http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2339941


LOL@Isiah and the Knicks.


Sources: Francis dealt to Knicks for Penny, Ariza
By Chris Sheridan
ESPN Insider
click this

Steve Francis is headed to New York under a deal agreed to Wednesday by the Knicks and the Orlando Magic.

Steve Francis
Francis

The teams agreed to a trade of Francis for Penny Hardaway and Trevor Ariza, two league sources with knowledge of the deal told ESPN.com.

The trade was expected to be announced later Wednesday afternoon after being called in to the league office.

In New York, Francis will be paired with Stephon Marbury as the highest-paid backcourt duo in the NBA.

Trevor Ariza
Ariza

Penny Hardaway
Hardaway

The Knicks were still talking with several other clubs as team president Isiah Thomas worked at remaking a roster that has stumbled to the league's second-worst record, 15-37.

For the Magic, the trade will provide salary cap relief to a franchise that can now go further beneath the cap than any of the league's 30 teams in the summer of 2007 when a bumper crop of free agents will be on the market, giving Orlando several options in figuring out how to rebuild around 20-year-old power forward Dwight Howard.

I split this out into it's own thread because it appears that it is not a rumor anymore.

I think we should roll with this format and give each trade it's own thread so we can discuss them in detail. Thoughts?

Maybe we'll also do an announcement thread that lists all of the deals once more of them start happening.

Oh god. They will probably fight off the bat of which guy will wear #3.

Edit: They is Stephon and Steve.

I think we should roll with this format and give each trade it's own thread so we can discuss them in detail.Cool...



LMFAO @ ISIAH!!!!

[smilie=hahaha.gif]

I wonder if this sets the stage for a Marbury deal?

There are only a few teams that would and could take on Steph, though.

Lakers? Back to the TWolves?

The Magic are set up for 2007. They get a defensive foward to play off Jameer and get rid of Francis and his insanely stupid deal. Even if Darko doesn't work out this trade more then makes up for that risk.

Lakers want Frye if they take on Marbury because they've been saving cap for the 'o7 crop as well and the Knicks would have to make it worth their while. Wolves in a Marco Jaric centered deal going the other way...

Just a thought reguarding our Orlando first rounder in 2007 - We might want to throw a couple of games to them next year, because they're going to suck terribly. It looks like they were so adement about the top five protection because they'll plan to tank bigtime. This way even if they are worst or second worst and three teams leapfrog into the top picks from behind them they still keep their pick.

Ariza's going to be HUGE for ORL.


Darko
Howard
Ariza
Stevenson
Arroyo


NM, nobody's going to be huge for them.

We should start an NIT though and have all the horrible teams play eachother.
A Magic/Hawks final would be fun to watch.

So much laughing at Isiah, how about some laughter towards Orlando?

Two years ago, Orlando starts with Tracy McGrady a top 10 player in the game and #1 pick in 2007.
What they have to show for those today are: Trevor Ariza, Doug Christie, Penny, Arroyo and Darko.

LMAO@ The Magic Organization

The best news here: replacing Francis with Ariza doesn't make them better right now.

For the time being their only PGs are Arroyo and Dooling (untill Jameer gets healthy). Yea... Good luck with that. Hopefully they don't score a great draft pick and Free Agent this offseason. We need them to TANK next year!!

So much laughing at Isiah, how about some laughter towards Orlando?

Two years ago, Orlando starts with Tracy McGrady a top 10 player in the game and #1 pick in 2007.
What they have to show for those today are: Trevor Ariza, Doug Christie, Penny, Arroyo and Darko.

LMAO@ The Magic Organization

these guys still play in the league??

Hedo is going to start over Ariza (who's contract ends this year) and Nelson starts over Arroyo (if he heals).


So much laughing at Isiah, how about some laughter towards Orlando?

Two years ago, Orlando starts with Tracy McGrady a top 10 player in the game and #1 pick in 2007.
What they have to show for those today are: Trevor Ariza, Doug Christie, Penny, Arroyo and Darko.

LMAO@ The Magic Organization

Cuz Tracy Mc-Back-Spams is really helping Houston get to the playoffs.

