack, they know they are going to send two or three guys at me. It's about attacking the mismatch, but doing it the right way and making the right pass at the right time."

The key is to move the ball, make the defense move and be willing to take whatever opening presents itself.

"We have to look at it like they are playing zone," Saunders said. "We have to make more zone-type cuts, zone-type passes and be willing to look for zone-type shots."

The Cavaliers' strategy has been enhanced by Rasheed Wallace's ankle injury. He is the Pistons' best low-post scorer and a solid perimeter threat. He did not practice Thursday. Saunders said Wallace was feeling better and that he would play in Game 6.

"We have no choice now but to play and play with that chip on our shoulder," Billups said. "We have to play to win each possession, each quarter. We have to play with a vengeance. If you don't, it could be a very sad ending."

i heard about that closed-door meeting.

i'm so geeked for this game.

this series will be a foot note in a championship run. we'll all look back on this series as the defining moment in the '06 title run. the moment when they decided to play like champions. lebron will own the league on day, but that day isn't today or Sunday.

is it 7:00 yet?

Moreover, they would have won if Flip would have put Dice back in with four fouls in the fourth quarter, instead of Mo Evans...
I doubt that, inasmuch as true bigs were being called with all sorts of tickytack fouls, and McDyess hadn't been having a good game to that point. Of course, the Pistons had a couple other options (Davis, Cato) that would've been more appropriate. Most of our MLE went to Dale Davis. We have the extra bigs to get us through times when our main bigs struggle. Use them!


And the fifth foul on Sheed was a joke. He grabbed the rebound, and Veraapsodif['aopsjdf9 (sp?) literally ran with his head down into Sheed's elbow. Yes - he literally came out of nowhere and punched Sheed in the elbow with his face.
Why the fuck don't they call this dude Mr. Anderson? I'm sure Neo would approve. He's already the chosen one as far as the fucking refs are concerned.

tonight, i'd really like to see Flip go to his bench early and often. we're really going to need high energy levels from every player for 48 minutes. also, i don't want to see our starters get tagged w/ early fouls and screw everything up.

Well...Ben is the problem here....MR CORNERSTONE of the franchise has been a disaster...the so called MVP has been a JOKE this series...

Screw the F'n heads on fellas...lets lock it up and get a W

Well...Ben is the problem here....MR CORNERSTONE of the franchise has been a disaster...the so called MVP has been a JOKE this series...

Screw the F'n heads on fellas...lets lock it up and get a W
The problem? Did you watch the last game? Did he not agressively go in to
the post and score for us? Did he not try to rally the troops by banging down low?

I think we were watching different games my friend.

Hey yo Pistons...
http://img485.imageshack.us/img485/985/778na.jpg
THE SPIRIT OF DETROIT IS WITH YOU!

IT'S THE FINAL COUNTDOWN!!!

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/sp/getty/oly_full.57534029gs011_cavs_pistons.jpg

Playtime's over bron-bron.

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20060510/capt.a829c9683e5445c699b745aa08432644.cavaliers_pi stons_basketball_dtp121.jpg

http://terror.org.pl/~shog/fun/mp3/europe_-_final_countdown.mp3

let's whoop some ass tonight. i wanna see the Pistons we've watching for 82 games this season.


[smilie=djparty.gif]

I still believe in these guys, not just because they are the Pistons. But for the fact that if they lose I will have to listen to obnoxious banter all summer long at the workplace.

When they do (win) who will I give thanks to? Billups or Rip?

Well...Ben is the problem here....MR CORNERSTONE of the franchise has been a disaster...the so called MVP has been a JOKE this series...

Screw the F'n heads on fellas...lets lock it up and get a W
The problem? Did you watch the last game? Did he not agressively go in to
the post and score for us? Did he not try to rally the troops by banging down low?

I think we were watching different games my friend.

I'm with MOLA1 on this one. For fear of sounding like a Hollinger wanna-be, let's consider Ben Wallace's +/- and minutes played:

Game 1: +36, 37 minutes, best among the starters
Game 2: +12, 43 minutes, best among the starters
Game 3: -1, 38 minutes, 2nd best among starters behind Chauncey at 0
Game 4: +4, 43 minutes, 2nd best among starters behind Rip at +6
Game 5: +5, 42 minutes, best among the starters

It's those few minutes that Ben Wallace -isn't- on the court that are costing us the games, minutes with Rasheed, McDyess, Tayshaun, and MoEvans at the PF and|or C positions. Ben's fucked up some, but it seemed to me that we're just getting plastered when he's off the court and this confirms it. I think the only consistently lousy "big" in the losses is Rasheed.

