LOL@Isiah and the Knicks [Archive]

Glenn

01-06-2006, 02:37 PM

More on this...

As soon as the ESPN/TNT honks start hammering this stuff home, you can expect that Isiah will get the boots and LB will be taking over total control.

This article mentions 3 picks, but everything else I have seen says there were 4.

http://www.suntimes.com/output/bulls/cst-spt-knix06.html

Bulls may have won lottery in Knicks deal

January 6, 2006

When Eddy Curry and Antonio Davis were shipped to the New York Knicks in early October, the Bulls' initial focus centered on the players they got in return, Michael Sweetney and Tim Thomas.

But the most valuable asset the Bulls received in the deal might be one of the three draft picks that were mostly overlooked at the time.

As part of the deal, the Bulls get the Knicks' first-round pick this summer, and it almost certainly will be a lottery pick -- and possibly a top-three selection if the Knicks keep losing at their current pace. At 8-21, they have the second-worst record in the NBA and are only a game ahead of the Atlanta Hawks (7-22).

The Bulls could keep the pick and select a player or perhaps package it with their own first-round pick or a player in a trade for a big name.

"We have to keep accumulating assets, good players, and try to find a way to make a deal that gets us a really good player, or where we become a team that's highly competitive because we have a lot of really good talent,'' Bulls operations chief John Paxson said.

Although it's too early to determine which players will enter the NBA draft and where they will be taken, one Eastern Conference scout predicted: "There will be a lot of good players in the draft, but there's not a lot of size among the American players. The best of the big men probably will be LaMarcus Aldridge of Texas.''

Aldridge, a 6-11 sophomore from Dallas, is projected as a power forward and has impressed with his athletic ability. Other potential high picks are 6-8 sophomore forward Rudy Gay of Connecticut; 6-8 junior forward Adam Morrison of Gonzaga; 6-9 senior forward Shelden Williams of Duke; 6-10 junior forward Josh Boone of Connecticut; 6-7 senior forward Rodney Carney of Memphis; and Rudy Fernandez, a 6-6 shooting guard from Spain.

Most of the top big men in the draft figure to be foreign-born, including 6-11 Andrea Bargnani of Italy and 6-11 Tiago Splitter of Brazil.

John Jackson

Kilo

01-06-2006, 02:41 PM

Paul Pierce and whatever else it takes is going to be traded for Adam Morrision on draft day. That's if Larry Bird doesn't have more to offer to get him to Indiana...

H1Man

01-06-2006, 02:45 PM

Don't forget the Bulls could still trade Tim Thomas for a piece that they can use. His contract is expiring, right?

Kilo

01-06-2006, 02:51 PM

Chicago is probably not going to make the play-offs themselves this year - our division is just too tough, and all the others are mediocre which will ead to a lot of .500 level teams. Chicago would end up with two top eight picks this year, and have tradeable young assets in Hinrich(if they ultimately choose Duhon) and Gordon to move up and snag two of the top three picks to add to Luol Deng and Chandler.

I predict Chicago uses the picks and their youngsters to get Kevin Garnett in the off-season.

Nobody made a big sting at the time because the NYK fans assumed that they'd be much improved under LB and that the picks would be 20th+...

Also we have too many announcements or stickied threads. The new threads get lost in the shuffle...

PistonsNation

01-06-2006, 11:11 PM

LOL@Isiah??? That's sacrelig! :evil:

LALLALALA I CaN't HeAr YoU....*&%^^(*^%

Glenn

01-18-2006, 05:00 PM

didn't want to start a new thread for this, but it looks like Marbury won't be playing when we meet the Knicks.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2295457

GREENBURGH, N.Y. -- New York Knicks guard Stephon Marbury, who hasn't missed a game due to injury in five years, is doubtful for Wednesday's game at Chicago because of a sprained left shoulder.

Marbury was hurt in the fourth quarter of Monday's loss to Minnesota. X-rays after the game revealed no fracture, but Marbury's arm was in a sling Tuesday and he did not practice.

Marbury also could miss Thursday's home game against Detroit. He has played in 280 consecutive games, the league's fifth-longest current streak, and hasn't missed a game since Oct. 30, 2002, when he was suspended by the NBA for the Phoenix Suns' season opener.

Artermis

01-19-2006, 09:08 AM

IT should have stuck to what he knows best....he looks pretty smiling.

Art

Fool

01-19-2006, 09:57 AM

And two weeks after this thread was started the Knicks are 4 games out of the #8 spot, freshly off a nice long winning streak and those "could be top 3 picks" look more like middle rounders (that could get worse if Larry's customary second half of the season turn around is taking place). No way the Bulls get Ogden with the Knicks pick in 08 and while I don't like Curry, I don't think IT is worried about losing guys he can't even start to develope for two years (thats just not the Knicks way). Sure, everyone in the league should take advantage of that (as the Bulls seem to have done) but its no surprise that the Knicks value commodities that can contribute today rather than potential half a decade down the road.

(Thomas, though I love him as a player, as a GM will always be Dumar's bitch. Just like MJ and Reggie, Thomas has and will continue to find out that the hardest guy to go up against in the NBA is Joe Dumars.)

H1Man

01-19-2006, 08:49 PM

Kilo

01-19-2006, 08:53 PM

01-19-2006, 08:57 PM

After seeing the TNT graphic on Zeke's draft record Kilo has the right idea when he gets the ax. Joe should Hire Zeke as a VP but all he is allowed to do is consult on drafting.

Zeke can't make trades but can draft. Joe can deal with the best of them but struggles on draft day. Together they make a killer front office.

Mikey

01-19-2006, 09:03 PM

01-19-2006, 09:15 PM

Matt

01-19-2006, 09:27 PM

i'm sorry, but i don't want Isiah anywhere near the Piston's front office. put Maxiell on the Knicks, let him play David Lee's minutes, and he'd be tearing it up.

Black Dynamite

01-19-2006, 09:31 PM

yea i agree. isiah looks so good with picks because he gets good ones all the time with the knicks record.. his 2nd round draft skillz arent better than Dumars IMO anyways and thats more important to me.

Black Dynamite

01-19-2006, 10:44 PM

damn@the onslaught of laughter at the knicks from the TNT crew.

01-19-2006, 10:59 PM

Black Dynamite

01-19-2006, 11:04 PM

Not to be a dick but you don't need second round skills if you get the first rd pick right.

It must be killing the NBA to see the Knicks get killed in the Garden. LMAO at the slurping of LB for the 6-0 streak to start 06, it means nothing in the context of a 13-25 record.
actually you do if you your team is a winner every year which we have for the past few years. late first round picks and early second arent really that different IMO.

So i'd take a good late first round/second round picker over a "supposed" good lottery picker. we hopefully wont need lottery skillz over the next few years. thats why picks like maxiell are big.

01-19-2006, 11:12 PM

I was referring more to the fact that Joe got firsts that we wouldn't have had from picking according to record and blew them. All I am saying is Joe blew two lottery picks. I am not calling Zeke a god or better executve but I do think he has better eye for young guys.

Joe can find gems in FA and has done well late in the draft but needs help if he gets another lottery gift.

With that said I am looking a gift horse in the mouth. We have been to the finals twice and on the way to a possiblel 3rd trip.

Black Dynamite

01-19-2006, 11:22 PM

I am not calling Zeke a god or better executve but I do think he has better eye for young guys. .
wow i totally disagree. but if your "lottery" picks do well, i guess that causes automatics equations. but outside of frye i dont think much of any of his picks. nate robinson was a stupid pick. an undersized scoring point guard isnt what you get to back up marbury.

ariza is overrated. i have always thought he was. his defense is lacking and he takes more plays off than anybody on that knicks squad. thus he's entering LB's dawg house quick. now who else has his keene eye picked in the crap shoot that is the lottery?

Okur, delfino, Prince, Maxiell, possibly amir johnson vs zeke's picks hold their own i think. ariza, frye, nate robinson, Lee arent keene eye picks to me.

but who knows.

01-19-2006, 11:47 PM

Camby, Mighty Mouse, T-Mac with Toronto in Indy he was consulted on the Fred Jones pick, James Jones 2nd rd which are comparable to Maxiell and the Johnson picks IMo.

Joe has had three lottery picks Darko, White and Cleaves and one is still in the NBA and it been only 5 years. Zeke has almost all of his still in the nBa and it's been 10 years since his first pick.

If there is one thing I have learned by debating you it is you hold firm so we can agree to disagree.

Black Dynamite

01-20-2006, 12:39 AM

once again all high picks. i just dont think it takes a whole lot of skill vs luck to pick solid lottery picks. also the indy players dont count outside of jamal tinsley.

and all those lottery picks still dont make up for his not so great picking as a knick head guy. and mighty mouse was a bust IMO(just saying is all).

i think joe d knows what type of players he wants to draft now. which is something he was up and down own earlier in his career as an exec. not to mention he's picking based on him already knowing his team is good.

now isiah has this supposed history of being experienced in great picks yet he hasn't shown much of it since taking over the knicks.

maybe im crazy in this thinking but the lottery crop is maybe at max 20 players to look at. possibly 5-8 if you are picking in the top 5. late first round and 2nd round requires you to look at and come up with back up plans of possibly 50 prospects maybe. IMO if you find talent there, then you have a better eye for it.

MOLA1

01-20-2006, 01:35 AM

NoQ and I laughed hysterically every time they showed Zeke.

Glenn

01-20-2006, 08:13 AM

Please keep the human tiki doll as far away from our organization as possible.

Pharaoh

01-20-2006, 08:16 AM

Rorschach wrote:

i just dont think it takes a whole lot of skill vs luck to pick solid lottery picks.

Well Joe must be really unlucky then.

Darko, Rodney White and Mateen Cleaves speak for themselves.

Camby, McGrady and Damon shit all over them and it's not even fucking close.

Don't forget Frye as well.

I will say that Joe is fine drafting in late so I don't see the need for Thomas as a consultant or anything like that.

Maybe if we got another Lottery pick Joe should give him a call, but otherwise keep Zeke away from the front office.

BTW, how can you include Maxiell and Amir as Joe's solid picks but ignore Nate Robinson, Lee, Frye and Ariza?

Maxiell is gonna be a solid pro but Amir is pure potential. He might be decent or he might be another bum.

At least Knick fans know Frye, Nate and Lee are all decent. They don't have to guess that one day in the future one of those 3 are gonna get minutes.

Ariza? Sure he's in the doghouse now but he's decent. If they expect him to start or log more than 10-15 minutes then that's their problem.

Glenn

01-20-2006, 08:18 AM

Maybe if we want another Lottery pick Joe should give him a call, but otherwise keep Zeke away from the front office.

Quote fixed.

Pharaoh

01-20-2006, 08:57 AM

He's got none to trade.

Can't believe the Bulls got 2 firsts, 2 seconds, Sweetney and Tim Thomas' massive expiring contract for Curry and Davis.

That's got to be the worst trade in the Knicks history

Kilo

01-20-2006, 11:55 AM

That trade made the Bulls the favorites to land KG this off-season. They can give up enough for a fair deal and still stay competitive. However they might have to make such a deal this season so Tim Thomas' deal can be included.

Something like Tim Thomas(expiring), Mike Sweetney, Kirk Hinrich and the Knicks first rounder 2006 and a future first rounder for Garnett sorta deal...

Bulls would still be -
Chris Duhon
Ben Gordon
Luol Deng
Tyson Chandler
Kevin Garnett

T'Wolves would look something like -
Hinrich/Jaric
McCants/Jaric
Szczerbiak
xxxxxxxxxx
Sweetney

With a top five pick in this years draft.

Moodini31

01-21-2006, 12:36 AM

Matt Millen>Isiah Thomas

At least Millen hasn't traded away future draft picks while we still suck. Well......not to the extent that Zeke has.

Also....I seriously wonder what's going through LB's mind when he sees the team he left having a chance to make history [smilie=bigshot.gif] and pounding his 13-25 team by 30 on their own floor. [smilie=rip.gif]

He's gotta feel like this..... [smilie=damn.gif] [smilie=banghead.gi:

I'm thankful for the championship and what he taught us about defense, but I'm so glad he's gone. Flip is flying under the radar, not looking for GM jobs and leading us to the best start in franchise history.

Screw LB. [smilie=faeuste_bal:

Glenn

01-25-2006, 09:05 AM

LOL@Isiah AGAIN

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2305164

Former Knicks executive sues Thomas, MSG

Associated Press

NEW YORK -- New York Knicks team president Isiah Thomas is accused of sexual harassment and discrimination by one of the team's former front-office employees in a federal lawsuit.

