In the month of February, he scored more than 15 points only 4 times.

So, no more it's only 1 game excuses.

In the month of February, he scored more than 15 points only 4 times.
H1man you just opened up a can of taymelo germs that may disease this whole board.

carry on.

14 points, 4.4 rebounds, 2.1 assists and is shooting 43.5fg% - yeah, he deserves the fat contract.

Last five games - 9.6ppg shooting 31% from the floor.

14 points, 4.4 rebounds, 2.1 assists and is shooting 43.5fg% - yeah, he deserves the fat contract.

Last five games - 9.6ppg shooting 31% from the floor.
Is this all his fault? Or are you possibly overlooking the fact that are team isnt coached that well. i saw atleast 4 turnovers/late shot clock hoists out of timeouts. and its been like that for awhile now. pure ugly.

it's painfully obvious that Tay's not being used effectively in the offense.

Before people start pointing out his Pre/Post All-Star numbers, I want to point out something else:

November: 49% FG
December: 43% FG
January: 41% FG
February: 39% FG

That doesn't look like somebody who is about to increase his numbers.

he is an ass too, i went in the locker room the other day and tried talkin to him, didn't even look at me or respond. I saw a kid ask for a picture with him, tay was like and I quote "I got places to be, I aint got time for this"

50 million, I dont think so

it's painfully obvious that Tay's not being used effectively in the offense.
That's what I think. Tay is not a jump shooter. Well, he has a decent shot, but that's not his game. He needs to attack the rim. Once he's successful doing that, his outside game will open up.

Another problem for him is that he hasn't had a good backup during that 5 game stretch. Delfino is going through a serious sophomore slump right now. It would be good to get Tay more rest, but it's hard when his backup play has been so poor.

i really don't know how to utilize tay better. his drive to the basket is only average, because he can't change directions quick enough. same reason he can't take his man off the dribble.

his post game is best part of his offense bag of tricks, IMO. but in this offense, tay only gets that once and a while.

really not sure how to get tay back into the groove of things.

Cut Acker and sign Jimmy Jackson then, even to take away this excuse. Look at his minutes, less than last season.

and i hate how Flip seems to just split time at backup SF between Delfino and Evans. i wish he'd just pick one (preferrably Delfino) and play him for 18-20 a game.

give delfino the chance to play. if he starts to outplay tay, then maybe tay needs to come off the bench. i know it's rather drastic, but damn, tay's looked lost in the shuffle out there lately.

i just wonder, has tay's game plateaued already?

Cut Acker and sign Jimmy Jackson then, even to take away this excuse. Look at his minutes, less than last season.
And you rate jimmy jackson as worth it why?

and i hate how Flip seems to just split time at backup SF between Delfino and Evans. i wish he'd just pick one (preferrably Delfino) and play him for 18-20 a game.

give delfino the chance to play. if he starts to outplay tay, then maybe tay needs to come off the bench. i know it's rather drastic, but damn, tay's looked lost in the shuffle out there lately.

i just wonder, has tay's game plateaued already?
I dont think so. His off the dribble shooting is streaky but by far better than last year. I actually expect him to improve thast part of his game more and more every game. and he was actually our best perimeter defender tonight. everyone else sucked at that tonight.

Cut Acker and sign Jimmy Jackson then, even to take away this excuse. Look at his minutes, less than last season.
And you rate jimmy jackson as worth it why?

ugh, we definitely don't need another backup SF to give to Flip. he'll probably play each one for 3 minutes a game. IMO, flip just needs to pick one and let him build consistency as Tay's backup.

I'm not worried about Delfino too much. I think he's getting good looks and his shot looks alright but nothing's falling for him. Just a slump. And part of Delfino's problem is that he's always coming off the bench and guarding their team's best wing player. It's hard to get going offensively when you are worried about getting position on Melo, Lebron, Wade, and Carter defensively.

And Tay has a similar problem to that with the defense. But at this point in his career he should have a lot more consistency then Delfino.

But I am a lot more concerned about Tayshaun. This whole year has been a bad dissapointment. When I watch older videos of him, he just looks quicker and faster. This year he seems quite slow. He isn't making those magnificant plays in the fast-break anymore. I wonder if he has a couple injuries? And his jump shot isn't looking great either. In years past, you leave him open anywhere on the court he will knock it down. I can't say that for this year.

This whole year has been a bad dissapointment.
extreme and not true statement.

he is an ass too, i went in the locker room the other day and tried talkin to him, didn't even look at me or respond. I saw a kid ask for a picture with him, tay was like and I quote "I got places to be, I aint got time for this"

50 million, I dont think so


Why does that not shock me? At all.
I know for a fact that they're all pot heads.
Fuck knowing these guys personaly, and/or talking to them.
I always figured its better off that way.
Thats so fucking lame. You're about to make $50million, you cant take 2 seconds out of your day to talk to a kid and take a picture. Fuck that. I relize if he was out and about, he wouldnt want everyone running up to him, but he's in the fucking locker room, it takes to seconds to pose for a pic.