Excuse me. Maybe you guys don't know this (I mean, I don't know if he's ever mentioned it or anything) but, MUHME GOES TO THE PRACTICES, he watches games from floor level, he stand near them when they talk sometimes, and frankly he just sees more than you do as far as anything is concerned regarding the Pistons. I'm sorry, but you just can't argue with a guy with that kind of access. I mean, the kid is practically McCosky and we all know that he is never wrong, nor clueless as to Piston matters.

If he says that Ben is the problem, even if the Pistons problem is CLEARY offensive and Ben has very little to do with that part of the game, then Ben is the problem.

Its as simple as that.

I could care less what Ben Wallace stats say, my eyes tell me he has made very little difference in this series. There is no denying that Varejao has had a bigger impact for his team thus far and I bet his stats are not as good as Ben's.

Your stats Mxy mean nothing.

This is the 3rd straight real playoff series we've fallen behind 3-2. Can't believe it's come to this again. I use "real" because the Bucks weren't even a .500 team. Cavs are at least a 50 win team, who are playing better D with more energy than all season, so that's enough to say they are a 55-ish win team right now.

What's really unsettling to me is the public comments. I feel like they are saying exactly what the Lakers said when we were beating them in 04. The Cavs energetic and sticky play reminds me of the 04 Finals group.

Here's something to ponder... when the players watched film of Game 4 before Game 5........ were they looking at how Cleveland defended them... or were they looking at what THEY did wrong?

During the little comeback in Game 5, a graphic flashed onscreen showing that the Pistons had grabbed 7 offensive boards to the Cavs' 1 in the last few minutes. To win the Pistons have to crash them on the boards. THEY HAVE TO DOMINATE THE BOARDS. That's not Flip's strong suit.

Before those Finals reporters were asking the Pistons about if they were afraid or intimidated. NOw they are asking Cleveland, someone asked lebron a similar question. Bottom line, they've figured us out, and we're not adjusting to it, AT ALL, just like the Lakers didn't make any real adjustments against us, they kept insisting it was them and if they just played their game they'd beat us. They've picked up that we're a jump shooting only team and aren't doubling down on anyone, just sticking with their man and not letting the players get into rhythm. They've gotten over the mystique.

We could still win, it'll hardly be the first time we're down 3-2, and both games 4 and 5 were down to the wire even with them outplaying us. But even if we do win, convincingly even, I'm still unhappy with the arrogant personality of this team. I used to like everything aout the team. Now I only like their basketball skills when playing well, i dont really like the players that much any more. They're just so... so... LAKER-LIKE.

How do you guys think this game will play out?


I think the cavs get off to a hot start in the 1st qutr, but the pistons remain calm and establish a 3 or 4 point half time lead. From there they just keep the game close and in the 4th they'll slowly pull away.

I have a weird feeling that the team that shoots the most free throws is going to win.

I have a weird feeling that the team that shoots the most free throws is going to win.

You just love to burst my bubble, dont you?

I have a weird feeling that the team that shoots the most free throws is going to win.

You just love to burst my bubble, dont you?

When it happens to me I gotta change my pants.

I could care less what Ben Wallace stats say, my eyes tell me he has made very little difference in this series. There is no denying that Varejao has had a bigger impact for his team thus far and I bet his stats are not as good as Ben's.

Your stats Mxy mean nothing.
My eyes say something different.

If he's made so little difference, why the fuck are we in the hole when he's not on the court? Why have the Cavs shot 40% in the past couple games? Why is he the leading rebounder in every game for either team? I don't think that Ben's done exceptionally well, don't get me wrong. But you look at the alternative when he's not on the court, and that's when you see things get fucked. Also, look at the Cavs' production out of C. Big Z finally had a good game Wednesday, but Varejao (apart from his ability to have fouls handed to him by the refs) surely didn't. At the end of the game, both their Cs fouled out, presumably to maximize their crunch time impact, yet we do anything but take it strong to the hole. Obviously, that was Ben Wallace's fault, being the leader of the offense and all... right?

3 hours.

3 hours.

I can't breathe.

I'm offline for the night.

Go Pistons.

FWIW, McCosky on Stony and Wojo was saying that the past two days have been crazy intense in the Pistons' practices. he mentioned that we're going to be seeing some new things tonight. he didn't specify, but it seemed like he was talking about new offensive looks and a conscious effort to get the bench going. he also mentioned that Sheed's ankle is doing very well.