Anucha Browne Sanders claims Thomas made unwanted sexual advances toward her and refused to stop, according to the lawsuit filed Tuesday in federal court in Manhattan. Thomas and Madison Square Garden are listed as the defendants in the lawsuit, which charges them with sex discrimination and retaliation.

According to the lawsuit, the 43-year-old Browne Sanders sought assistance from her supervisor, Steve Mills, the president of Madison Square Garden Sports, but said Mills didn't do anything about the situation.

Browne Sanders, who had been with the team since 2000, claims she was fired as the Knicks' senior vice president of marketing and business operations last week as a result of her complaints.

The lawsuit also alleges that Thomas told Browne Sanders he was pushing for more home games at noon on Sundays. His plan, according to Browne Sanders, was to have opposing players go to certain clubs, including strip clubs, that Thomas had connections with on Saturday nights and get them drunk so they would be sluggish for the game the next day.

Ron Green, a lawyer for Madison Square Garden, told the New York Times that the lawsuit is "fabricated and outrageous." He said in a story for Wednesday's editions that Browne Sanders was fired "because of an inability to fulfill professional responsibilities," and said she is seeking "a financial windfall."

Lawyers for Thomas, Peter Parcher and Sue Ellen Eisenberg, called the lawsuit an attempt to make money and accused her of demanding $6 million upon her departure, more than 20 times her salary.

Browne Sanders said the problems began shortly after Thomas joined the Knicks in December 2003, and she repeatedly complained to management about his inappropriate behavior.

In court documents, Browne Sanders said Thomas often berated her, and made crude comments about her to Knicks officials, telling them not to listen to any of her directions. Point guard Stephon Marbury also is accused of acting in a hostile way toward her as a result.

Browne Sanders said Thomas' behavior soon became sexually charged, saying he told her he was "very attracted" to her and "in love" with her and tried to kiss her. She charges that last month, he hugged and tried to kiss her, and when she pulled away, he said, "What, I can't get any love from you today?"

Browne Sanders said she met with a human resources management consultant hired by MSG twice last year, and told the consultant about Thomas' conduct. After Browne Sanders sought legal counsel last November, MSG launched its own investigation but told her to not come to work for three weeks. She was fired last Thursday when MSG said her claims couldn't be substantiated.

Browne Sanders, the team's chief marketing officer, graduated from Northwestern as the Big Ten's women career scoring leader and was a two-time conference player of the year. She was the school's athlete of the decade for the 1980s.

According to the team's media guide, Browne Sanders is married with three children, and resides in New Jersey.

Fool

01-25-2006, 09:39 AM

The lawsuit also alleges that Thomas told Browne Sanders he was pushing for more home games at noon on Sundays. His plan, according to Browne Sanders, was to have opposing players go to certain clubs, including strip clubs, that Thomas had connections with on Saturday nights and get them drunk so they would be sluggish for the game the next day.

LMFAO! What kind of Lawrence Taylor type tactics is this? Sadly, I don't put it past Isiah.

I wonder if he offered to take her to Red Lobster.

Black Dynamite

01-25-2006, 09:54 AM

actually this tactic is used more often than you think. sports illustrated had an article on it awhile ago. supposedly atlanta execs used to do it with magic city strip club.

Fool

01-25-2006, 10:33 AM

If Atlanta uses it, then clearly it works.

(Good to know though Gutz, appreciated.)

Black Dynamite

01-25-2006, 11:38 AM

PistonsNation

01-25-2006, 12:00 PM

To me the charges seem outlandish. I don't think this is Isiah's character, but it's embarrasing regardless. Isiah is a powerful man and he's the perfect candidate for this type of thing. $$$

In this country it's too easy to accuse a male of sexual harrasment. You're assumed guilty unless you can somehow prove you didn't do it, which is back assward. Same goes with racism. Once you're branded there's nothing much you can do. There should be stiff penalties for those making these accustions when there found to be untrue.

Link (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2305164)

01-25-2006, 12:04 PM

Based on the Knicks current losing streak this lawsuit may be a blessing in disguise for Zeke. I doubt MSG would want to fire him on the heals of this lawsuit. It could be percieved they got rid of because of the lawsuit.

We all know that it would have to with record but a skilled lawyer would use his firing to the accusers advantage.

Gecko

01-25-2006, 12:04 PM

Most likely the public will never know the truth...expect a settlement.

Black Dynamite

01-25-2006, 12:04 PM

Glenn

01-25-2006, 12:07 PM

no need to swat this but can someone move it to its proper place in the LOL@Zeke thread.

merged, I'll temporarily add more detail to the title as well

Fool

01-25-2006, 12:10 PM

If Atlanta uses it, then clearly it works.

(Good to know though Gutz, appreciated.)
ummm i never said it works, just that its been common practice in sports for awhile. if it did work of course i wouldnt have said used to. odds are that the home team players spend more time in strip clubs that road teams as of late.

I never said you thought it worked Gutz, not every comment is directed soley at you.

PistonsNation

01-25-2006, 12:10 PM

Link (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2305164)[/quote]
no need to swat this but can someone move it to its proper place in the LOL@Zeke thread.[/quote]

Damn, that whole notion is sacrelig. Isiah is the reason this team has history. I just can't dog Isiah. Even if you try to seperate the player and the Knick GM, its' still the same guy. [smilie=angryfire.g:

Black Dynamite

01-25-2006, 12:15 PM

Damn, that whole notion is sacrelig. Isiah is the reason this team has history. I just can't dog Isiah. Even if you try to seperate the player and the Knick GM, its' still the same guy. [smilie=angryfire.g:
PN we love the guy for every thing he did as a piston and he's still my favorite player of all time. but as a gm he's laughable. i think he's a decent coach though.

Black Dynamite

01-25-2006, 12:16 PM

UncleCliffy

01-25-2006, 04:17 PM

ZEKE is Jesus.

Koolaid

01-25-2006, 07:34 PM

y'all should give credit where it's due. I don't think Isiah is doing anything in New York that's absurd. He did a great job at the draft and got three good players out of it.

Nobody could've possibly turned around New York. So the fact that they suck shouldn't catch anyone off guard.

UncleCliffy

01-25-2006, 10:49 PM

Just wanted to add that the Knicks lost again..

LOL@The Knicks

Glenn

01-26-2006, 08:51 AM

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2305164

Thomas defiant in face of harrassment claims

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Associated Press

NEW YORK -- Isiah Thomas reacted with indignation Wednesday over a former team executive's federal sexual harassment lawsuit, which accuses the New York Knicks president of unwanted advances, discrimination and "demeaning and repulsive behavior."

Thomas said he never harassed Anucha Browne Sanders, the Knicks' former senior vice president of marketing and business operations, nor did he discriminate against her or participate in her firing.

"She did not even work for me," he said, reading from a written statement at a news conference Wednesday. "I will not allow her or anybody, man or woman, to use me as a pawn for their financial gain."

Thomas said he spoke out despite his lawyers' advice to keep mum because "it is not their name, it's not their family, it's not their career and it's not their reputation that's being hurt."

Browne Sanders said she sued Thomas and Madison Square Garden "because I had no choice."

"My pleas and complaints about Mr. Thomas' illegal and offensive actions fell on deaf ears," she said Wednesday at a news conference at her lawyer's office. "He refused to stop his demeaning and repulsive behavior and the Garden refused to intercede."

The 43-year-old, a former Northwestern basketball star who described herself as the Knicks' second-highest ranking executive, is seeking reinstatement to her job and unspecified damages. She said she was fired last Thursday "for telling the truth" while going through internal channels to stop the harassment.

Thomas and Madison Square Garden are listed as the defendants in the lawsuit, which charges them with sex discrimination and retaliation. Madison Square Garden said she was fired because she "failed to fulfill professional responsibilities."

According to the lawsuit filed Tuesday in a Manhattan federal court, Thomas refused to stop making unwanted sexual advances toward her, used offensive language and turned others in the organization against her.

Browne Sanders said when she sought assistance from her supervisor, Steve Mills, the president of Madison Square Garden Sports, he did nothing.

"I am appalled by Anucha Browne Sanders' outrageous allegations," Mills said. "And I was stunned to learn that while she was still working for Madison Square Garden, she demanded $6.5 million to leave quietly."

Lawyers for Thomas called the lawsuit an attempt to make money and accused her of demanding $6 million upon her departure, more than 20 times her salary.

Asked about the suggestion that she had demanded the money, one of her lawyers, Kevin Mintzer said: "How do you put a price on Ms. Browne Sanders' career? She was the second-highest individual in the Knicks organizations, and one of the most senior African-American women in all of professional sports. I don't know how you put a price on that."

When Browne Sanders sought legal counsel last November, MSG launched its own investigation but told her to not come to work for three weeks. She was fired last Thursday when MSG said her claims couldn't be substantiated.

"They weren't sincerely interested in finding out what happened, they just wanted to punish her," Mintzer said.

He said a settlement is always a possibility, but if none is reached, depositions will begin with the intent to go to trial.

Players were quick to support Thomas at a Wednesday morning shootaround.

"I know Isiah and I know he's an honorable man," Stephon Marbury said. "I know that he's a guy filled with a lot of character, so I think everyone here is on his side."

The lawsuit also alleges that Thomas told Browne Sanders he was pushing for more Sunday home games at noon so he could steer opposing players to clubs where he had connections on Saturday nights, hoping they would be sluggish the next day.

"These fabricated and outrageous charges come from an individual whom MSG fired because of an inability to fulfill professional responsibilities and who is now seeking a financial windfall," Madison Square Garden attorney Ron Green said in a statement.

The Knicks would not comment further.

"I've known him since I tried to recruit him in high school and he's a phenomenal human being," coach Larry Brown said of Thomas. "And the Knicks have always treated me well, so I guess I'll let it play itself out."

Browne Sanders said the problems began shortly after Thomas joined the Knicks in December 2003. In court documents, Browne Sanders said Thomas often berated her and made crude comments about her to Knicks officials, telling them not to listen to any of her directions. Marbury also is accused of acting in a hostile way toward her as a result.

Browne Sanders said Thomas' behavior soon became sexually charged, saying he told her he was "very attracted" to her and "in love" with her and tried to kiss her. She charges that last month, he hugged and tried to kiss her, and when she pulled away, he said, "What, I can't get any love from you today?"

Browne Sanders graduated from Northwestern as the Big Ten's women's career scoring leader and was a two-time conference player of the year. She was the school's athlete of the decade for the 1980s.

According to the team's media guide, Browne Sanders is married with three children, and resides in New Jersey.

Glenn

01-26-2006, 08:53 AM

From the same article...

Statement from Anucha Browne Sanders

"I am a business woman who has held executive positions in corporate America for nearly 20 years. Working in professional sports has been my dream since I was a little girl growing up in Brooklyn. Getting hired by the Knicks in 2000 and being promoted to senior vice president of marketing and business operations was one of the highlights of my life. It has also been a source of great pride for me that I consistently did an excellent job and received superior performance evaluations as well as praise and promotion for my work. I am extremely proud that I rose to be the second highest-ranking executive in the Knicks and one of the highest ranking African American women in professional sports.

Pursuing this complaint was a very painful decision because I knew it meant I would not only say farewell to my dream job -- but that I would probably never be able to work again in professional basketball. Filing this complaint would mean an end to my cherished career.

I took this action because I had no choice. My pleas and complaints about Mr. Thomas' illegal and offensive behavior fell on deaf ears. He refused to stop his demeaning and repulsive behavior and the Garden refused to intercede. I am outraged that I was fired for telling the truth and I am outraged that they have destroyed what was a stellar sports career.

No woman, regardless of the industry she works in, should have to endure this kind of abuse on the job. Everyone has the right to expect that they will not be sexually harassed no matter where they work or who they work for.

I was warned that Mr. Thomas and the Garden would launch a campaign to smear me and I was not surprised nor will I be at any false and viscious accusations that many spread about me and my family. This is all a diversion. In court, they will have no choice but to deal with the real issues of my complaint."

UncleCliffy

01-26-2006, 09:08 AM

She looks like Big Momma. She is making the whole thing up just like 99% of all other sexual harassment cases.