You know, I made fun of a story where Kobe became friends with a little kid that lost everything in Katrina. I siad "Ha, look at this fucking cock sucker, anything to make him self look good again" But now that I think about it, even if that was right, at leaste that kid can feel special and good about him self for a long time. Whether its fake or not on Kobe's. How would you like to be able to say you are friends with Kobe and you're only 8. That kid Prince blew off probably felt like shit. Fuck Prince.
Sorry, I just get pissed when million dollar asshole athleates wont take 2 seconds out of there day to acknowalge a kid who proably baught his jersey and anything else with his number/pic on it. Alls it takes is 2 seconds.

i think it's fair to say that everyone hoped tayshaun would gradually improve from last season. when you look statistically, he's taking a small step back.

granted he's playing a little less minutes than last season, his FG% is the lowest it's ever been for him.

This whole year has been a bad dissapointment.
extreme and not true statement.
Let me clarify. For Tayshaun, this whole year has been a bad dissapointment.


Context Rorschach think context.

i think it's fair to say that everyone hoped tayshaun would gradually improve from last season. when you look statistically, he's taking a small step back.

granted he's playing a little less minutes than last season, his FG% is the lowest it's ever been for him.
hows dice stats looking?

last i checked they were also lower. though cbill and Rip have been loving this offense. Tay, Dice, and Ben havent been so great in Flip's system. Its obvious he still doesnt know how to use everyone, and isnt trying from tay to delfino.

Is it just me, or does Dice look clumsy this year? Anyone?

This whole year has been a bad dissapointment.
extreme and not true statement.
Let me clarify. For Tayshaun, this whole year has been a bad dissapointment.


Context Rorschach think context.
no i its still not true. bad dissappointment is extreme and not true. maybe slightly dissappointing. But what were you expecting in a season with a new coach and a new offense. Honestly it hasnt fit him well from day one. so whats to dissappoint?

no i its still not true. bad dissappointment is extreme and not true. maybe slightly dissappointing. But what were you expecting in a season with a new coach and a new offense. Honestly it hasnt fit him well from day one. so whats to dissappoint?

Let's see:

Defense, Rebounding have nothing to do with a new coach, so why the regression?

As far as his offense, as I pointed out earlier, instead of improving he is actually getting worse as the season progresses. Isn't he supposed to improve as he gets more comfortable as he season goes on?

That alone (lack of improvement) constitutes a huge disappointment.

I don't see THAT much of a difference between "bad dissapointment" and "slightly dissapointing." Oh well, just a clarification of terms.

I'm dissapointed because Tay has improved statistically in every category from year to year. Then this year, he signs a huge deal, and his stats are worse than the year before across the board? He should be continuing to blossom. And it's not like he isn't getting his fair shake in the offense, he just looks bad.

no i its still not true. bad dissappointment is extreme and not true. maybe slightly dissappointing. But what were you expecting in a season with a new coach and a new offense. Honestly it hasnt fit him well from day one. so whats to dissappoint?

Let's see:

Defense, Rebounding have nothing to do with a new coach, so why the regression?

As far as his offense, as I pointed out earlier, instead of improving he is actually getting worse as the season progresses. Isn't he supposed to improve as he gets more comfortable as he season goes on?

That alone (lack of improvement) constitutes a huge disappointment.
The defense has been solid IMO. he cant play against quick guys like wade. this has been known since last year. otherwise he's been solid on defense. Rebounding wise it is reflected from coaching. Rebounding is lackluster from ALL our perimeter players and a weakness in our system of jumpers.

sounds like pointless griping to me.

hes fine. he'll be fine. he'll elevate for the playoffs.

ps: skelly, little early to be doing a year-to-year trend analysis when this is year 3 of playing.

pps: who cares if he's an asshole. 95% of nba players have been treated like kings since they made their highschool teams. what do you expect?

sounds like pointless griping to me.

hes fine. he'll be fine. he'll elevate for the playoffs.

Based on what?

ps: skelly, little early to be doing a year-to-year trend analysis when this is year 3 of playing.

Players in their 4th year PROgress not DEgress.

I guess I'm the only one that thinks this, but I think Prince would benefit a TON from coming off the bench for a week or two.

The Spurs did the same thing for Manu last year when he was struggling.

Delfino or Evans (preferrably Delfino) could start in Tay's place, and Tay could get intoa better groove as the #1 or #2 offensive option on the floor.

I guess I'm the only one that thinks this, but I think Prince would benefit a TON from coming off the bench for a week or two.

The Spurs did the same thing for Manu last year when he was struggling.

Delfino or Evans (preferrably Delfino) could start in Tay's place, and Tay could get intoa better groove as the #1 or #2 offensive option on the floor.
That's not a bad tactic. We actually did that his 2nd year with Darvin Ham starting for a few games. It seemed to work, I guess.

However, Manu has no problems coming off the bench, we all know that. But what would Tay think about that?

If you recall, Tay said he was less comfortable starting in 03-04. He said it was much easier for him to produce off the bench.