I think I'd take the 3 expiring deals Darko and Arroyo for him.

The question becomes who signs Ariza in the offseason and how much will he get after this season with Brown. Before this fresh crop of rookies in NY, Ariza was seen as the only future bright spot for the Knicks. I wouldn't mind seeing him back-up Prince, you know, if Flip actually played a bench.

So much laughing at Isiah, how about some laughter towards Orlando?

Two years ago, Orlando starts with Tracy McGrady a top 10 player in the game and #1 pick in 2007.
What they have to show for those today are: Trevor Ariza, Doug Christie, Penny, Arroyo and Darko.

LMAO@ The Magic Organization

Yeah, they went from Shaq, Penny and the finals era to the Hill, Tmac and almost TD era, to the Howard and scrubs era.

So much laughing at Isiah, how about some laughter towards Orlando?

Two years ago, Orlando starts with Tracy McGrady a top 10 player in the game and #1 pick in 2007.
What they have to show for those today are: Trevor Ariza, Doug Christie, Penny, Arroyo and Darko.

LMAO@ The Magic Organization

Yeah, they went from Shaq, Penny and the finals era to the Hill, Tmac and almost TD era, to the Howard and scrubs era.

just two more years of sucking and we get a great pick.

two more years!

two more years!

What is going on in the Big Apple right now? They are just grabbing players and hoping it works out.

I like this deal for Orlando. I don't like Crawford's or Taylor's contracts at all. It was time to move on. They got an expiring, the experiment didn't work with Steve.

so NY has Francis/Murbury/Crawford/Rose/Robinson as their guards




say what you want, but crawford and murbury and still commodities in this league, and they can get alot of talent for those guys


LMAO @ ORLANDO

so NY has Francis/Murbury/Crawford/Rose/Robinson as their guards




say what you want, but crawford and murbury and still commodities in this league, and they can get alot of talent for those guys


LMAO @ ORLANDOI'm mostly laughing at NY for getting rid of Ariza. I think they fucked up BAAAAAD.

Horrible trades for both teams.

How much salary did the Knicks pick up in this deal?

Look at their salaries now (ignore the formatting from inserting Francis in there):

http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/2310/knickspayroll6pq.jpg

They have 121 mil tied up in salaries next year for 12 players (all making more than the MLE). Their 12th man is making about the same money as our 6th man. When you factor in that Frye, Robinson and Lee are in the mix, you have a few inactive players making a lot of money for nothing. And that's not even including if they resign Curry. Even if they never signed another player they'd be over the cap until 2009.

I don't think they are done by any means, but they are all out of expiring deals to move, which means only one thing.

The youngin's are next.

They could probably package one or two of their young players in a deal that moves a bad contract or two, and they just might.

Didn't they re-sign Curry when they dealt for him??

Didn't they re-sign Curry when they dealt for him??

I was just about to say the same thing.

He signed for 6yrs/$60 million back in October.

Is this the "Holy Hell" Isiah was talking about?

[smilie=angryfire.g:


Oh...we got Sheed...nm.

[smilie=artist.gif]

Didn't they re-sign Curry when they dealt for him??

I forgot about that. I think he starts at 10 mil a season too. LMAO.

Increase those numbers by another 10 mil.

Isiah is trying to kill LB...

I feel bad for Isiah, but I think God he never got a position here in detroit. This is another case of having almost unlimited pockets, and becoming so lazy that you just trade for names, instead of chemistry and contribution.

i'd make this trade if i was zeke.

whats the point of letting a contract expire? at this point, thats not helping.

franchise was probably the best guy they could get (not like they gave back a ton. ariza? c'mon.)

are they fucked financially? were regardless.

It wouldn't be a bad trade if Franchise was going to a situation where he could re-establish his worth to the point where he's be a trade commodity(contract and all) to other teams. NYK isn't such a situation - it's friggin pandemonium.

are you kidding me? Marbury and Francis together in one backcourt with 1 ball? this is insane!

watch the Knicks live press con at nba.com NOW ! [smilie=2thumbsup.g:

are you kidding me? Marbury and Francis together in one backcourt with 1 ball? this is insane!

watch the Knicks live press con at nba.com NOW ! [smilie=2thumbsup.g:

They still have Crawford, Robinson, Rose and Richardson.