Glenn

01-26-2006, 09:47 AM

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/story/386001p-327559c.html

Case for Isiah can't be made on the court

By Mitch Lawrence

Hard as it is to believe, now even Jim Dolan might think he has just cause to fire Isiah Thomas.

As Thomas has rebuilt the Knicks into a train wreck, complete with a payroll exceeding $120 million, Dolan has done more than stand by his team president. He continues to believe that Thomas could take a stroll on the Hudson.

But now with a former team senior VP, Anucha Browne Sanders, leveling explosive charges that Thomas sexually harassed her and discriminated against her because she is a woman, you would think that it might cost Isiah his bullet-proof status in the Garden. His on-court efforts to get the Knicks back to contending status have been an enormous failure. And now this off-court scandal is nothing short of an embarrassment to one of the NBA's flagship franchises.

Does Thomas deserve to get fired, just because Browne Sanders called his behavior "demeaning and repulsive"? Let's let the legal process take its course and not rush to judgment. But if her charges prove true, case closed. Isiah must go.

Actually, there's already a very good case to remove Thomas and let Larry Brown take over his duties. This has nothing to do with Isiah running the Continental Basketball Association into the ground. People still talk about that failure as if Thomas took over UNICEF and dropped it off a cliff. As a coach, his Pacers teams always underachieved, but that's not the issue here, either.

Over the past 25 months, Thomas has completely revamped the Knicks, for the worse. Start with his signature deal for non-difference-maker Stephon Marbury, as he also took on Penny Hardaway's millions. Continue with his two big free-agent signings (Jamal Crawford and Jerome James). Mix in the Eddy Curry sign-and-trade. Spent a ton on a player with a questionable heart. Don't forget all the moves in which he shipped out players with expiring contracts, and took back players with longer deals. Nice way to bury yourself for the future. Now factor in the lawsuit. If Dolan were to ask Isiah to resign today, for the good of the franchise, could you really blame him?

Since Thomas has talked so reverentially about the Knicks during his time in New York, we thought he might step down, gracefully. Spare the organization future front pages splattered with "he said, she said" headlines. But Isiah was as defiant as Rafael Palmeiro yesterday, angrily portraying himself as the victim of a shakedown.

"My job is and always has been to get the New York Knicks back to their championship days," he said. "And that is where my focus will remain."

Only Dolan can change that. But somewhere along the way, Thomas became Jerry West in Dolan's eyes. With David Stern pushing him to change the face of his franchise, Dolan went for Isiah's dazzling smile. Though the team's fortunes continue to go south, even with Larry Brown aboard, Dolan is still being dazzled. Last night he sat in his familiar baseline seat and, true to form, refused interviews. But just three months ago, he gave one of his rare interviews over breakfast during training camp in Charleston, S.C. It's impossible to believe that the disaster of a season, and Browne Sanders' allegations, would make him do a 180.

When asked about the team's revamped roster, Dolan said of Isiah, "He's done a spectacular job. You have to tip your hat to Isiah."

Remember, the team had not yet lost 27 of its first 40games.

"Again, I don't want to make a prediction, but I'm pleased with the progress," Dolan said. "And I do feel that we're further along than I thought we'd be."

Nice assessment.

Channing Frye, Nate Robinson and David Lee hadn't played a game yet, but Dolan said of the rookie trio: "unbelievable." To the big boss, they only reconfirmed Thomas' strengths. "He really did a great job with his eye for talent," he said.

On that score, Thomas didn't do too badly. Still, this team is still in the same position as when Isiah took over. It doesn't have a franchise player.

That morning back in October, the compliments continued. At one point, Dolan called Isiah "smart and strategic." At another, he credited Thomas for "thinking out of the box at times. In the NBA, that's a big advantage to think out of the box."

Then Dolan made a statement that now looks like famous last words.

"I mean, yeah, I was prepared to not be as advanced as we are now," he said. "It's come together faster than I thought."

It hasn't come together. Not at all. Isiah Thomas is responsible. Maybe it's time Jim Dolan holds him accountable.

Originally published on January 26, 2006

Glenn

01-26-2006, 12:40 PM

Jeff (Chicago): Will there be any fallout from the latest Isiah saga? Any chance of him getting canned?

Chad Ford: (12:29 PM ET ) I can't comment on the sexual harrasment suit. She said he did it. He said he didn't. That's usually how these things go. The funny thing is, I think there are plenty of reasons to fire Isiah, none of them having to do with this latest legal dispute. He's been a good judge of talent in the draft ... but honestly, that usually has more to do with your scouting staff than the GM. The GM rarely has the time to get out and see all of these guys. The rest of Isiah's calls for players in the league have been pretty awful as has his management of the cap and trading away draft picks. He did convince Larry Brown to come to New York, something another GM may have not been able to do, but I think Brown may be the wrong coach for this team. Not enough talent and not enough flexibility to make the changes that Brown is used to making. Still, I expect Isiah's going to give it one last try. He has Penny Hardaway's expiring contract to deal and my guess is that he pulls the trigger on something soon.

Koolaid

01-26-2006, 09:46 PM

Browne Sanders said Thomas' behavior soon became sexually charged, saying he told her he was "very attracted" to her and "in love" with her and tried to kiss her. She charges that last month, he hugged and tried to kiss her, and when she pulled away, he said, "What, I can't get any love from you today?"

this is illegal?

I thought the whole point of this even being accepted as a crime was to stop guys from treating their secretaries like prostitutes. Even if this did happen, It sounds like common flirting to me. You can't sue a guy because he said he loved you and went for a kiss. I don't understand that.

Glenn

01-27-2006, 08:08 AM

You can't sue a guy because he said he loved you and went for a kiss. I don't understand that.

I think you can, if he's your boss.

Taymelo?

(I'm not asking for legal advice from Taymelo, I'm asking for a kiss)

Glenn

01-27-2006, 09:35 AM

This story just keeps getting better.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/story/386274p-327768c.html

Steph laughs at Isiah's suit

Funny thing is, his name is in it

BY FRANK ISOLA
DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER

Usually sullen Stephon Marbury finds it funny that Isiah Thomas is being sued.

The four stitches on Stephon Marbury's lower lip and the Knicks' miserable record should be the least of his problems. But the veteran point guard doesn't see it that way. In fact, Marbury says he can "laugh at" the controversy swirling around himself, his family, Isiah Thomas and the team.

Asked yesterday if the events of the past two days were a distraction, Marbury said: "I mean, it's not a distraction to me, and I'm in the paper about as much as Isiah. But I laugh at it. It's a joke to me. I just laugh at it."

Thomas, the Knicks president, is being sued by a former high-ranking Madison Square Garden employee for sexual harassment and discrimination. Marbury was named in the lawsuit for making derogatory comments toward the plaintiff, Anucha Browne Sanders.

Also, Hassan Gonsalves, one of Marbury's two cousins hired by the Knicks' community relations department, was fired for sexually harassing several women on the staff and defrauding the company, according to the lawsuit. The Daily News reported on Thursday that Gonsalves threatened Browne Sanders after he was fired, telling her, "We know you have kids. We know where you live."

Another cousin, Tasheem Ward, is still employed by the team and is well-liked and respected by his co-workers.

Marbury confirmed that Gonsalves was dismissed by Browne Sanders, saying, "Yeah, that happened." He declined, however, to discuss anything relating to the lawsuit or Browne Sanders. The moody point guard, appearing more jovial than usual, smiled as he repeated over and over, "I'm not at liberty to talk about that."

"That's a good line, right?" he added.

Thomas attended practice yesterday in Greenburgh but exited before the media were allowed to enter the room. He was not available for comment.

Marbury believes that the Garden's legal troubles have had no impact on the Knicks, who are 13-27 after losing to the Sacramento Kings in overtime on Wednesday.

"I think guys are probably more frustrated as far as losing," said Marbury, who suffered a cut lip in the loss. "But all of this other stuff, I think everyone is starting to understand this is New York. You can't really go to the bathroom the wrong way. If somebody smells it the wrong way, they're going to write about it. That's just how it is. I think everyone is getting used to that, and they understand it."

Marbury is standing firmly behind Thomas, who acquired him two years ago from the Phoenix Suns. The deal, Thomas' signature trade as Knicks' president, has yet to result in a playoff victory or a winning record in the regular season.

The close relationship between Marbury and Thomas has created friction in the locker room over the years. Many former teammates felt that Marbury flaunted his ties with Thomas by occasionally sitting out practice or breaking off plays in games without being reprimanded.

Last season, when Lenny Wilkens still was the coach, Marbury gave an impassioned speech to his teammates about pulling together. His impromptu pep talk came right before a morning practice. But as soon as the team took the court, Marbury retreated to the locker room for a massage.

Because of Thomas, Marbury publicly endorsed the hiring of Larry Brown even though he and Brown had clashed at the 2004 Olympics. This season, Brown and Marbury have had two memorable hissing matches that played out in the media. But since last month's loss at Orlando, Marbury has played better and seems to have a better understanding of what Brown wants from his point guard.

According to sources, Thomas is surprised that Marbury hasn't handled the pressure of playing in New York as well as he thought the Brooklyn-born point guard would. Publicly, however, Thomas has gone out of his way to support Marbury even at the expense of losing some credibility with some players.

Marbury is returning that loyalty by saying yesterday that he believes that Thomas will be exonerated of all charges.

"What he always tells me is, if you're true to the game, the game is going to be true to you," Marbury said. "So, whenever you know the truth, the truth lies on top all the time. So, you feel bad that these things are happening, but at the same time, in the back of his mind, he knows what's right."

Glenn

01-27-2006, 09:37 AM

And more...

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/story/386306p-327808c.html

Isiah booze probe 'likely'

BY MITCH LAWRENCE
DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER

The NBA likely will launch a probe into allegations that Knicks President Isiah Thomas conspired to get opposing players drunk the night before games, sources told the Daily News.

The allegations, contained in a sexual harassment lawsuit filed by former Knicks Senior Vice President Anucha Browne Sanders, could be viewed as tampering - if Thomas had contact with opposing players.

Browne Sanders accused Thomas of working with concierges at hotels frequented by visiting teams to encourage opposing players to go to certain bars and strip clubs and get drunk the night before a day game.

An NBA spokesman said yesterday that the league is "monitoring the entire situation." But one league source said that while Thomas' alleged actions "seem highly unusual," they will probably be investigated. A Knicks spokesman said the team had no comment.

While the charges may seem insignificant, the NBA is very sensitive about the kinds of clubs its players frequent during their trips to New York and other major cities. Several years ago, the league endured a major scandal involving several prominent players, including the Knicks' Patrick Ewing, and strippers in the Gold Club in Atlanta.

Lonnie Hanover, a spokesman for Scores, wouldn't confirm if visiting players came to the East Side strip club mecca, saying only, "Athletes from every major sport love strip clubs, and you know where they go."

Teams found guilty of tampering are normally fined, with the amounts based on the severity of the infraction. In extreme cases of tampering, teams have even lost draft picks. "Who knows if there's anything really there," said one source.

Several general managers doubted Browne Sanders' accusations, because most players already know where to go for fun when they come to New York.

"I can't see Isiah being brazen enough to put his career in jeopardy," said an Eastern Conference executive. "We all know that there are serious consequences for tampering."

Pharaoh

01-27-2006, 11:17 AM

How the fuck is it tampering?

Zeke can work with concierges and get those guys to encourage of even organise a tour of strip clubs and if the players don't want to go they don't go.

If they want to go they knowingly put themselves in that situation.

Glenn

01-27-2006, 11:19 AM

Isn't almost any interaction with another team's players considered tampering?

The only recent exception that I can think of is Jerry Colangelo. The NBA is letting him contact players about Team USA.

Pharaoh

01-27-2006, 12:01 PM

01-27-2006, 02:45 PM

But if Zeke isn't actually present then how can they prove he tampered?

He's not taking the guys to the clubs. Some concierge is "encouraging" players to visit the clubs.

Players are not being forced to go. They have a choice.

I agree it is a very weak case for tampering. I mean it would be different if Isiah was a college AD or coach trying to coax a recruit. However these are grown men who can make choices and for that matter can more than afford to go clubbing and boozing. I am sure regardless of Zeke's actions they would be living it up in NY on their own.

If this is considered tampering LT should be ripped from the HOF for the free hookers he used to send to people's rooms before games.

Glenn

01-27-2006, 02:48 PM

But if it comes to light that Thomas organized shuttles/transportation or arranged a schedule of events, i.e. a pubcrawl of sorts for bars/strip joints, then it's pretty cut and dry, IMO.