Maybe he's gotten used to it since then, but he seemed to enjoy coming off the bench and being a sparkplug.

Tay is nothing if not a team player, so I think he'd do it.

Even moreso, I think the TEAM needs some kind of change right now.

I posted this in the game thread... but Tay got a sum total of ONE REBOUND last night in over 30 minutes of play.

I don't blame the coach or the scheme for that.

I think he also shot like 1/13 or something like that.

The truth is we overrate him. He's amazing at running the length of the court and challenging shots. He's great at being long and difficult to shoot over. He's average to below average at chasing his man around and keeping him away from the rim. He's average to slightly above average at posting up. His jump shot is below average, slow, deliberate, and ugly. He's a good ball handler for his size.

After 4 years, he still spends most of each and every game standing around and watching his teammates on the offensive end.

He basically gets paid $9 mil or $10 mil per year to stand around and patiently wait to pick up the scraps left behind by the other four starters, and to run the length of the court and block a few shots per year.

He's a quality NBA player, who happens to be overpaid, and better suited as a 6th man.

He's a quality NBA player, who happens to be overpaid, and better suited as a 6th man.

This is also my position and has been for some time.

If we could have acquired a starting calibre SF for Darko then Tay coming off the bench would have been ideal.

He's a quality NBA player, who happens to be overpaid, and better suited as a 6th man.

This is also my position and has been for some time.

If we could have acquired a starting calibre SF for Darko then Tay coming off the bench would have been ideal.

I've also been saying this for at least 2 years, and I think 3.

I've always compared Tay to a young Corliss - a lot of NBA skill in a body that isn't made for the NBA. Corliss was too short to be a starter but abused bench players. Tay is too skinny to be a starter but could abuse bench players. He could be 6th man of the year, instead of the stepchild of the starting 5.

I've also been saying this for at least 2 years, and I think 3.

.

You have.

I guess I'm the only one that thinks this, but I think Prince would benefit a TON from coming off the bench for a week or two.

The Spurs did the same thing for Manu last year when he was struggling.

Delfino or Evans (preferrably Delfino) could start in Tay's place, and Tay could get intoa better groove as the #1 or #2 offensive option on the floor.
and the team was having trouble with it this year, but that could be coupled with finley being inconsistent to be fair. and evans shouldnt start for us ever IMO.

I dont think its something that benching him will help or fix. I think if anything they should call his number early. Its something Brown did to combat his slumps and it worked very well. Even when the idea worked for manu, he was a different player who looks to shoot and score by far more than Tay. I think it'll be a miserable failure to bring him off the bench.

apparently I have to re-post this a third time:


Here are his career numbers:

YR FG% 3P% FT% STL BLK TO PF OFF DEF TOT AST PTS
03-04 .467 .363 .766 0.8 0.8 1.5 1.8 1.1 3.6 4.7 2.3 10.3
04-05 .487 .341 .807 0.7 0.9 1.6 2.0 1.6 3.7 5.3 3.0 14.7
05-06 .449 .364 .770 0.5 0.4 1.2 1.3 1.3 3.1 4.4 2.3 14.1

So he is shooting slightly worse, but better from 3 point range...has a half steal, block, and assist less a game, a rebound less a game and a half point less a game.

Time to panic!

BTW, here are his pre and post all star numbers last year:

------------ FG% 3P% FT% STL BLK TO PF OFF DEF TOT AST PTS
Pre All-Star 48.704 .359 77.778 0.69 1.00 1.7 2.2 1.5 3.8 5.3 3.0 13.1
Post All-Star 48.700 .317 83.846 0.68 0.65 1.6 1.6 1.8 3.5 5.3 3.0 17.4

As you can see, he's having a better season this year than last year at this time.

I do agree that Prince would be ideally suited to teh role of super sub. But that's not a luxery we have until Delfino can become an every day contributor.

I also think he's just like Sheed in that when Billups and RIP are playing so well, he simply takes a back seat to them and defers. Hopefully that will change in the playoffs. The FG% is alarming though. He seems like he's missing a lot of open 3's. Maybe he's banged up a little.

This is the result of Flip's system, which encourages perimeter play and de-emphasizes post play. Basically sucked away all his aggressiveness, and he either shoots jumpers or dunks open alley-oops.

apparently I have to re-post this a third time:


Here are his career numbers:

YR FG% 3P% FT% STL BLK TO PF OFF DEF TOT AST PTS
03-04 .467 .363 .766 0.8 0.8 1.5 1.8 1.1 3.6 4.7 2.3 10.3
04-05 .487 .341 .807 0.7 0.9 1.6 2.0 1.6 3.7 5.3 3.0 14.7
05-06 .449 .364 .770 0.5 0.4 1.2 1.3 1.3 3.1 4.4 2.3 14.1

So he is shooting slightly worse, but better from 3 point range...has a half steal, block, and assist less a game, a rebound less a game and a half point less a game.

Time to panic!