I think this group's legacy is on the line tonight. If they win tonight, they'll pull through and win Game 7 Sunday. I'm sure of that. It could be similar to Game 7 against New Jersey a couple of years ago. And they may well regain their confidence and swagger and come through with a championship.

But if they lose, this franchise is at a crossroads. What do you do if you're Dumars? I think they essentially become the NBA's version of the Colts (with the MAJOR difference that the Pistons actually won a title), stuck with a group of players (Manning, Harrison, Wayne v. Pistons starting 5) and a coach (Dungy, Saunders) that aren't capable of getting it done anymore. In a conference featuring LeBron & Wade, the Pistons aren't going to realistically be good enough to compete for a title. This is where the drafting of Darko Milicic may really come back to haunt the Pistons.

I'm not ready to face that yet. I didn't think I'd have to for another 3years, and I was hoping for at least 1 additional title in that time. History won't remember this group as kindly as they (and a lot of fans too) feel they should. I hope the players truly realize that all the respect they feel they are entitled to is actually on the line when they take the court for Game 6.

GO PISTONS!!!!!!!!!!!

unfortunately, i won't be home until late.

about 45 minutes until tip off.

Let's Do This.

Pistons in 7.

I believe.

I feel like I'm gonna barf waiting for this thing to start...

I really wish this was at the Palace.

no chat today?

I'm so hype. Watching FSN. Had to change my sig too.


Fuck HDTV...I'm going grimey for this one. Go Fred and Greg!


GO PISTONS MOTHERFUCKERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Gecko...Com...STFU. Let's get this game baby!

All things considered, the Detroit Pistons came out and eventually
imposed their will on offense AND defense. I know that the Pistons
haven't exactly gone nuts, but listen, we saved our guys from foul
trouble and we're poised to beat the shit out of these guys.

The energy is there, it's about to get crazy there.

UNLEASH THE ALPACAS!!!!!

Fuck these motherfuckers. I'm sick of these cats. Let's kill these
fools and then come back home to The Palace and finish them off.

LET'S GO BABY!!!!!!!!! NO FUCKING JOKE!!!!!!! ALPACAS BITCH!!!!!

Whats the debate again? I simply said Ben hasn't come up as big for his team as Varejao and has been outplayed. Where is the disagreement? I am lost here.

FUCK!

I missed the first half. Anyone wanna give me a quick update on what happened?

Ben made 2 of his 6 attempted free throws so far.

He needs to work on them over the summer...

oh my god....we better not lose, their outscoring us in the 3rd so far.

BILLLUPS DECIDED TO SHOW UP!!

Everybody relax. I just got home from work and put on my lucky jersey. it's in the bag.

Flip has to think about going to Dice and get ben out of there. He first stands over Z waiting for the Refs to bail him out with a 3 second call instead of tying him up and then gets the ball all alone under the basket and throws it out. His head isn't there.

I love BigBen but I don't feel I am hating on him needlesly.

goddamn, 38 points in the paint so far for the cavs, we needa put an end to that.

ben wallace and and tay stepped up big on the boards. anyone knocking ben after this one i cannot relate with at all.

GAME 7!!!

ben wallace and and tay stepped up big on the boards. anyone knocking ben after this one i cannot relate with at all.

Ben's tip with a 1:43 was possilby the biggest play of the game. he had a nice 4th. He was invisible for large portions of the game. Besides you don't relate well with me anyways.

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

FUCK YEAH!!!

Indeed!

Ben made 2 of his 6 attempted free throws so far.

He needs to work on them over the summer...
Flip has infested everybody with the rate them by shooting disease. how quickly we forget the 2 blocks on lebron in the 4th quarter dead at the rim and the constant effort trying to outrebound 4 cavaliers at times. finally tayshaun and rip were helping him in the 4th and we owned the offensive boards when that happened.. i'm sorry gecko but i think you expect him to be 6ft 8in superman and take on the whole cavs squad out there. thats been the tune all year. he cant hit the boards by himself. this year guards rebound more than ever. he has to get help.

we aint going home bitches, we aint going home

We won!

we aint going home bitches, we aint going home

Actually, we are.

Game 7 is at home. ;)

I agree with Gutz. Without Ben in there his "invisibility" would be noticed to an incredible degree since EVERY TEAM IN THE LEAGUE would whoop their asses.

We won!

Fuck this thread. Fuck this game. Let's take care of these bitches here at The Palace!


GAME 7 OGT (http://wtfdetroit.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5913)

FUCK YES.

Sheed is the reason we won this game. He showed up on a sprained ankle and turned in a huge performance tonight. Pay him. If he didn't get hurt, we would have never been in this hole.