Pharaoh

01-27-2006, 09:52 PM

That's a big IF GD.

Not that it matters though - I think Zeke gets fired in the off-season regardless

Black Dynamite

01-27-2006, 11:46 PM

I dont Zeke did shit to her. but she got what she wanted. she's giving him bad press from mars to long island

Anthony

01-27-2006, 11:50 PM

Zeek is a very rich and powerfull man, he can get who ever and whatever he wants, why the fuck would he go after her?

(I base that post on remembering someone mention she was fat or ugly. or both. Not sure if it was here though)

Glenn

01-30-2006, 10:30 AM

"Love Child" LMAO.

WE NEED TO GET THIS GUY AS A POSTER HERE!!!

--------

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/story/386994p-328316c.html

Isiah's 19-year-old love child takes shot at dad he's never met

By DARREN EVERSON in Bloomfield Hills, Mich.,
and DAVE GOLDINER in New York
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITERS

Isiah Thomas' teenage love child said yesterday he's long ached to meet his famous father - but the embattled Knick boss has denied him a shot.
Speaking out for the first time, Marc Dones, 19, an aspiring writer whose mom had a brief affair with a then-engaged Thomas two decades ago, said he still pines for an opportunity to get to know the father he's only seen on TV.

"People should be parents. That's it," Dones said. "By the time I turn 20, I should get to say two words to my father: 'Hello. Goodbye.' If that's it, then I should get those two."

Dones said he's called Thomas twice, but never got a response.

"I'd like to speak to him. I'd like to know him," said the dreadlocked young poet. "But that's not the situation I'm in."

Dones broke his silence just days after Thomas, a married father of two, was accused in a federal lawsuit of sexually harassing Anucha Browne Sanders, a Knicks executive.

Thomas, 44, has denied the allegations.

"I don't know anything about any of this. It has nothing to do with me," Dones said. "I don't have an opinion about what kind of person he is. I don't know him."

But the well-spoken teenager, who wore jeans and a T-shirt and held a cigarette as he stood outside his family's townhouse in suburban Detroit, had plenty else to say - and revealed planning to write a memoir about his unique family life.

Dones is 5-foot-10 and has an athletic build, but said he's not interested in being a star athlete like his Hall of Fame dad.

"It's just chasing a ball," he said of basketball, the sport that made his father rich and famous. "I don't know why you'd do that."

A talented poet and writer, Marc Dones went to the Roeper School, an elite private academy outside Detroit. He plans to attend the New School University in New York this fall.

His mother, Jenni Dones, got pregnant during a 1985 affair with Thomas, just two months before the then-NBA superstar player married his current wife, Lynn.

Jenni Dones has claimed she had a three- or four-month relationship with the Detroit Pistons All-Star, but her lawyer agreed with Thomas' version that it was a one-night stand.

After Marc Dones was born in 1986, Thomas admitted being the father and agreed to pay $52,000, plus $2,764.78 per month until Marc turned 18 - and then a lump sum of $100,000 to the youth.

Jenni Dones later sued for more support, claiming that her lawyer had failed to get a good enough deal from Thomas.

Again, the NBA star agreed to fork over more dough to support his child.

"He acted honorably, as far as I'm concerned," said Elbert Hatchett, the lawyer who represented Jenni Dones and was later sued by her.

Jenni Dones, who was at a family funeral yesterday, was not reachable for comment.

Kevin Mintzer, a spokesman for Sanders, declined to comment yesterday as did Raynor Grossman, a spokeswoman for Thomas.

No one answered the door at the Westchester mansion where Thomas lives with his wife and their two teenage children.

Jenni Dones' mother, Edwynna Anderson, was a prominent lawyer, a trailblazing black journalist in Michigan and a Detroit prosecutor.

Jenni Dones, a single mom, went on to have another child, now 13. She once ran a program in the urban studies center at Wayne State University in Detroit but apparently no longer works there.

She filed twice for bankruptcy protection, most recently in December, legal records show.

But Marc Dones called his mom a "very strong woman" who had long since moved on from the affair with Thomas.

"My mom doesn't believe in regret, which is shaping a lot of my dealing with it," he said. "There's no point. It happened. It's over."

"She's more than capable of dealing with my father, for one, and dealing with the world, for two," he added.

Even without a father, the teenager says he's had a good life and is resigned that he might never get to know his dad, who is running the struggling Knicks.

"We've never had a relationship," Dones said of Thomas. "I don't think we will. ... My life is completely separate."

He's already had work published on TheDetroiter.com, an artsy Web site in the Motor City.

"What amazes me, for his age, is his grasp of poetry," said Eric Novack, the site's literary editor. "He is an incredible young man."

Despite Thomas' refusal to have any contact with him, Dones said he won't allow himself to be eaten up with bitterness.

"That's my life - there's nothing I can do about it," he said. "It doesn't upset me. When I was younger, yes. Having known it no other way, there's no reason to be bitter about it.

"I don't hold him any malice. I don't have any ill will," he added as he hustled the family's dog, Charlie, a black Labrador retriever and Shih Tzu mix, into the backyard.

"It's hard to have any ill will toward someone who you don't have a relationship with."

Glenn

01-30-2006, 11:41 AM

Keeps getting better...

Is anybody else enjoying the fuck out of this?

http://www.nypost.com/sports/knicks/61186.htm

SOURCES: ISIAH, VP HAD 'WILD ARGUMENT'

By MARC BERMAN
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

January 30, 2006 -- ATLANTA — Anucha Browne Sanders and Frank Murphy are listed as senior vice presidents with full-page bios in the Knicks media guide.

Both worked under Isiah Thomas and both are gone now. Sanders left before filing a sexual harassment suit against Thomas. Two sources said Murphy's departure also came under suspect circumstances, despite the club's company line that he retired.

Two sources said Murphy, the senior VP of Basketball Operations who managed the team's salary cap and structured contracts, agreed to a "retirement settlement" late in preseason only after a "wild argument" with Thomas.

"It's been a well-kept secret in the organization what the argument was over," one source said. "Even the top executives like Anucha didn't know."

A Knick official said Murphy actually was the liason between Sanders and Thomas. Hence, Sanders and Thomas did not speak often, the Knick official said.

The Knicks say several different people have inherited Murphy's job. Murphy, 64, had worked for the Knicks since 1990.

"I have no comment," Murphy said. "I'm just enjoying retirement."

Meanwhile, according to a Garden employee, Sanders' ego was so huge that she demanded her full page in the media guide, even if she was just in marketing.

Knicks staffers, according to Garden sources, also found it unusual she used to sit next to former GM Scott Layden in the "war room" on draft night. Sanders periodically would travel with the club, but Thomas put a stop to it when he came aboard.

Pharaoh

01-30-2006, 11:47 AM

Two sources said Murphy, the senior VP of Basketball Operations who managed the team's salary cap and structured contracts, agreed to a "retirement settlement" late in preseason only after a "wild argument" with Thomas.

No wonder the guy got fucking fired.

He managed their cap and structured their contracts?

Good Lord, he's lucky he wasn't taken out back and shot after the piss poor job he did.

WTFchris

01-30-2006, 11:48 AM

After Marc Dones was born in 1986, Thomas admitted being the father and agreed to pay $52,000, plus $2,764.78 per month until Marc turned 18 - and then a lump sum of $100,000 to the youth.

She filed twice for bankruptcy protection, most recently in December, legal records show.

How can you get that much money and still be bankrupt? She made 33 grand a year from nothing, plus the 52 grand initially. She could work a part time job and not even be in debt. Work full time and be financially set until he's 18.

Pharaoh

01-30-2006, 11:52 AM

Cause she's a Ho?

Glenn

01-30-2006, 11:55 AM

"Love Child" LMAO.

WE NEED TO GET THIS GUY AS A POSTER HERE!!!

I guess nobody else liked this idea, lol.

How cool would it be to have Isiah's love child as a member here?

Pharaoh

01-30-2006, 12:01 PM

GD - I personally can't keep track of all your great ideas.

I agree - if he was posting here it would be fucking sweet.

UncleCliffy

01-30-2006, 09:06 PM

Ok guys, brace yourselves.

4th quarter and Knicks are down 26 pts to the Hawks.

HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Black Dynamite

01-30-2006, 09:31 PM

Ok guys, brace yourselves.

4th quarter and Knicks are down 26 pts to the Hawks.

HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
http://www.freeimagelibrary.com/images/ddot313/wtf.jpg

OUGrizz11PG

01-31-2006, 10:18 PM

the wrath of diddy

02-01-2006, 02:22 AM

http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=469562

LMFAO @ Knick fans. Exactment? LOLLERS!

Black Dynamite

02-01-2006, 11:28 AM

7 pages spent talking about dumars vs zeke. yikes

Fool

02-01-2006, 12:25 PM

LOL @ Skelly in that thread.

Vinny

02-01-2006, 01:35 PM

LOL @ This Guy:

http://www.realgm.com/boards/search.php?search_author=Bernard_Gilkey

Darth Thanatos

02-01-2006, 01:53 PM

LOL@everyone wasting their time talking about the Knicks

Varsity

02-01-2006, 01:56 PM

LOL @ This Guy:

http://www.realgm.com/boards/search.php?search_author=Bernard_Gilkey

HAHA.

I will truly..

I will truly m....

Matt

02-02-2006, 04:36 PM

LOL@everyone wasting their time talking about the Knicks

this is funny stuff, though. i kiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinda feel bad for the guy, with his dream job quickly becoming a nightmare:

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/story/387732p-329005c.html

Stephon Marbury's problems with Brown have been well-documented, and if nothing else, the point guard is not afraid to tell his side of the story. The same is true of second-year forward Trevor Ariza, who two weeks ago requested a meeting with Brown only to be denied.

But many of their teammates who have also felt the brunt of Brown's demanding ways - Jamal Crawford, Nate Robinson, Curry and Jerome James - have exercised restraint.

The lines of communication appear to be closing. Following yesterday's film session, Brown admitted that Antonio Davis delivered a message from the team that they want the staff to simplify the way they are to defend pick-and-rolls.

"He was the spokesperson," Brown said. "Tony knows me."

Davis played for Brown with the Indiana Pacers and acts as a liaison between the players and the coach. Of course, Thomas had serious reservations about bringing in Davis, who was included in the Curry deal. Perhaps Thomas felt threatened because of Davis' relationship with the new coach. Now, Brown needs Davis more than ever.

Black Dynamite

02-02-2006, 05:49 PM

brown could get fired from his dream job? probally not but he will test the "restraint" of ownership this year.

Glenn

02-02-2006, 06:35 PM

They'll fire Zeke and give LB all the power before they'll fire LB, which is exactly what I thought would happen the day that LB accepted the job.

H1Man

02-03-2006, 12:25 AM

I wouldn't be totally suprised if LB resigned mid-season.

I heard somewhere that his health problems have resurfaced and the situation in NY isn't getting any better, so resignation might be an option for him.

Pharaoh

02-04-2006, 01:59 AM

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/story/387732p-329005c.html

Stephon Marbury's problems with Brown have been well-documented, and if nothing else, the point guard is not afraid to tell his side of the story. The same is true of second-year forward Trevor Ariza, who two weeks ago requested a meeting with Brown only to be denied.

But many of their teammates who have also felt the brunt of Brown's demanding ways - Jamal Crawford, Nate Robinson, Curry and Jerome James - have exercised restraint.

The lines of communication appear to be closing. Following yesterday's film session, Brown admitted that Antonio Davis delivered a message from the team that they want the staff to simplify the way they are to defend pick-and-rolls.

"He was the spokesperson," Brown said. "Tony knows me."

Davis played for Brown with the Indiana Pacers and acts as a liaison between the players and the coach. Of course, Thomas had serious reservations about bringing in Davis, who was included in the Curry deal. Perhaps Thomas felt threatened because of Davis' relationship with the new coach. Now, Brown needs Davis more than ever.

So who's gonna talk to LB now that AD is gone?

LMMFAO@The Knicks

SKelly

02-04-2006, 02:01 AM

He thought this would be his dream job... He had his dream job for 2 years and didn't even know it.

UncleCliffy

02-05-2006, 02:21 PM

I could have sworn that the Knicks game was supposed to be on ABC today?? Anyway it looks like the Knicks lost again.

Anthony

02-05-2006, 02:22 PM

I think for people in the Detroit and Pitt area the game was seen only on espn2

UncleCliffy

02-05-2006, 02:22 PM

Yeah, its on espn2. Thanks.