BTW, here are his pre and post all star numbers last year:

------------ FG% 3P% FT% STL BLK TO PF OFF DEF TOT AST PTS
Pre All-Star 48.704 .359 77.778 0.69 1.00 1.7 2.2 1.5 3.8 5.3 3.0 13.1
Post All-Star 48.700 .317 83.846 0.68 0.65 1.6 1.6 1.8 3.5 5.3 3.0 17.4

As you can see, he's having a better season this year than last year at this time.

Apparently I have to repost this a third time:

In over 30 minutes last night, Tay had 1 rebound, even though he's got an over 7' wingspan. This has become a disturbing trend that has little to do with gameplan and/or deferring to teammates.

We were outrebounded by like 20 last night, so its not like he deferred to Ben on the boards or anything. In fact, he deferred to Carmelo Anthony on the boards. Isn't that a problem? If not, am I in Bizarro world or something?

We could get Tay's output from a MLE-level salaried player. Signing Tay to that ridiculous deal probably had some effect in pushing Milicic out the door.

I think I am unclear on something. Is it assumed that Prince will be more assertive off the bench, or that his passiveness is more palatable coming from a bench player?

If its the former, I don't get why that's assumed (Why would simply moving him to the bench make him more agressive?). If its the latter, I suppose that's true (as you expect less from a bench player) but the issue (IMO) isn't finding a way to accept Tay for what he is, but discussing a situation or way of playing that gets improvement out of Tay.

but discussing a situation or way of playing that gets improvement out of Tay.
Thats what the coaches should be discussing. It was a priority in the LB era along with getting ben early touches. Now neither guy is getting the same priority and things like this are a result.

Apparently I have to repost this a third time:

In over 30 minutes last night, Tay had 1 rebound, even though he's got an over 7' wingspan. This has become a disturbing trend that has little to do with gameplan and/or deferring to teammates.

We were outrebounded by like 20 last night, so its not like he deferred to Ben on the boards or anything. In fact, he deferred to Carmelo Anthony on the boards. Isn't that a problem? If not, am I in Bizarro world or something?

I only saw the 4th quarter last night, so I cannot attest to that particular game. It depends on the circumstances. Ben didn't score a couple nights ago too. It depends on the number of rebound chances Tay had. At first glance, 1 rebound is terrible. But also keep in mind that when you are guarding the #1 option (and that player is a wing player), you won't have many defensive rebounding chances. Most shots will be rebounded by someone else. Offensively, that shouldn't matter. Perhaps Tay stood on the wing too much. Perhaps he simply was fighting great rebounders (Camby and Kmart). Perhaps he got outworked for them by Melo. I didn't see the game really. So, I will defer to those who did.

As I said, my first instinct would be to say that 1 rebound sucks, but I'd have to know how many rebounds he "should have" had too.

I think I am unclear on something. Is it assumed that Prince will be more assertive off the bench, or that his passiveness is more palatable coming from a bench player?

If its the former, I don't get why that's assumed (Why would simply moving him to the bench make him more agressive?). If its the latter, I suppose that's true (as you expect less from a bench player) but the issue (IMO) isn't finding a way to accept Tay for what he is, but discussing a situation or way of playing that gets improvement out of Tay.

I think bringing him off the bench (if we had another acceptable starting SF option) could help increase his agressiveness some. It's possible that he is intimidated playing with the starting 5, and would feel more comfortable asserting himself offensively if he was playing with a combination of Hunter/Delfino/Dice/Evans and maybe one starter.

Of course, this is just theory, we have no way of knowing for sure.

I think I am unclear on something. Is it assumed that Prince will be more assertive off the bench, or that his passiveness is more palatable coming from a bench player?

If its the former, I don't get why that's assumed (Why would simply moving him to the bench make him more agressive?). If its the latter, I suppose that's true (as you expect less from a bench player) but the issue (IMO) isn't finding a way to accept Tay for what he is, but discussing a situation or way of playing that gets improvement out of Tay.

I think bringing him off the bench (if we had another acceptable starting SF option) could help increase his agressiveness some. It's possible that he is intimidated playing with the starting 5, and would feel more comfortable asserting himself offensively if he was playing with a combination of Hunter/Delfino/Dice/Evans and maybe one starter.

Of course, this is just theory, we have no way of knowing for sure.

And of course you don't pay $10M to a seventh man...

Which is why I agreed with Taymelo that he is overpaid.

If we start letting a player's salary dictate his role on the team, we're in big trouble (see Harrington, Joey).

Isn't he playing the most minutes per game on the team? Wouldn't that imply that he plays a good number of minutes with plenty of back-ups on the floor?

Even if that's not true, if you restrict his play to when most of the starters are not on the floor then you either aren't going to play him much at all, or you are going to have to start playing the other 4 guys a lot less. Neither sounds like a good answer to me.

I think I am unclear on something. Is it assumed that Prince will be more assertive off the bench, or that his passiveness is more palatable coming from a bench player?