Ben had 1 bucket, 2 fts, for 4pts, 10 boards ZERO blocks and 1 assist. I know his game is more than the stats but I get the feeling that some didn't want him to get 'any' blame for 3 losses and now get cred for us winning.

Mark me down as 'strongly disagree' with that.

Holy shit. My heart stopped

Thank goodness for fsn. finally someone else sees that Lebron is traveling and committing numerous offensive fouls on a level unseen for a long time.

Sheed is the reason we won this game. He showed up on a sprained ankle and turned in a huge performance tonight. Pay him. If he didn't get hurt, we would have never been in this hole.

Ben had 1 bucket, 2 fts, for 4pts, 10 boards ZERO blocks and 1 assist. I know his game is more than the stats but I get the feeling that some didn't want him to get 'any' blame for 3 losses and now get cred for us winning.

Mark me down as 'strongly disagree' with that.

Ben also blocked LeBron on several plays where he got by his defender, got fouled, had an easy and-one, and got stuffed by Big Ben. Watching Ben out there poking offensive rebounds away while getting hung on by 3-4 Cavs, and only being LeBron's fucking height was amazing.

The Ben haters can suck ESPN's love juice out a funnel from LeBron's ass.

This team ain't shit without him, and every year he still has to prove it to you.

Ben=Pistons.

Sheed is the reason we won this game. He showed up on a sprained ankle and turned in a huge performance tonight. Pay him. If he didn't get hurt, we would have never been in this hole.

Ben had 1 bucket, 2 fts, for 4pts, 10 boards ZERO blocks and 1 assist. I know his game is more than the stats but I get the feeling that some didn't want him to get 'any' blame for 3 losses and now get cred for us winning.

Mark me down as 'strongly disagree' with that.
did you watch the game or read the staline. he blocked two shots lebron woulda made 3 point plays easy. he's out there battling the whole cavaliers frontline and the backcourt for the rebounds. muthafuckas here are spoiled. thats all i've got to say.

only one day ago i heard we should dump rasheed for being cocky. like he never was before.:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :mad:

Ben > God

Lets end this series.

Did anyone catch what Michele Tafoya asked Sheed at the end? She asked him how he managed to hit a three or a three pointer every time they scored. Nice work. At least Hubie and what's his face are better than that dumbass that kept saying 'adam vedajow' in game 5.

I enjoyed listening to Hubie because he didn't buy into the King James crap and called a bad call a bad call. Nice to see a non-sell out.

Sheed is the reason we won this game. He showed up on a sprained ankle and turned in a huge performance tonight. Pay him. If he didn't get hurt, we would have never been in this hole.

Ben had 1 bucket, 2 fts, for 4pts, 10 boards ZERO blocks and 1 assist. I know his game is more than the stats but I get the feeling that some didn't want him to get 'any' blame for 3 losses and now get cred for us winning.

Mark me down as 'strongly disagree' with that.

Ben also blocked LeBron on several plays where he got by his defender, got fouled, had an easy and-one, and got stuffed by Big Ben. Watching Ben out there poking offensive rebounds away while getting hung on by 3-4 Cavs, and only being LeBron's fucking height was amazing.

The Ben haters can suck ESPN's love juice out a funnel from LeBron's ass.

This team ain't shit without him, and every year he still has to prove it to you.

Ben=Pistons.

Read above...when we lose, I didn't hear shit about it being Bens fault, but when we win he is God. Does not compute.

did you watch the game or read the staline.


Both...did you see the play when he missed 2 of 2 at the line, then went down and got jobbed by DM (I think it was, I'll check that later) Shitty fucking sequence by Ben. It happens, but why ignore it?

Look, Ben is huge for us at times, but we lost 3 games we shouldn't have. He is partly to blame and he is NOT the reason we won tonight...meaning it wasn't one of those games in the past where he flat out dominated and took over the game.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v496/realgm/logo_bleek_75.jpg

Agree Double u. Peeps can disagree, but MOLA1 said it best...fuck this game, fuck this thread on to G7.

did you watch the game or read the staline.

Both...did you see the play when he missed 2 of 2 at the line, then went down and got jobbed by DM (I think it was, I'll check that later) Shitty fucking sequence by Ben. It happens, but why ignore it?
I'm not ignoring it, and it was DG if you're talking about that stretch at the end of the 2nd Q. Big Z was the best C on the court overall. I never said that Ben was doing "great". I did say that our troubles really started with those few minutes with Ben off the court, and the numbers reflected that (and it happened again last night). I did suggest that we ought to look elsewhere to pick on who's really not producing.