Mikey

02-14-2006, 09:38 PM

From the ESPN NBA page:

The Knicks are trying to create a historic backcourt combo of Stephon Marbury and Steve Francis, reports Chris Sheridan. The trade would likely return Penny Hardaway to Orlando with two other players

Could you imagine how big of a disaster that would be? Marbury, Francis, Crawford, Rose and QRich all on the SAME TEAM. Seeing that garbage in action would make me stop watching basketball forever. Ugh.

SKelly

02-14-2006, 09:52 PM

I can't believe Larry is ADVOCATING that. It sounds like it would be his worst nightmere.

Anthony

02-14-2006, 10:03 PM

God, this is getting sadder and sadder by the second. LMAO@NY!

Cross

02-15-2006, 03:45 AM

Maybe talent wise?

Honestly, these 2 guys are great shoot first point guards. They have alot of talent.

I know the Knicks would lose almost every game with that duo but talent wise, they wouldnt be that bad.

BIG BEN'S FRO

02-15-2006, 09:30 AM

My problem is where do you go up from there? I find it absolutely amazing that the Knicks are adding to a $115 million dollar payroll in 2006-2007. Honestly, if I were the Knicks and wanted to rebuild fast, here's what I would do.

Get all the contracts to end in the same season, except for your draft picks and whatever undervalued player you have. Cut EVERYONE. Get a top notch free agent or two. Have that player take the last 30 games of the next season off. Get a lotto pick. Get another top tier free agent with more cap space. Then go spend hogwild.

Pharaoh

02-15-2006, 11:22 AM

Glenn

02-15-2006, 11:24 AM

merged

Kilo

02-15-2006, 11:25 AM

Historic is a neutral term - it's isn't good or bad.

Fool

02-15-2006, 12:58 PM

Special is also a neutral term.

Artis Gilmore

02-15-2006, 03:33 PM

Newark Star-Ledger - Isiah Thomas and Larry Brown have been communicating regularly on the state of the team and on potential trades. They speak on the phone virtually every day and they chat amiably at the Knicks' practice facility. Both are also expert at putting a public smile.

But word is that Thomas is fed up with Brown's rip jobs of his players and is frustrated that Brown never seems happy with any of them. It is a sentiment shared by many people in the organization.

LOL@Larry Clown

Mikey

02-22-2006, 02:35 PM

Glenn

02-23-2006, 08:30 AM

The Garden crowd was buzzing with the prospect of watching its newly minted slam-dunk champion execute an encore. But Dwyane Wade raced back and battered Robinson to the floor.

Stephon Marbury barked for a flagrant foul and got a technical instead. A livid Larry Brown screamed at referee Ed Rush, "I know we're not any good, but we still deserve a fair call once in a while."

LOL

EDIT: added link, sorry

http://www.nypost.com/sports/knicks/64057.htm

Fool

02-23-2006, 08:38 AM

Link? Did he actually say that?

Matt

02-23-2006, 04:37 PM

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/spo/med/2006/02/ipt/1140711094.jpg

LB rehearses in his mind: "Due to my health conditions...."

Koolaid

02-28-2006, 02:50 AM

Look at this roster...

Channing Frye - a young PF with tremendous potential already a good player.

Nate Robinson - probably the most athletic PG in the league.

Jamal Crawford - a good scorer

Stephon Marbury - good passer, good scorer, good handles, former all-star.

Steve Francis - same as marbury.

Quentin Richardson - good outside shot, nice overall player.

Jalen Rose - smart player, one of the most versatile in the game.

Eddy Curry - One of the best big men in the league, by default but it's true.

Jackie Butler - plays alot like Eddy Curry.

Now I know they have almost all of their talent in the 1 2 and 3 slots but they still have alot of talent there and most teams don't have good bigs now anyway. The truth is that a good coach could get the current roster into a playoff seed. The team has a mix of veterans and young gifted athletes that alot of teams would be envious as hell of, even if they are all really supposed to play the same position. So why do they suck so badly?

Everyone's pointing the finger at Isiah, but i'm thinking fuck that. When I look at the roster it doesn't look that bad really. Now the Knicks seem to be purposely tanking, it's fucking pathetic. That blame has to placed on the coach though. So i'm going to say it, LB is fake as fuck. LB is the most over rated coach in my lifetime.

Vinny

02-28-2006, 03:07 AM

Koolaid

02-28-2006, 04:29 AM

Come on now, haven't you learned anything from Joe D.? Talent's great but chemistry, hard work and teamwork are the key. That's the problem with the Knicks. I can't think of a bigger collection of ballhogs, lazes and attitude problems in the recent NBA.

I really don't get it. Zeke hires LB and then goes and puts together the biggest collection of anti-LB types I've ever seen. He's got like 5-6 key pieces of a winner but they each belong to a different jigsaw puzzle, they just don't fit together.

A coach is supposed to help chemistry though. understand that. LB ain't doing a damn thing in New York.

Besides, do you really think that Stephon Marbury, Jamal Crawford, Jalen Rose, Channing Frye and Eddy Curry sounds like that dysfunctional of a starting line-up? To me that sounds like a pretty solid line-up, and they'd have some pretty damn good players coming off the bench in Steve Francis and Nate Robinson.

No GM can make the players work hard, No GM can make the players compliment each other's game. He can make predictions on who would fit well, but that isn't a sure thing. Considering that Zeke started in the worst possible position that a GM can be in I don't think he has really done badly.

When you consider depth the Knicks are probably the most talented team in the league at the 1 and maybe even the 2 position as well. They weren't going to get a good big man, because no one has a big to give away. They got Eddy Curry, Jerome James and Channing Frye though... so i don't see how Zeke could have done better.

The truth is that Isiah seems to be trying, and LB doesn't. Now his players aren't trying either, and he doesn't care. The Francis move was more of an LB move then Zeke though, and that's the one that made the least sense to me so far. LB was constantly complaining about not having a true point guard, even though he had Marbury and Robinson he wanted another one. Like we already know though, LB doesn't even know what the hell LB wants. So you just ignore everything he says, because he's crazy. How can a dude like that be considered a great coach though?

Kilo

02-28-2006, 10:05 AM

New York should sign Darvin Ham - he's a reputed team chemist isn't he??

WTFchris

02-28-2006, 10:36 AM

they are definately the most expensive crappy team ever. I'm sure if you figure out the cost per win for all NBA teams all time, this NY team would be far and away the worst.

02-28-2006, 11:07 AM

Isiah likley to be fired either today or by week's end. Zeke has ben told to cancel his scouting trip to Europe and report to Dolan's office in Texas.

02-28-2006, 11:10 AM

New York should sign Darvin Ham - he's a reputed team chemist isn't he??

He can't sign with NY they can't give him a 5 yr 50 million dollar deal to meet team contract standards, maybe we should offer them a S&T for an unprotected 1st?

Fool

02-28-2006, 11:12 AM

Isiah likley to be fired either today or by week's end. Zeke has ben told to cancel his scouting trip to Europe and report to Dolan's office in Texas.

Damn, there goes John Hammond. [smilie=army.gif]

Anthony

02-28-2006, 11:15 AM

LOL. The Hawks can do what the knicks do on 1/1839874398741th of the payroll.

Fool

02-28-2006, 11:25 AM

http://www.nj.com/knicks/ledger/index.ssf?/base/sports-0/114110898734360.xml&coll=1&thispage=1

Dolan calls for meeting of the minds as Knicks woes continue
Tuesday, February 28, 2006
BY DAVID WALDSTEIN
Star-Ledger Staff

SAN ANTONIO -- The Alamo is a long way from Paris and Barcelona, but when the boss calls and says he wants you in Texas, you drop everything.

Isiah Thomas, who planned to fly to Europe on a scouting trip yesterday, instead was summoned here by team owner James Dolan for a high-level meeting with Larry Brown and the rest of the Madison Square Garden brass to discuss the debacle that is the Knicks.

Finally, Dolan appears to have recognized his team is in crisis mode. While Dolan sat glumly in the second row and watched the Knicks get crushed, 121-93, by the Spurs for their 41st loss of the season, Thomas found a spot to stand by himself at the entrance to the tunnel, similar to where he stands at the Garden, to watch the team lose.

Today in Memphis, it is assumed Thomas will meet with Dolan, Brown, team president and COO Steve Mills, and vice chairman of Madison Square Garden Hank Ratner, where they can discuss last night's demolition -- in which the Spurs scored 100 points and shot 72.5 percent through three quarters -- and the performance this season that has resulted in a 15-41 record.

"We cut it to seven," Brown said of the Knicks little run early in the third quarter, "and then I don't remember us making a pass, except to them."

After that, San Antonio scored 12 consecutive points, and another embarrassing rout was on. Following the game Dolan and Thomas spent a few moments in the locker room and then headed to Memphis in Dolan's private jet.

Brown was disconsolate about the Knicks' lack of effort and team concept, but vowed he would not quit.

"Everywhere I've been, every place I've ever coached, I always felt we were getting better," he said. "I ain't giving up here. But it's embarrassing; every game to go out like this and I don't see one change in the effort or the enthusiasm or unselfishness."

It is a topic that is sure to be discussed with the owner.

Dolan makes regular visits to the team's training facility in Westchester, where he meets with Thomas, Brown and Mills. But apparently he didn't want to wait.

Although the meeting with Thomas was hastily arranged, there are no indications the GM's job is in jeopardy at this point. A spokesman for Thomas said he changed his plans himself because he wanted to be with the team in its time of desperation, but another MSG official said Thomas' presence was requested by Dolan.

Dolan had planned to join the team on this trip for several weeks, and today he plans to address the state of the club.

The last time he spoke was during training camp on Oct. 8, when optimism was high in the wake of Brown's hiring and the trade for Eddy Curry. There was no specific mention of the playoffs at the time, but several times Dolan said the ultimate "truth" would come out on the floor.

Here's the ugly truth:

The Knicks have lost 20 of their past 22 and despite the league's highest payroll at $125 million and despite having a Hall of Fame coach, they share the NBA's worst record with the Bobcats.

It will be interesting to hear what Dolan has to say about the jobs Thomas and Brown have done. In October, he raved about Thomas' work.

"As far as I can tell, he's done a spectacular job," the owner said that day. "A lot of the $120 million payroll is legacy stuff. I just think he's done a very good job, particularly in this off-season. We're ahead of schedule in terms of bringing on talent and youth and making the team more exciting."

Clearly, that assessment needs an adjustment. The comparison between the two teams on the floor last night didn't help matters for Thomas. The Spurs won the championship with a payroll half that of the Knicks at roughly $62 million.

Anthony

02-28-2006, 11:27 AM

What is that man sniffing?

Glenn

02-28-2006, 11:50 AM

I wonder if Indiana University is looking to ruin their basketball program?

I hear they have a head coaching vacancy.

Vinny

02-28-2006, 12:21 PM

Black Dynamite

02-28-2006, 01:42 PM

acman1

02-28-2006, 02:51 PM

Thomas is either trying to field a team of just guards, dumb or is planning to make a huge amont of trades this offseason, but for a team that has a 140 payroll man do they blow.

Matt

02-28-2006, 06:45 PM

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2347813

Dolan is expected to make a rare public statement about the state of the club this week, The Newark Star Ledger reported in Tuesday's edition. In October, when he last spoke publicly about the team, he was optimistic about the team's prospects and supportive of general manager Isiah Thomas.

"Yes, we suck."

UncleCliffy

03-01-2006, 12:01 AM

LOL@Zeke

Larry looks like he's going to cry.

Fool

03-01-2006, 08:22 AM

Looks like the exit strategy has already been initiated.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/01/sports/basketball/01knicks.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

Knicks Receive a Message From the Top: Shape Up
March 1, 2006
By LIZ ROBBINS

MEMPHIS, Feb. 28 — James L. Dolan, the chairman of Madison Square Garden, walked into the visiting locker room Tuesday afternoon. The Knicks were preparing for yet another practice after yet another loss, and Dolan told his players to start improving. Immediately.

Only minutes after the Knicks' president, Isiah Thomas, delivered a similar speech, Dolan made a special point to inform the players and the coaches that Thomas's and Coach Larry Brown's jobs were safe.

Later, after a spirited practice, Brown again questioned the roster Thomas assembled and implied that the players' jobs might not be safe this summer.

If only the Knicks could muster this much drama on the court.