Tayshaun is a guy that needs motivation. Last year, he had the contract. This year, he has nothing. The team is playing well, he has that contract locked up, and a coach that won't ride him if he's sucking. Maybe if you take him out of the starting lineup it will give him a little reality check. Give him something to work for. Make him earn that starting spot again. Because he clearly hasn't earned it this year.

apparently I have to re-post this a third time:


Here are his career numbers:

YR FG% 3P% FT% STL BLK TO PF OFF DEF TOT AST PTS
03-04 .467 .363 .766 0.8 0.8 1.5 1.8 1.1 3.6 4.7 2.3 10.3
04-05 .487 .341 .807 0.7 0.9 1.6 2.0 1.6 3.7 5.3 3.0 14.7
05-06 .449 .364 .770 0.5 0.4 1.2 1.3 1.3 3.1 4.4 2.3 14.1

So he is shooting slightly worse, but better from 3 point range...has a half steal, block, and assist less a game, a rebound less a game and a half point less a game.

Time to panic!

BTW, here are his pre and post all star numbers last year:

------------ FG% 3P% FT% STL BLK TO PF OFF DEF TOT AST PTS
Pre All-Star 48.704 .359 77.778 0.69 1.00 1.7 2.2 1.5 3.8 5.3 3.0 13.1
Post All-Star 48.700 .317 83.846 0.68 0.65 1.6 1.6 1.8 3.5 5.3 3.0 17.4

As you can see, he's having a better season this year than last year at this time.

According to your numbers, he is supposed to get better as the season progresses. But the numbers that I have say otherwise:


Before people start pointing out his Pre/Post All-Star numbers, I want to point out something else:

November: 49% FG
December: 43% FG
January: 41% FG
February: 39% FG

That doesn't look like somebody who is about to increase his numbers.

Tayshaun Prince sucks (right now).

My only hope for Tayshaun is that he doesn't destroy his value before this off-season, where maybe we can use his bloated contract and reputation, along with the 2oo7 Orlando pick, our own first rounder and McDyess and land a certain somebody from Minnesota...

My only hope for Tayshaun is that he doesn't destroy his value before this off-season, where maybe we can use his bloated contract and reputation, along with the 2oo7 Orlando pick, our own first rounder and McDyess and land a certain somebody from Minnesota...
LOL@trade for Tayshan theories. So thats the plan. With no Darko gang up on Tay.

Yeah, becuase he's produced so much on the court. His numbers are off the charts and his defense has been tops in the NBA. Give me a fucking break Gutz, he's an average basketball player who will drop 20 once or twice a month. He's playing like a bitch the last two months.

Yeah, becuase he's produced so much on the court. His numbers are off the charts and his defense has been tops in the NBA. Give me a fucking break Gutz, he's an average basketball player who will drop 20 once or twice a month. He's playing like a bitch the last two months.
LOL...So in your mind its legitimate to set up trade ideas? Even if we win the title which is more likely than us not since we are effectively playing more bench players than last year, and will atleast lock up home court throughout the eastern conference playoffs.

Average? You're full of shit on that one. 6ft 9in defender who can ball handle, post up, nail 3 pointers is average dime a dozen huh? You are sipping on a very half empty way of thinking. But nevermind. Tay is in a slump and the sky is falling with no darko to badger. OH NO!!!!! [smilie=arrgh.jpg]

since he's so average, name 10 str8 up SF's that provide his defense and offense top to bottom if not more for substantially less..

In all honesty his numbers would've been even lower last year if LB hadn't addressed his lack of ability to get into games when everyone else is scoring. this wasnt a secret problem, nor was it something nobody knew about. As far as i'm concerned he has improved his overall game. but if you dont get him involved early on offense he has the potential to be less effective and differ. Tay is not a hard puzzle to figure out. LB left instructions on getting the most out of him. Flip's gotta follow through.

Is he overpaid? yep. arent all our starters primed to be overpaid? yep. this isnt new news either. its the price you pay to keep your core. jack mcklosky didnt want to pay it and we fell into oblivion. I think Joe D did the right thing if he was serious about keeping his core. Somebody else would've easily gave tay the money Joe d did if not more. the bench is gonna be a chess match every year with less money to work with. thats the price of our sucess.

I can't believe I agree with Gutz. Wow. First time for everything I guess.

I'm really starting to think more and more about Jim Jackson.

I like Delfino, don't get me wrong, but it would help to have an experienced player back there for the playoff run, especially if Delfino continues to stay in this recent slump that he's in.

We could waive Alex Acker. The kid is a FA after this season. He will be a restricted free agent, but I doubt he'd want to stay in Detroit and I think Joe would respect that. He probably generated interest last summer league and I'm sure there is a young team that would like to take a look at him. But Alex, obviously, will give us nothing the rest of this year, so we should consider taking advantage of that roster spot.

I'm really starting to think more and more about Jim Jackson.

I like Delfino, don't get me wrong, but it would help to have an experienced player back there for the playoff run, especially if Delfino continues to stay in this recent slump that he's in.