The Magic also waived Bo Outlaw to create the roster spot they needed for this trade.

http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/wireStory?id=1650323

The best thing at this point for the Knicks is for the team to disband and start all over again. I can't believe what an idiot Zeke is. His team sucks and always will. They need to bite the bullet and rebuild......and I mean rebuild. Get rid of all of the bloated contracts, get under the salary cap and go from there. Don't bring in more bad contracts [smilie=404.gif] Moron! New York is a very coveted place to play but they can never go after the big free agents because of their cap mess. Fix it!

Just think of what the team would be like if they hadn't got Crawford, Curry, Francis, Mo Taylor, Malik Rose. They'd still suck but with a few tweaks they could actually have been under the salary cap. [smilie=arrgh.jpg]

nyk needs to be have a situation where they can bow out of the nba for a year, come back with a clean slate and no isiah. Since thats never going to happen, I'd say they are financially fucked for about.. the next 4 years?

I think that the Knicks are beyond rebuilding for cap room.

They have 2 assets: Location, and expiring contracts.

The expiring contracts have little to no value to them, so should be turned into picks, and people who want to play in NYC.

Turn Houston, Anderson, Rose, and Taylor into 1-2 FA's, and a couple firsts.

Trade Francis, Marbury, Q, and Crawford into whatever you can get.

This allows you to build with youth and take more advantage of the giant payroll, rather than wasting it on scrubs.

What is going on in the Big Apple right now? They are just grabbing players and hoping it works out.

I like this deal for Orlando. I don't like Crawford's or Taylor's contracts at all. It was time to move on. They got an expiring, the experiment didn't work with Steve.

I think we can come to the consensus that Orlando wasn't gonna win anytime soon. This just accelerates the curve.

http://atifonline.net/pistons/images/slr.jpg

I like this deal for both teams.

New York gets the guy they want. Yes, they have an overpaid, undersized backcourt, but Knicks fans and management seem to love this deal. Not sure how many wins they get tho.

Orlando forms a decent young core to build around. They clear a lot of salary this summer. And, when Grant Hill expires(next summer), they will have a lot of cap room to spend on quality free agents.

Nelson(Good young PG)
Stevenson(above average defender)
Ariza(not completely sold on him)
Howard(Future Superstar)
Darko(I still think he's a bust.)

Awwwwww cheer up Larry
http://espn-att.starwave.com/media/nba/2006/0222/photo/a_francis_412.jpg[/img]

I bet LB loved Detroit's trade a helluva lot more - Milicic and Arroyo out of town.

http://atifonline.net/pistons/images/slr.jpg

The look on LB's face = priceless

And WTF is this talk about Orlando having cap space this off-season.

Has anyone checked that shit? I can't do it at the moment but would appreciate it if someone did it (like I did the Toronto thing)

I believe they will be right around the cap after drafting a guy in the Top 5, re-signing Tony Battie (apparently they want him back) and after retaining Ariza.

Hoopshype doesn't have Garrity listed beyond this season but he isn't a free agent until 2007 according to patricia's site.

I think reports of Orlando's cap space are bullshit.

Everything that I have seen details that they'll have a bunch of cap space after next season, once Hill's contract is off the books.

They could have a lot of money to spend then, if they play their cards right.

If they were smart they'd deal Hill this coming off-season for a capable young player and a contract that expires in the 2007 off-season.

That way they still get cap space, but added a young talent in the deal.

Same goes with Garrity.

They should keep Battie around as the "veteran locker room presence" and could probably sign a veteran guard for the same purpose.

Then fill the team full of young guys hungry for a shot at playing time.

Hang on - haven't we been here before?

WTF? Ever since Shaq left they've gone around in one big fucking circle.

What a shitty franchise.

I've had a lot of laughs at the Knicks and Isiah's expense, but I wonder if everyone would still be laughing if they are able to land KG this summer?