With the Knicks' record at 15-41, the season is already lost, and Brown is already talking about a roster overhaul.

Dolan, who spent more than $120 million for the roster, just wants the Knicks prepared for the Grizzlies on Wednesday night.

"He can't change what has happened," Jalen Rose said, recounting Dolan's speech to the team, "but tomorrow night he wanted us to start being a better team. That's the bottom line."

Dolan is in Memphis on a previously scheduled trip, traveling Monday from San Antonio after watching the Spurs embarrass the Knicks, 121-93. Making an annual trip with the team, he took the three highest-ranking members of the Garden hierarchy with him — the president, Steve Mills; the vice chairman, Hank Ratner; and the senior vice president for communications, Barry Watkins. Dolan is expected to speak to the news media Wednesday afternoon before the Knicks play the Grizzlies.

The message Dolan gave the team Tuesday, in a rare locker room appearance, was a powerful backing of Thomas. Dolan has never wavered in his support of Thomas, including the backing he gave him when the former Knicks marketing executive Anucha Browne Sanders filed a sexual harassment lawsuit against him and the Garden in January.

Rose said, "He also acknowledged the fact that you'll probably see and hear a lot of speculation about him possibly making changes with the coach staff or the front office, and he acknowledged that's not going to happen." Many of Thomas's roster moves — he has made 44 since becoming team president in December 2003 — have drawn criticism, especially the recent trades for Rose and Steve Francis. Thomas seemed to be stockpiling guards who are not defensive-minded, even though Brown said at the time that he endorsed the deals.

"You don't bring in players that can't play a style that's comfortable for the coach," Brown said after practice. "Isiah and I understand that. He knows the guys I like — it's not easy to make trades."

With the deadline having passed to make trades, Brown added: "The important thing is to get the most out of these guys and see if they can play the way I feel comfortable coaching — if they want me to coach."

By throwing out such a curious aside, Brown, who still has $40 million and 4 years left on his contract, may be sensing that he is losing his players. But then again, maybe he wants to lose them.

"We got to have guys who are defensive-minded, have a high basketball I.Q., play unselfish and play hard," he said. "The way I look at it, maybe some of them can't do what I ask."

Brown mentioned players with whom he has had success elsewhere — Eric Snow, Bruce Bowen, Nazr Mohammed, Raja Bell and Aaron McKie. Then Brown said he told Thomas he wanted three point guards; four post players who can defend; athletic wing players who can dribble, drive and guard; and two stabilizing veterans. "We got to find out if we have them here or what," Brown said.

Meanwhile, the current Knicks are trying to find themselves, trying not to think about where they may be next season.

Francis plays his third game with the Knicks on Wednesday. He compared Brown's predicament to one Jeff Van Gundy faced when he became coach of the Houston Rockets.

"He had players who were capable, but early on nobody bought into what he was telling us," Francis said of Van Gundy.

"Once we did that, everybody got better as a team."

Francis said that neither Thomas nor Dolan named names in speaking to the team, but they indicated that the players needed to start playing to their potential.

"It's the truth, it's not one person, nobody's having a stellar season on the team," Francis said.

Brown had this reaction to the speeches Thomas and his boss gave Tuesday, saying of Dolan: "He's been real supportive. Isiah's been real supportive. I don't know how they can be, watching us play."

Jerome James, the $30 million center who has been a disappointment because of injury and his play, said he took this message away from the meeting: "The city of New York is a hard-working city, and I think if we came out and gave effort night in and night out, I think they would appreciate it more than if we seemingly gave up."

The Knicks are one defeat from guaranteeing a losing season and are closing in on the franchise's worst record — 21-59 in 1963.

As Brown and James left the Grizzlies' practice gym together, Brown was disgusted by the mess of bottles, tape and towels the team had left.

"We leave the place worse than when we got here," Brown said, a statement that, so far, could apply to the Knicks' season. ~ thats a really nice closing touch. Krista, take notes!

Koolaid

03-02-2006, 11:43 AM

A coach is supposed to help chemistry though. understand that. LB ain't doing a damn thing in New York.

The Coach is supposed to help it. the GM is responsible for building it with the right players. You dont just stick any talented player at the position and expect the coach to work it out fot them all as a group.

You only get on court chemistry by playing with each other. LB swtiched the line-up how many times? He still fucks with the rotation so much that the players go from starters to garbage minutes over one game. It's as if he doesn't want his players to gel together.

The knicks have the talent to at least compete for a playoff spot. They are built similar to the bulls, but play like an expansion team. Truth is if the finger isn't pointed at the coach at some point then someone is trying to kiss LB's ass.

Vinny

03-02-2006, 01:51 PM

Built similair to the bulls????? Huh??? How does that make the slightest bit of sense. I guarantee LB would trade his roster for the Bulls roster in half a second, not even blinking an eye.

Koolaid

03-02-2006, 02:51 PM

Vinny

03-02-2006, 05:18 PM

Built similair to the bulls????? Huh??? How does that make the slightest bit of sense. I guarantee LB would trade his roster for the Bulls roster in half a second, not even blinking an eye.

Because have ninety percent of their talent in the same position, the 1/2. They basically start two point guards, and have a point guard as a sixth man. They are built very similar, if you don't see that then you just aren't looking.

And LB would trade his roster for any roster. Doesn't make it a good move.

It that respect I guess, but when I look at the Bulls roster, the words that come to my mind are "hungry", "hard-working", and "teamwork". When I look at the Knicks, I see "selfish", "lazy" and "entitled".

Yeah, they both start two point guards, but Duhon is a passing, floor general type who's out there to control the offense and play respectable defense. Hinrich is both a good distibutor and scorer who doesn't need to dominate the ball to be effective. I don't see many similarities to those two in the Francis/Marbury/Crawford trio. At Center the knicks play alot of Curry, who is a classic underachiever versus the Bulls who play Chandler, who while greater things were expected from him, has made a place for himself by hustling, rebounding and playing hard every night.

Koolaid

03-02-2006, 07:00 PM

It that respect I guess, but when I look at the Bulls roster, the words that come to my mind are "hungry", "hard-working", and "teamwork". When I look at the Knicks, I see "selfish", "lazy" and "entitled".

That's all relevent to the situation though. You aren't going to get teamwork when your coach doesn't have a steady rotation for you to be on the floor with. You're going to have to be pretty selfish when you don't know the tendencies of the guys you're playing with. As for the lazy part, I don't see who that applies to outside of Eddy Curry, and he uses his size to his advantage so it shouldn't even be an issue.

The fact of it all is that the Knicks have a decent starting line-up with amazing depth at the guard spots. LB has hurt them wayyy more then he helped them.

Last year the Knicks had a roster of....

Marbury
Crawford
Tim Thomas
Mike Sweetney
Kurt Thomas
Malik Rose
Trevor Ariza
Jerome Williams
Mo Taylor
Bruno Sundov
Jackie Butler
Jermaine Jackson

Salary cap aside there's no way in hell that team is better than the current roster. Last year they were 24-33 at this time, right now they are 15-42. All isiah did was swap Kurt Thomas with Eddy Curry, upgrade Sweetney with Frye, and upgrade Tim Thomas with Jalen Rose. He did an awful job managing cap space but he definitely has given LB some talent to play with. The current records lands almost squarely on Brown's shoulders.

mikevant

03-02-2006, 07:14 PM

The loss of Bruno Sundov cannot be underestimated. The Knicks are just not the same team without the Croatian Commando.

UncleCliffy

03-03-2006, 10:06 PM

I can't believe the Knicks. They had a 10 pt lead in the 4th quarter against the Bulls and lost.

Mikey

03-03-2006, 10:13 PM

It's hard to feel sorry for them considering how much money they make.

Cross

03-04-2006, 10:47 AM

New York Daily News - After the Knicks lost their sixth straight game on Friday, the New York Daily News reports that guards Stephon Marbury and Quentin Richardson were involved in a heated locker room exchange.

Anthony

03-04-2006, 10:49 AM

LOL@That poor excuse for a team

Glenn

03-07-2006, 08:58 PM

I wonder if Indiana University is looking to ruin their basketball program?

I hear they have a head coaching vacancy.

As I first reported on 2/28/06...

http://www.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/9290794

Isiah talking with Hoosiers? Witnesses say yes

March 7, 2006
By Gregg Doyel
CBS SportsLine.com Senior Writer

Indiana Hoosiers legend Isiah Thomas was on campus Tuesday in Bloomington, Ind., and was spotted by two people walking into the office of the president, those witnesses told CBS SportsLine.com.

Indiana is looking for Mike Davis' replacement. Thomas, who has head coaching experience in the NBA with the Pacers, currently is the embattled president of the New York Knicks. The Knicks were in Indianapolis on Tuesday to play the Pacers, and Bloomington is about an hour south.

Thomas' intentions Tuesday weren't known, but he is believed to be interested in becoming the Hoosiers' next coach. He isn't thought to be at the top of Indiana athletics director Rick Greenspan's list, but Greenspan has been calling former Hoosiers in recent days to get their input on the program's direction. It's hard to imagine ex-Hoosiers endorsing anyone but Thomas or another famous alumnus, Steve Alford of Iowa.

Alford, sources say, will leave for Indiana if he's offered the job. Greenspan doesn't appear to be willing to settle on such an easy hire, however. On a peripheral level, Indiana people have been in contact with people close to Memphis' John Calipari and Louisville's Rick Pitino to gauge their interest in the job. In both cases, sources told SportsLine.com, the interest was reciprocal.

SKelly

03-07-2006, 09:14 PM

Isiah would probably be a pretty good recruiter. He is good at assembling talent and the man would command respect from high school players. And he wasn't horrendous when he coached the Pacers, he was just really bad.

The program would definitely become wrapped up in scandal if he became the guy though. Boosters, sex scandals, anything the players do off-court, he could ruin that program.

I think the Knicks are ready to give the guy the boot and let Larry take over anyways. This is the one place on Earth that could possibly give him a good basketball job. If he doesn't get the Hoosier job, he'd have to become and NBA Scout or something like that.

Matt

03-13-2006, 11:42 AM

http://www.newsday.com/sports/basketball/knicks/ny-spknix0313,0,1092566.story?coll=ny-sports-headlines

Marbury: My way now

BY GREG LOGAN
STAFF WRITER

If you thought the Knicks couldn't sink any lower than last place in the NBA after their loss to the second-year Charlotte Bobcats .Saturday night, think again. .Stephon Marbury, who has resisted Larry Brown's demands on and off all season, said in a published report yesterday that he plans to go back to playing like "Starbury," his description of the freelancing style he prefers.

In a pregame interview with the Newark Star-Ledger in Charlotte, Marbury said he tried to change his game to fit Brown's controlled style emphasizing ball movement and an inside-out attack in which the point guard creates open shots for others first, but the result is a 17-44 record rather than a winning season and a playoff berth.

"So what do I do now, as far as the way I play?" Marbury said in the interview. "I go back to playing like Stephon Marbury, aka 'Starbury.' I haven't been 'Starbury' this year. I've been some other dude this year ... When you watch the games, that's not Stephon Marbury."

Marbury insisted he tried to comply with the spirit of what Brown has asked him to do. But his average has dropped from 21.7 points a game last season to 17.0, and his assists are down from 8.1 to 6.6, his career low.

"If this was my contract year and I went to any organization, based on how I played this year, and asked for the max, tell me what they would tell me," .Marbury said in the interview. "They'd say, 'That ain't happening.' "

Brown gave his team the day off yesterday, so neither he nor Marbury was available for comment.

But the Hall of Fame coach frequently has been frustrated by Marbury. Without naming Marbury, Brown complained about his team not running the plays he called at the end of a recent home loss to Chicago.

Since the Knicks acquired former All-Star point guard Steve Francis just over two weeks ago, Marbury's playing time has declined, and he was used for mop-up duty at the end of a blowout win six days ago at Indiana. On Saturday, Brown described Francis as "low-maintenance" and "fun to be around." Meanwhile, Marbury praised Charlotte coach Bernie Bickerstaff for allowing rookie point guard Raymond Felton to "play freely."

You see where this is headed. The Knicks have 21 games left, including tonight against Denver (35-29) at Madison Square Garden, and the prospect for a harmonious relationship between Brown and Marbury looks worse than ever.

With another three years valued at $60.3 million remaining on his contract, Marbury will be difficult to trade, but it's virtually assured the Knicks will make the attempt this summer. Although it boggles the imagination at that price, even a buyout is not out of the question.