We could waive Alex Acker. The kid is a FA after this season. He will be a restricted free agent, but I doubt he'd want to stay in Detroit and I think Joe would respect that. He probably generated interest last summer league and I'm sure there is a young team that would like to take a look at him. But Alex, obviously, will give us nothing the rest of this year, so we should consider taking advantage of that roster spot.
So he wouldnt want to take a shot for the backup PG spot which will be wide open next year with hunter seeing the end very soon, and delk being a rent PG who honestly is more of a SG?

Skelly that doesnt make sense. Acker "wanting" to leave seems unlikely as far as i see. He probally has his best shot here in an offense that will encourage him to shoot, which is his strong suit. As far as Delfino is concerned. The slump on offense is nothing major as long as his defense holds up and he doesnt lose his courage to shoot regardless. I'd prefer to see him drive more. But the last thing i am is worried. But of course i havent inhaled the aroma of the "Tayshan sucks and the sky is falling" koolaid. [smilie=2thumbsup.g:

Acker, just like any young player, wants to play. If he truly had the inside shot at being the backup point guard next year, he would stay. But I don't think that's the case. He has been a 2 guard his whole career, and I think that's where he's going to find his role in the NBA. I think Joe will bring in a veteran over the offseason. He has $3 million to spare. A guy like Bobby Jackson would be available.

So he wouldnt want to take a shot for the backup PG spot which will be wide open next year with hunter seeing the end very soon, and delk being a rent PG who honestly is more of a SG?

Skelly that doesnt make sense. Acker "wanting" to leave seems unlikely as far as i see. He probally has his best shot here in an offense that will encourage him to shoot, which is his strong suit. As far as Delfino is concerned. The slump on offense is nothing major as long as his defense holds up and he doesnt lose his courage to shoot regardless. I'd prefer to see him drive more. But the last thing i am is worried. But of course i havent inhaled the aroma of the "Tayshan sucks and the sky is falling" koolaid. [smilie=2thumbsup.g:

Acker wouldn't help us much this year. And I think that's why SKelly said we cut him to open up a roster spot.

And secondly, he has been in a slump the entire fucking season and hasn't shown any signs that he is going to improve. So I don't get why you would think its nothing major. And his defense has been average at best.

And his defense has been average at best.

Bullshit. Delfino's the best one on one defender on the team. I also dont agree that he has been slumping all season overall. He's actually gotten better. Unless we are only rating his ability to hit 3 pointers. [smilie=arnold.gif]

And his defense has been average at best.

Bullshit. Delfino's the best one on one defender on the team. I also dont agree that he has been slumping all season overall. He's actually gotten better. Unless we are only rating his ability to hit 3 pointers. [smilie=arnold.gif]

So are you saying that his defense has been below average or better than average?

And how did you come to the conlusion that he is getting better? The way I see it, his numbers have been been either going down (points, rebounds and shooting %s) or staying the same (assists, fouls, TOs). That's not getting better.

what do you want? more scoring (starters already score enough)? better defense (!)? more rebounding (at the cost of our transition game)?

just dont see where the problem is.

is he overpaid? not in my opinion. based on what the swingplayers got this summer, i'll take tay and his contract in a heart beat.

lambo also mentioned in the game that before tay's first substitution, he had held carmelo to 1 of 11 shooting. that more than makes up for rebounding.

lambo also mentioned in the game that before tay's first substitution, he had held carmelo to 1 of 11 shooting. that more than makes up for rebounding.
People are taking that for granted these days i guess.

And his defense has been average at best.

Bullshit. Delfino's the best one on one defender on the team. I also dont agree that he has been slumping all season overall. He's actually gotten better. Unless we are only rating his ability to hit 3 pointers. [smilie=arnold.gif]

So are you saying that his defense has been below average or better than average?

And how did you come to the conlusion that he is getting better? The way I see it, his numbers have been been either going down (points, rebounds and shooting %s) or staying the same (assists, fouls, TOs). That's not getting better.
You and your calculator. [smilie=annoyed.gif]
How many of those shots are 3 pointers? hmmm has been rebounding better than Tay? [smilie=angel.gif]

Either way whast i was referring to was the fact that he's driving a lil more and starting to play more aggressively. Maybe im crazy for thinking so but i see his numbers improving if he keeps increasing his aggressiveness.

We could waive Alex Acker. The kid is a FA after this season. He will be a restricted free agent, but I doubt he'd want to stay in Detroit and I think Joe would respect that. He probably generated interest last summer league and I'm sure there is a young team that would like to take a look at him. But Alex, obviously, will give us nothing the rest of this year, so we should consider taking advantage of that roster spot.

Actually we have a team option on both Amir and Acker. I know hoops hype doesn't say it, but they're wrong. http://www.realgm.com/src_freeagents/2007/

They'll be restricted FA's in 2007.

And I agree that Tayshaun needs his minutes cut or something. He needs something to motivate him to pick up his game. Right now we're winning despite him instead of because of him last year. He's not scoring or rebounding, and even his defense is a touch slower than before. He just looks like he's dragging out there. Might as well throw Delfino in there for 20 minutes per game or so to get him some experience so that he can be relied on in the playoffs. 5 minutes here and 10 minutes there isn't going to do that.

And Dale needs to play EVERY game for at least 5-8 minutes....