Look, Ben is huge for us at times, but we lost 3 games we shouldn't have. He is partly to blame and he is NOT the reason we won tonight...meaning it wasn't one of those games in the past where he flat out dominated and took over the game.
In last night's game, down the stretch, Ben did all sorts of clutchy defensive things. Rasheed and Chauncey weren't terribly clutch (1-4 FTs combined in the end). While Rasheed was going strong to the hole and staying out of foul trouble, compensating for his (ankle's) lack of D, Chauncey almost turned Snow and Donkey into a superstar PG tandem yet agai. If this weren't an elimination game, we'd be bitching about how we nearly choked at the end.

And again, Ben (with Rip) lead in +/-. Both times Ben left the game, he came back with the score worse than when he left. Sidehsow Bob showed some life the moment Rasheed was at C, and McDyess isn't a great match against DM and his stretching of the defense. Fortunately, Tay and Rip did about as well as you can against a LeBron who the refs bend over backwards to give blowjob FTs to.

Sheed is the reason we won this game. He showed up on a sprained ankle and turned in a huge performance tonight. Pay him. If he didn't get hurt, we would have never been in this hole.

Ben had 1 bucket, 2 fts, for 4pts, 10 boards ZERO blocks and 1 assist. I know his game is more than the stats but I get the feeling that some didn't want him to get 'any' blame for 3 losses and now get cred for us winning.

Mark me down as 'strongly disagree' with that.

Ben also blocked LeBron on several plays where he got by his defender, got fouled, had an easy and-one, and got stuffed by Big Ben. Watching Ben out there poking offensive rebounds away while getting hung on by 3-4 Cavs, and only being LeBron's fucking height was amazing.

The Ben haters can suck ESPN's love juice out a funnel from LeBron's ass.

This team ain't shit without him, and every year he still has to prove it to you.

Ben=Pistons.

Thank your for saving me some key strokes.

i woke up this morning with a grin from ear to ear, thanks to the Pistons :)

In last night's game, down the stretch, Ben did all sorts of clutchy defensive things. Rasheed and Chauncey weren't terribly clutch (1-4 FTs combined in the end). While Rasheed was going strong to the hole and staying out of foul trouble, compensating for his (ankle's) lack of D, Chauncey almost turned Snow and Donkey into a superstar PG tandem yet agai. If this weren't an elimination game, we'd be bitching about how we nearly choked at the end.
Chris Sheridan thinks the same thing, as it turns out:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs2006/columns/story?columnist=sheridan_chris&id=2451534

Of course, he's a little psychotic, simultaneously saying:


The Pistons again showed their resilience, just as they've done in the past two years when pushed to the brink, but they were far from perfect when they had chances to ice the game, and Wallace' sour grapes over the foul call was just their latest episode of griping a little too much and pointing the finger at someone other than themselves.

while at the same time saying:


But it was a weak call, a ticky-tack call, really, at the game's most crucial moment. And I can't help but think it would have been nicer to see Murray shoot for the tie.

So it's ok for him to call it a crap foul, but not ok for Ben. Ohhh-k, Chris.

Chris Sheridan=dumb asshole.

It wasn't a foul. Even James knew it wasn't a foul. But Ben had broken the air cushion, so the whistle was inevitable. I'm fed up with the refs coddling LeBron in this series. He's a man among boys and the best player on the court. But that doesn't entitle him to EVERY call. What if he'd shot the ball in the final seconds rather than passing it to Flip Murray? That had AND1 written all over it. And why? Because Ben Wallace made eye contact with King James.

I mean, c'mon. Did James take more contact than Rip Hamilton took, to no whistle, in the final seconds of game 5?

The funny thing is that coddling Lebron with 1.4 seconds left virtually ended the game. (Refs: Weeza sorreee mistah Stern. We'd had thought we'd done good.)

Yep.

We are "witnessing" The LeBron Rules.

Yep.

We are "witnessing" The LeBron Rules.
lol@the rules backfiring on him at the end. the refs though he was gonna shoot it and gave up the foul hoping for an and 1. i think stern will scold them over this.

Yep.

We are "witnessing" The LeBron Rules. lol@the rules backfiring on him at the end. the refs though he was gonna shoot it and gave up the foul hoping for an and 1. i think stern will scold them over this.

that was pretty funny. the refs screwed him because he did find an open man in the corner for a potential three.

Chris Sheridan has no idea what he's talking about. First he expected the Pistons to win in 4. Now he's going the totally opposite way. By the way, I'm new here guys. ;).

welcome to the forums