Marbury's name wasn't mentioned specifically, but team owner James Dolan recently said buyouts are a possibility this summer. The way things are going, Dolan might have to decide whether he wants to buy out Marbury or Brown.

you've gotta love a player who calls himself STARbury and basically says it's time for him to disregard his coach and be selfish.

Fool

03-13-2006, 12:29 PM

Indeed.

I also liked his supporting comment that he was going back to his old style of play because this current style wouldn't garner a max contract.

Kilo

03-13-2006, 12:35 PM

It's actually better for the Knicks if he would do so, as it might raise his trade value sorta deal. They HAVE to trade him this off-season, however given his contract and 2oo5-2oo6 season it could be mighty difficult. Maybe a hot finish would make that job easier.

H1Man

03-15-2006, 12:30 PM

Brown fires back in anger at Marbury

Larry Brown fired back in anger after Stephon Marbury said, among other things, that he needs freedom on offense, according to The New York Times.

"Look, I've been coaching how many years?" said Brown, whose Hall-of-Fame career spans three decades. "I never left a team in worse shape than I got it. Not one. Now think about that. Think about me and think about the guy who's talking," he said, referring to Marbury. "I never left a team in worse shape. Never asked anything of my players any different than I'm doing right now. Think about that. Think about that."

The Times says it was Brown's strongest, angriest, and most honest appraisal of a feud that became a back-page staple in the Big Apple not long after the start of the NBA season.

"So the bottom line is, I want us to rebound, defend, share the ball, play hard. That's all. If you can't do that, if that's not important enough to you, it's not on me. It's not on me. And you owe it to your teammates to do that every single night if you care about the right things. We're 17-45, all right? So we've got to figure out a way to get better."

Brown's tirade came in response to Marbury's recent cry for more freedom on offense. The star guard, citing the Knicks' poor record, also said that playing Brown's way has not worked, and that he would go back to playing as Starbury, the nickname he has given himself.

On Monday, Brown generally deflected questions about Marbury saying, "I'm hopeful that he will step up and be Starbury." But on Tuesday, Brown left little doubt that if the relationship can't be mended, he does not intend to be the one to leave town.

You can bet that the Knicks will actively shop for a Marbury trade this summer.
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/5414810

Black Dynamite

03-15-2006, 12:35 PM

Glenn

03-15-2006, 12:38 PM

I heard those sound bites from LB this morning on the radio and it made me smile. It's about fucking time, IMO.

Matt

03-15-2006, 01:02 PM

that hilarious.

to think he went from the most low maintenance, selfless, high chemistry teams in the NBA to that garbage. meh, serves him right. too bad we couldn't steal a draft pick from those fools. i could have been a 2010 pick and i'd still have high hopes for it, lol.

Kilo

03-15-2006, 01:07 PM

Knicks better get their shit together before the Nets move to Brooklyn.

Kstat

03-15-2006, 04:09 PM

LMAO

Marbury: 'It's personal now'
posted: Wednesday, March 15, 2006
filed under: NBA, New York Knicks, Stephon Marbury

The Larry Brown vs. Stephon Marbury feud escalated this morning at the Knicks' shootaround, the hate-hate relationship sinking to new depths of discord.

First, Marbury stood before reporters, called Brown insecure and vowed he'd keep striking back at Brown whenever he feels he's been publicly criticized.

Next, Brown castigated Marbury for having a selfish agenda and deflecting blame.

"I think it's personal now," Marbury said. "I don't think it's about basketball anymore. Now it's to the point where he's putting his 30-year career against my 10-year career. You know, coach is a great coach is what everyone says. We're supposed to be better than what we are. Did it happen now? No."

Brown was a portrait of disgust one day after asking people to compare his track record vs. his point guard's. Criticizing Marbury's "agenda," Brown also insinuated that Marbury hadn't accepted his share of the criticism for the Knicks having the NBA's worst record despite its highest payroll.

"So, you're the best guard in the league and the team is 17-45, yeah, it's the coach's fault," Brown said.

This was the fifth straight day of the two adversaries bickering at each other, and Wednesday's developments left the rest of the team staring in disbelief as first Marbury, then Brown, went through the ritual of airing their gripes through the team's beat writers.

"You've got to wonder whether both these guys own newspaper stocks," quipped Howard Beck of the Times.

A few more quotes from Marbury's diatribe and Brown's retort:

From Marbury:

"If coach is comparing his career to my career, he's got like a 20-year edge on me. To me that sounds like a lot of insecurity is going on. … He's speaking on things he's done, and I think people in New York want to know what he's going to do, you know, as far as us winning. What happened in the past is the past. I think New Yorkers can relate [to] what's going to happen now. We live more in the present."

On whether Brown had crossed the line by comparing his own track record of improving the teams he has coached to Marbury's history of failing to make better any of the teams he's been traded to:

"He always crosses the line. That's not nothing new. Certain coaches deal with certain things certain ways, and he handles his things through the media as opposed to sitting down and talking with people. And still, if you sit down and you talk with coach, it's liable to get back to everybody, so you're really not safe there either."

On whether he wants to play for Brown:

"I want to play basketball in New York. I love New York, and I believe New York loves me. … I'm at the point where I just want to win, and I want to play in New York more than anything in this world. But if that's not happening next year, I can't cry about it. I've been in this situation before and I understand, I know it's a business."

On whether Isiah Thomas should step in and try to resolve the feud:

"We don't have to have another grown man come and mediate two grown men. What's that about? He's the boss, but if there's a problem, come to me like a man. I don't have no problem. I'm comfortable with myself. I know who I am as a person."

On their future:

"I can coexist. I can't speak for another person. I'm cool. I'm fine. I can deal with it. But I'm no longer going to allow him to say things about me and I'm not going to say anything back. I mean that's just not going to happen. That's not going to happen. I allowed him to drag me the first three or four months in the paper, and I didn't say one word. I just sat back and just took it. But I'm not taking it no more. If something's going to be said, I'm going to defend myself. My mother taught me that: Somebody hits you, you hit them back."

On what the solution might be:

"I don't know. If I was a chemistry teacher, I'd probably have an answer, but I don't. … I don't need no new start. My start is right here in New York unless they say otherwise."

A few snippets from Brown:

Upon being informed that Marbury planned to continue answering perceived slights through the media:

"That's great, that's great. Again, I'm the coach of a basketball team, and the only thing that matters to me is that we play the right way, share the ball, try to guard and care about our teammates. I'm going to focus on that. I'm not going to focus on things that have nothing to do with being a good teammate. I've been coaching the same way my whole life. Things that really matter, I've said over and over and over again. It's amazing to me. I've never had a problem getting people to understand that before, and it's mind boggling to me after we win two games that it becomes an issue. So I want to focus on guys that are trying to do the right things to help our team win, and that's what I'm going to do."

Ever deal with anything like this before?

"Never. Never."

Does it raise doubts in Brown's mind about whether he and Marbury are a good pairing going forward?

"Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. No coach, no coach, would enjoy this situation. Because every coach that coaches this sport, it's about team. And when you hear players talk about team, you get real excited. When you don't hear players talk about team, it's not a lot of fun."

Would he walk away in frustration?

"No, no. No, no."

Is the best solution to trade Marbury over the summer?

"I'm not even thinking about that. I'm just trying to coach our team and make guys better. I want guys that care about the team that want to win games that understand what our problems are and try to correct them."

Is Marbury one of those guys?

"Well, we'll see. We're 17-45, and I'll take full responsibility for us winning 17 games and losing 45. So, you're the best guard in the league and the team is 17-45, yeah, it's the coach's fault.

"I don't know why you play a team sport and not be concerned about making your teammates better and helping your team win games. That's the only thing that really matters, and if you're the best player, surely you're going to have some effect on the game's outcome. And I've said this from Day 1, I've never given anybody in my career more free rein. In my career. And I went to the conference finals with Haywoode Workman as the point guard. Eric Snow was the fourth-string point guard in Seattle, and we went to the NBA Finals [with Snow in Philadelphia].

"I've been around guys, and every good team, it's all about team, and that's what we're going to try and get. You want to come and join that? That's fine. That's the only message that needs to be sent. You want to be part of the team and make your teammates better, you want to care about the right things and playing the right way, this is a pretty good place to be. You don't have that on your agenda, then this is probably a bad place to be."

Glenn

03-15-2006, 04:16 PM

LB is going to win this one, IMO.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Knicks suspended/inactivate Marbury for the rest of the year at some point.

It would probably hurt his trade value (if he has any with that contract), but at some point don't you have to go into damage control mode?

Of course, that would probably send Marbury onto the talk show circuit, SAS, Best Damn, ESPN the Mag, SI, etc.

If Isiah can't make these decisions, then he'll be gone first, then Marbury, IMO.

Matt

03-15-2006, 04:23 PM

i agree. marbury was expendable the moment they got Francis. even though LB is acting like a bitch too, i think Marbury's going to take the bigger hit in the public eye.

Black Dynamite

03-15-2006, 04:37 PM

i agree. marbury was expendable the moment they got Francis. even though LB is acting like a bitch too, i think Marbury's going to take the bigger hit in the public eye.
LB is being LB. you know how he is. i think he's been pretty cool to not blast on how wack his PG's attitude is. of course theres a line you have to draw. Marbury may never be a winner. the nets, suns, and timberwolves all did better after they dropped him and this doesnt help his rep.

Kilo

03-15-2006, 05:18 PM

Starbury's value might be plummeting, however there has to be worse contracts around the league that teams would trade to acquire him sorta deal.

SKelly

03-15-2006, 07:06 PM

LB is going to win this one, IMO.
Nobody's going to "win" here because both of these guys are acting like a couple of losers.

"Have his way?" I'll agree with that one.

b-diddy

03-15-2006, 10:53 PM

"If this was my contract year and I went to any organization, based on how I played this year, and asked for the max, tell me what they would tell me," .Marbury said in the interview.

LOL, i can think of a thing or two they would say.

marbury's basketball IQ must be in the teens. what a mess. is it possible to do a worse job than what isiah has done? jesus, if you TRIED to put together a worse mess, i dont think you could. only way zeke could sink lower is if he tried to split the MLE between isiah rider and dennis rodman.

i feel bad for LB. its pretty clear to me now that he wiggled his way out of detroit so he could get $70 million in 4 years while living in east egg. not a bad move. im sure he's praying for zeke to fire him.

-NoQuarter-

03-15-2006, 10:59 PM

"Well, we'll see. We're 17-45, and I'll take full responsibility for us winning 17 games and losing 45. So, you're the best guard in the league and the team is 17-45, yeah, it's the coach's fault."

Ouch.

LMFAO!

H1Man

03-16-2006, 12:22 AM

WTF is Marbury thinking anyway?

Does he really think that calling out LB in the press is going help him?

Glenn

03-18-2006, 01:44 PM

http://www.nypost.com/sports/knicks/65494.htm

Former Knick coaching candidate Bill Laimbeer said he lost interest in the Knicks' job once he realized that Brown would become the Knick coach at the latest in 2007. Laimbeer, coach of the WNBA's Detroit Shock and a Pistons' broadcaster, officially pulled himself out of the running in mid-July after interviewing with his former Bad Boy teammate, Isiah Thomas. Laimbeer knew even if Brown did not shake loose from Detroit last July, Thomas would hire Brown in the summer of 2007. Babysitting the Knicks for one year was not in his best interests but if Brown leaves prematurely and Thomas stays, Laimbeer could be in the picture.

Matt

03-18-2006, 02:15 PM

Matt

03-22-2006, 12:57 PM

http://www.nypost.com/sports/knicks/63406.htm

FRANCIS AIM: STARTING JOB NEXT YEAR OR TICKET OUT

March 22, 2006 -- Steve Francis made it clear: By next season, if he's not starting, he'd rather be departing.

The Knick guard yesterday said he'll willingly go to the bench when Quentin Richardson returns, which ironically could come tonight at Orlando, the team that just traded him a month ago.

But three-time All-Star added that, if he's not starting next season, the Knicks should trade him.

Then, after Larry Brown said Francis would have to earn back his job in training camp, Francis went out and spit the bit in a the Knicks' 114-109 loss to Toronto.

Stevie Franchise? Try Stevie Disenfranchised.

"Hopefully next year it'll change," said Francis, who had only come off the bench three times in his career before this season. "This summer we'll be able to evaluate more what my role is. I don't plan on coming off the bench next year.