You and your calculator. [smilie=annoyed.gif]
How many of those shots are 3 pointers? hmmm has been rebounding better than Tay? [smilie=angel.gif]

I don't understand that statement at all. You are gonna have to explain that to me one more time.


Either way whast i was referring to was the fact that he's driving a lil more and starting to play more aggressively. Maybe im crazy for thinking so but i see his numbers improving if he keeps increasing his aggressiveness.

He is not driving the lane. All he does is fucking stand around by the 3pt line and watch his teammates do their thing.

I agree that his numbers would improve if he is aggressive but that hasn't been the case all season and I don't see any reason why it would be different now.

Didn't Tay have an ephphany last year when he realized that if he made his guard work harder defending him, he'd have an easier time defending him sorta deal.

I hold out certain hope that just like Rasheed is chucking threes to stay healthy, Tay is staying clear of the scrums for rebounds and not attacking the backet to stay healthy as possible. And come play-off time, along with an expanded playbook, our guys will step up and take it to a whole other level. Sheed will be camped out in the low post and Tay will be attacking the basket for alley-oops and such.

Here's the latest edition of PISTONS CORNER: With Krista Latham


PISTONS CORNER: Scoring woes don't worry Prince -- yet

BY KRISTA LATHAM
FREE PRESS SPORTS WRITER

March 3, 2006

SEATTLE -- If the Pistons weren't winning so often, maybe he'd be concerned.

Although forward Tayshaun Prince admits he is in a bit of a scoring slump -- he has averaged 9.3 points a game since the All-Star break -- he's not letting it bother him.

He laughs when recounting a conversation he had with coach Flip Saunders during Monday's game.

"In the fourth quarter in Cleveland, I got a couple of offensive rebounds," Prince said, "and we came to the bench for a time-out, and Flip said, 'I'm going to tell you one reason you're in the game, and it's not because of your offense.' "

Several factors play into Prince's sudden drop in offensive production. Saunders wanted Prince to concentrate on defense and stopping LeBron James in this week's back-to-back games against Cleveland. Same story versus Carmelo Anthony in Denver on Wednesday.

Prince said he needs to take more shots early in a game to establish his rhythm. "I haven't been getting up a consistent amount of shots to get in a comfort zone," he said. "I take a shot every here and now. And I think droughts happen that way."

Prince went 3-for-12 and scored eight points in the loss to Denver. He said he felt like he had good looks but didn't knock them down. His real concern, though, was with the team's defense: The Pistons gave up 25 dunks to the Nuggets, including 10 lobs.

"They kept doing the same similar things throughout the whole game," he said. "More than our offense, that killed us."

But frustrated? No, that's not a word Prince would use quite yet. "If I stay in a drought the rest of the season, and we keep winning," Prince said, "I'm not going to say nothing."

Tayshaun Prince, entering his new contract, will be one of the most overpaid players in the league. You don't pay anyone who puts up 15/5/3 ten mil a year. He's making close to AK47 money, which is crazy. But I really can't hate on Joe D that much because he figured Tay would *really* breakout this year.

I was never really sold on Tayshaun being a starter. I think he would make a great super sixth man like Gifloppili was, and Stackhouse is now. He's always had the mentality of a bench player(a lot like Mo). Passive......floating on the perimeter.........watching the game like he bought a ticket........with popcorn and all the fixins........

And why are people complaining about his asst and rebounds? He's just fine when it comes to those categories. Rasheed, Ben, and Dice are all better rebounders than him, not to mention he guards perimeter players. He's not going to get a lot of opportunities. Assists aren't no biggie either because the offense revolves around Billups, Hunter, and Arroyo(RIP) running the offense.

All I want from Tayshaun is to put the ball in the basket and play more consistent defense.


and gain five pounds

he needs to be more aggressive in attacking the basket, period. It maddens me to no end that neither Tay or Flip says this at all in any of their comments. I've never heard Flip ever talk about post scoring or rebounding.

Here's the latest edition of PISTONS CORNER: With Krista Latham


PISTONS CORNER: Scoring woes don't worry Prince -- yet

BY KRISTA LATHAM
FREE PRESS SPORTS WRITER

March 3, 2006

SEATTLE -- If the Pistons weren't winning so often, maybe he'd be concerned.

Although forward Tayshaun Prince admits he is in a bit of a scoring slump -- he has averaged 9.3 points a game since the All-Star break -- he's not letting it bother him.

He laughs when recounting a conversation he had with coach Flip Saunders during Monday's game.

"In the fourth quarter in Cleveland, I got a couple of offensive rebounds," Prince said, "and we came to the bench for a time-out, and Flip said, 'I'm going to tell you one reason you're in the game, and it's not because of your offense.' "

Several factors play into Prince's sudden drop in offensive production. Saunders wanted Prince to concentrate on defense and stopping LeBron James in this week's back-to-back games against Cleveland. Same story versus Carmelo Anthony in Denver on Wednesday.