If I'm Isiah (shudder), I'd call Minny and tell them that they can have any combination of players on my team that they want to make a KG deal work.

Unlike most teams, even after the deal, NY would still have a pretty solid cast of talent to surround KG. Most teams would be completely gutted just to get the salaries to match KG's, but could this be the method behind Zeke's madness?

They could still use the MLE to add another piece too.

Just thinking out loud here.

Oh God.... Isiah Thomas is killing me. His moves makes the Knicks board look intelligent. If he's honestly banking so much on the small chance that KG would want to play on a WORSE team than the one he's currently on, I have nothing else to say.

The Knicks will later advocate for playing the game with two balls in response to their new backcourt.

Whoops. Looks like I am not the first one to think this could happen (KG to NYK). There are multiple articles about this today.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/ny-spktrade234638131feb23,0,7073229.story?coll=sfla-sports-front


But executives and personnel experts around the league questioned the odd coupling, said Brown was not in favor and suggested yesterday's deal was part of a risky long-term strategy by Thomas to trade for superstar Minnesota forward Kevin Garnett this summer.

One NBA general manager said Thomas sold Knicks owner James Dolan on a strategy to stockpile as many marketable assets as possible to make a play for Garnett, who has grown increasingly restless with the Timberwolves, who now might be ready to consider trading him.

Brown is said to have favored trading Hardaway's contract to Portland for center Theo Ratliff and small forward Darius Miles to fill the Knicks' need for more defense, rebounding and shot-blocking. But Thomas gambled on Francis, a strategy that could blow up in his face if Minnesota refuses to trade Garnett.

"Isiah has put a lot of talented players on their roster, but it remains to be seen if they fit together," the NBA GM said. "Chemistry is important. The Knicks have a lot of firepower, but Larry likes to play defense. Francis doesn't seem like his type. Larry wants hard-nosed players."

Francis was on the inactive list last night, but when he joins the lineup, the Knicks will have three maximum-salary starters in Marbury, Francis and small forward Jalen Rose, and all three like to have the ball in their hands. But Francis, who is averaging 16.3 points, 5.7 rebounds and 4.8 assists, all career lows, said it doesn't matter which one brings the ball upcourt.

"Things will work themselves out," Francis insisted. "We're not looking to compete against each other . . . We can complement each other."

Thomas pointed to Francis' career average of 6.0 rebounds per game as evidence of his defensive prowess. Brown, who has faulted his team's ability to guard on the perimeter, said Marbury's biggest improvement this season has come on defense, and Francis has the physical and mental tools to succeed.

"I think Steve is strong enough to guard [shooting guards] and quick enough to guard [point guards]," Brown said. "And he's got grit. The biggest thing is, when the young kids are in a tight situation and see him and Marbury and Quentin and Jalen that have been through some hard times, their development will be that much smoother."

If nothing else, Brown's comment demonstrated he does have an optimistic side. But Marbury is 0-for-4 in playoff series, and Francis is 0-for-1 in six seasons. At that rate, it's unlikely their jerseys will hang in the Garden rafters next to Frazier, Monroe and Barnett.

"Those guys were big-time winners," the NBA GM said of the Knicks' legends. "These guys are not winners. They have a lot to prove."

At first blush, the Marbury-Francis marriage seems like one of those celebrity couplings doomed to failure from the start. If the inevitable bust-up helps put Garnett in a Knicks uniform, maybe it will be worth it.

They don't even have any draft picks to trade or improve with.

My Chicago fan friends were telling me that they had NYK's first rounders for 06 and 07 from the Curry deal and I immediately called them liars and idiots. My thought process? Not even Isaiah's that dumb. Seriously, noone's that dumb.

It's true. I couldn't believe it. Those are going to be 2 top 5 picks. They could theoretically get Rudy Gay and Greg Oden for an Eddy Curry that they didn't even want in the first place. Absurd.

(And yes, I know you can't trade consecutive years' picks but the 07 pick would be a swap for Chicago's own pick to make it legal under the cba.)

The Knicks have the Spurs and Denver's first rd pick this year. So yes, they do have picks.