Prince said he needs to take more shots early in a game to establish his rhythm. "I haven't been getting up a consistent amount of shots to get in a comfort zone," he said. "I take a shot every here and now. ~ WTF? Did he bust one in her eye or something? "In your face Spartan!" And I think droughts happen that way."

Prince went 3-for-12 and scored eight points in the loss to Denver. He said he felt like he had good looks but didn't knock them down. His real concern, though, was with the team's defense: The Pistons gave up 25 dunks to the Nuggets, including 10 lobs.

"They kept doing the same similar things throughout the whole game," he said. "More than our offense, that killed us."

But frustrated? No, that's not a word Prince would use quite yet. "If I stay in a drought the rest of the season, and we keep winning," Prince said, "I'm not going to say nothing."

Dat bitch is a cold stunna. Also, Tay needs to work on his cliche's

he needs to be more aggressive in attacking the basket, period. It maddens me to no end that neither Tay or Flip says this at all in any of their comments. I've never heard Flip ever talk about post scoring or rebounding.

Our post scoring has never been that great to begin with, so what's the point of discussing post play? We really don't have any post scorers outside of Sheed, but he's always been a camper. Our best pure post player in the last five years was Corliss. Heh.

Another great performance by Tayshaun Prince:

41 Minutes
11 Points
1 Rebound
2 Assists
2 Blocks
1 Foul
1 TO

And why are people complaining about his asst and rebounds? He's just fine when it comes to those categories. Rasheed, Ben, and Dice are all better rebounders than him, not to mention he guards perimeter players. He's not going to get a lot of opportunities. Assists aren't no biggie either because the offense revolves around Billups, Hunter, and Arroyo(RIP) running the offense.

All I want from Tayshaun is to put the ball in the basket and play more consistent defense.


and gain five pounds

Because we are the fifth worst defensive rebounding team in the League?

Once again the Pistons get HAMMERED on the boards, and once again Tay plays over 40 minutes and ends up with 1 stinking rebound.

And for whoever it was that said he's a perimeter player and shouldn't get a lot of rebounds - I give you Richard Hamilton, who is a couple inches shorter, with a MUCH shorter wingspan, is also a perimeter player, and DOUBLED Tay's rebounding effort, with a whopping two rebounds.

Oh, and 11 points = 3 points off his 14 point average of last year - you know, the 14 point average he was going to "blossom" into even more this year?

apparently I have to re-post this a third time:


Here are his career numbers:

YR FG% 3P% FT% STL BLK TO PF OFF DEF TOT AST PTS
03-04 .467 .363 .766 0.8 0.8 1.5 1.8 1.1 3.6 4.7 2.3 10.3
04-05 .487 .341 .807 0.7 0.9 1.6 2.0 1.6 3.7 5.3 3.0 14.7
05-06 .449 .364 .770 0.5 0.4 1.2 1.3 1.3 3.1 4.4 2.3 14.1

So he is shooting slightly worse, but better from 3 point range...has a half steal, block, and assist less a game, a rebound less a game and a half point less a game.

Time to panic!

BTW, here are his pre and post all star numbers last year:

------------ FG% 3P% FT% STL BLK TO PF OFF DEF TOT AST PTS
Pre All-Star 48.704 .359 77.778 0.69 1.00 1.7 2.2 1.5 3.8 5.3 3.0 13.1
Post All-Star 48.700 .317 83.846 0.68 0.65 1.6 1.6 1.8 3.5 5.3 3.0 17.4

As you can see, he's having a better season this year than last year at this time.

BUMP

LOL@Taymelo

while i usually agree with chris, i cant believe that me, gutz, and mikey all agreed on the same topic. damn.

btw, nice call board (sarcasm). kind of gave up on tay at the wrong time, i'd say.

although, perhaps this thread just shows how much we're all overreacting afer game 1, and how many great threads will be able to look back on in june and laugh at after we win the championship.

People at this board overreacting? No way.

People at this board overreacting? No way.

OHMYGODIAMNOTOVERREACTINGYOUSONOFABITCHHOWCANYOUSA YTHATYOUDONTEVENKNOWMEWHERESMYPROZAC!!!!*chomp*cho mp*chomp*Ifeelsooooooooomuchbetternowbutimnotovere acting.

Tay really stunk up the court last night... totally sucky performance. He only got 24 points and 11 rebounds on 50% shooting. He actually -missed- a couple free throws too. It was just totally fucking pathetic. This thread very CLEARLY deserves to be revisited! It's going to be decades before Tayshaun Blossoms.

<laughs>

Tay's playing the best ball of his career right now.

New playoff career high last night (where's BigggChris?)

We might be wearing those fishing hats right now if Tay hadn't stepped up his game.

The best part is, that he has been consistent for a change.

Tayshaun's my favorite player in the NBA...if I didn't know you guys were a bunch of overreactors I would have gone off on this thread. I just ignore ya'll most of the time though :D

All the Tay Haters are a bunch of Suffering Sucka-Tashes.
http://www.blackwolf-images.com/images/wbg/loon/sylv_sq.jpg

Can we please swat this shit into deep cyberspace?