"If it's a situation where they don't feel I'm a starting player on this team, it'll be good to go in a different direction.

"It's not a big issue now. [November] is when it'll be an issue. I'm not trippin' on it."

Brown's response?

"I'm happy he wants to start. That's why you have training camp," said the Knick coach, who praised Francis' willingness to come off the bench. "He'll be in a position to earn the right to play. I'm glad he wants to be in that position."

Francis has struggled with Brown's disciplined, half-court system, averaging just 12.4 ppg with the Knicks. He didn't score until 1:28 left in the half, and got showered with boos after back-to-back turnovers in the third. And his defense on Mike James, who barely broke a sweat scoring 37 points, was even worse.

After James made Stephon Marbury look silly with a crossover and basket with 4:43 left in the half, Brown put Francis on James. But after the Amityville, L.I., native dominated Francis even worse; and after a half-hearted effort fighting through a third-quarter screen, Francis played just one minute in the fourth.

"We're not playing an open style. We're more ball movement, and Larry's not much different," said Magic assistant GM Otis Smith. "I don't think he's lost confidence. He's just still adjusting to different styles."

Brown acknowledged that Francis has struggled in the halfcourt and when playing off the ball, but insists he can co-exist with Marbury.

"Right now it's a struggle. The more I see him the more I think he needs the ball on the break, running the team; and it's hard when you come in midseason. He's going to need training camp," Brown said. "They could be very effective, but I'm trying to figure out how.

"When Pearl [Monroe] came I don't think it was smooth from the start with Clyde [Frazier]. Guys have got to make adjustments and sacrifice. I'm sure Red [Holzman] had to get an understanding of how to use them. Hopefully we'll find that."

Glenn

03-22-2006, 01:33 PM

Jim Calipari was just on the Jim Rome show, and Rome asked him what he would do with Marbury.

Calipari: "Give him a lot of shots, give him lots of praise, put your arm around him and give him hugs -- and then trade him".

LOL

Glenn

03-22-2006, 04:10 PM

http://msn.foxsports.com/fantasy/story/5433430

Daily dose: Frye could be shutdown

Matt Lawrence
Posted: 1 hour ago

The Knicks not only lost to the Raptors Tuesday, but they might have also lost their prized rookie, Channing Frye, to a knee injury.

Frye will undergo an MRI exam Wednesday and there are some fears he could have played in his last game of the season.

http://www.nypost.com/sports/knicks/63406.htm

FRANCIS AIM: STARTING JOB NEXT YEAR OR TICKET OUT

By BRIAN LEWIS

March 22, 2006 -- Steve Francis made it clear: By next season, if he's not starting, he'd rather be departing.

The Knick guard yesterday said he'll willingly go to the bench when Quentin Richardson returns, which ironically could come tonight at Orlando, the team that just traded him a month ago.

But three-time All-Star added that, if he's not starting next season, the Knicks should trade him.

Then, after Larry Brown said Francis would have to earn back his job in training camp, Francis went out and spit the bit in a the Knicks' 114-109 loss to Toronto.

Stevie Franchise? Try Stevie Disenfranchised.

"Hopefully next year it'll change," said Francis, who had only come off the bench three times in his career before this season. "This summer we'll be able to evaluate more what my role is. I don't plan on coming off the bench next year.

"If it's a situation where they don't feel I'm a starting player on this team, it'll be good to go in a different direction.

"It's not a big issue now. [November] is when it'll be an issue. I'm not trippin' on it."

Brown's response?

"I'm happy he wants to start. That's why you have training camp," said the Knick coach, who praised Francis' willingness to come off the bench. "He'll be in a position to earn the right to play. I'm glad he wants to be in that position."

Francis has struggled with Brown's disciplined, half-court system, averaging just 12.4 ppg with the Knicks. He didn't score until 1:28 left in the half, and got showered with boos after back-to-back turnovers in the third. And his defense on Mike James, who barely broke a sweat scoring 37 points, was even worse.

After James made Stephon Marbury look silly with a crossover and basket with 4:43 left in the half, Brown put Francis on James. But after the Amityville, L.I., native dominated Francis even worse; and after a half-hearted effort fighting through a third-quarter screen, Francis played just one minute in the fourth.

"We're not playing an open style. We're more ball movement, and Larry's not much different," said Magic assistant GM Otis Smith. "I don't think he's lost confidence. He's just still adjusting to different styles."

Brown acknowledged that Francis has struggled in the halfcourt and when playing off the ball, but insists he can co-exist with Marbury.

"Right now it's a struggle. The more I see him the more I think he needs the ball on the break, running the team; and it's hard when you come in midseason. He's going to need training camp," Brown said. "They could be very effective, but I'm trying to figure out how.

"When Pearl [Monroe] came I don't think it was smooth from the start with Clyde [Frazier]. Guys have got to make adjustments and sacrifice. I'm sure Red [Holzman] had to get an understanding of how to use them. Hopefully we'll find that."

Matt

03-23-2006, 09:26 AM

"I looked out there and it looked like a lot of guys just didn't care," Brown said after the Knicks fell to 19-48. "That's tough, but you gotta keep finding the people that do (care) and hope you have enough of them."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/story/402241p-340696c.html

CindyKate

03-31-2006, 02:24 PM

this has sunk to the 2nd page?

anyway, new fodder:
Ballad of Isiah
from
http://www.truehoop.com/

Glenn

03-31-2006, 02:27 PM

this has sunk to the 2nd page?

anyway, new fodder:
Ballad of Isiah
from
http://www.truehoop.com/

Simply brilliant, nice find.

I think this is a permalink for archive purposes: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VM_fCfk7Bdk&eurl=

Fool

03-31-2006, 02:37 PM

Incredible.

Matt

04-04-2006, 07:12 PM

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/story/405783p-343605c.html

Nate nearly shut down

BY FRANK ISOLA
DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER

Nate Robinson had become such a nuisance for Larry Brown that the coach considered sending him to the Developmental League last month to work on his game and improve his attitude.

According to a source close to Robinson, Brown wanted to demote Robinson to the NBA's minor league rather than keep him on the inactive list. Brown broached the idea with Isiah Thomas, but Thomas felt that Robinson would benefit from practicing with veteran teammates.

Robinson spent eight games on the inactive list from Feb. 24 through March 11. The decision to deactivate Robinson came one game after the rookie guard won the slam dunk title during All-Star Weekend in Houston, which raises the possibility that Brown was sending Robinson a message.

Robinson has appeared in the last 11 games and has started the last two. He scored a career-high 34 points in Friday's loss to Philadelphia and was criticized by Brown for showboating throughout the game.

On Sunday, Robinson said he felt "awkward" trying to conform to Brown's wishes of being less demonstrative. Robinson shot 4-for-12 and scored 10 points with three turnovers during the Knicks' 114-95 loss in Philadelphia. "I was not doing some of the things like I do, like getting my teammates hyped," Robinson said on Sunday. "I felt if I did that, Coach would be mad at me."

Brown is an old-school coach who believes rookies should be seen and not heard.

Robinson's aggressive style has been embraced by fans, who admire a 5-8 player who can challenge the league's tallest players for rebounds. But the talkative Robinson has gotten himself into a few minor skirmishes with several teammates, including Jerome James and Malik Rose. During the preseason, Robinson and James nearly came to blows and Robinson was ready to use a broom handle as a weapon. He and Rose got into a heated argument in the shower after a game.

In December, Brown reprimanded Robinson for acting disorderly on the bus ride to the team plane in Atlanta. According to a source, Robinson was shooting spit balls. The following day, Robinson was on the inactive list and the Knicks announced that he was home with a stomach virus.

In recent weeks, Brown complimented Robinson for working harder in practice and felt Robinson was showing progress. But after Friday's game, Brown criticized Robinson for showboating when the player he was guarding, Allen Iverson, scored 47 points.

Assuming Brown returns to coach next season, Robinson is a prime candidate to be traded. The Knicks have an abundance of guards and Brown isn't convinced that Robinson, Stephon Marbury or Steve Francis is suited to be the full-time point guard.

b-diddy

04-04-2006, 11:00 PM

pistons win 60 before knicks win 20...

perhaps this is brown getting what he deserves, but what a mess. your awfully cold blooded if you dont feel any simpathy for him.

Black Dynamite

04-05-2006, 02:25 AM

04-05-2006, 03:22 AM

pistons win 60 before knicks win 20...

perhaps this is brown getting what he deserves, but what a mess. your awfully cold blooded if you dont feel any simpathy for him.
ummm it was his choice to be there IMO. So nothing cold blooded in my lack of sympathy(cant speak for everyone else). But I hate the knicks anyways. anytime they are in the playoffs, other teams get hosed by the refs in hopes of keeping the basketball mecca media market in the mix. If Brown actually fails in NY its great to see from an "i hate the knicks" standpoint.

And you forget. he's getting paid severance buyout from us and a mega contract from the knicks. with a fuckable wife for 20 year old men let alone his old ass. Nope no need for sympathy. he's well compensated for his troubles.

I have always hated the Knicks too. I have no sympathy for LB, he chose his destiny and his 19 wins, 60 million and the hate of every Knick fan. I am sorry but everyone (media wise) talked about how Lb would have the Knicks rolling at this point and ready for big things in 06-07. It's just funny to me he left here with 987 wins, and he sits nearly 1 year later at 1006 wins.

Taymelo

04-05-2006, 08:10 AM

pistons win 60 before knicks win 20...

perhaps this is brown getting what he deserves, but what a mess. your awfully cold blooded if you dont feel any simpathy for him.
ummm it was his choice to be there IMO. So nothing cold blooded in my lack of sympathy(cant speak for everyone else). But I hate the knicks anyways. anytime they are in the playoffs, other teams get hosed by the refs in hopes of keeping the basketball mecca media market in the mix. If Brown actually fails in NY its great to see from an "i hate the knicks" standpoint.

And you forget. he's getting paid severance buyout from us and a mega contract from the knicks. with a fuckable wife for 20 year old men let alone his old ass. Nope no need for sympathy. he's well compensated for his troubles.

$15 million spread over 3 years to win...
or $17 million paid in ONE year to lose...

or for an apples to apples comparison should I say:

$15 million spread over 3 years to win...
or $47 million over those same 3 years to lose.

Yeah.

I'm feeling real sympathetic for him.

I can think of $32 million reasons over a 3 year period not to feel too bad for Larry leaving the Pistons for the Knicks (or for his his wife, or his kids, or their kids, or their kids' kids, or anyone else who will ever inherit that shitload of money that's only going to grow with interest).

Fool

04-06-2006, 08:56 AM

ESPN Insider article on the deals that got the Knicks to where they are. It reads like a Denny Archive thread.

Updated: April 5, 2006
Pat explanation for Knicks' salary-cap disaster
Insider
Sheridan
By Chris Sheridan
ESPN Insider
Archive

If you go back more than a half-decade to the immediate aftermath of the Patrick Ewing trade, none other than Charles Barkley opined that the Knicks should be eternally confined to hell for dealing away a player who meant so much to the franchise.

Patrick Ewing
AP Photo
Knick fans are now feeling the pain Patrick Ewing once felt.

Fast forward to the end of Year 1 of the Isiah Thomas/Larry Brown partnership, and the Knicks indeed find themselves in the eternal torment of salary-cap hell.

New York's payroll is projected to be upward of $125 million next season, and the Knicks have no possibility of getting underneath the salary cap for the rest of this decade.

Owner James Dolan has endorsed the string of trades that have brought more financial burden along with fewer victories, and there has been no sign whatsoever that the Knicks might stop perpetuating the formula of dealing off their expiring contracts for other high-salary players with multiple years left on their deals.

It all might have been different, however, if the Knicks had allowed Ewing to finish his career in a New York uniform. His $14 million salary would have come off the cap in the summer of 2001, and the Knicks could have dropped below the salary cap and rebuilt the standard way.

Instead, a litany of bad deals has flowed from the assets New York acquired in the Ewing trade, and that doesn't even include other deals that brought in cap killers Malik Rose (under contract for $23 million through 2008-09), Maurice Taylor (owed $9.7 million in 2006-07), Jalen Rose (owed $16.9 million next season), the $57 million extension given to Allan Houston that is now being paid by insurance or the sign-and-trade deal for Eddy Curry that will cost the Knicks their first-round pick this year and possibly next year (when the Chicago Bulls will have the right to swap picks with New York).

But beginning with the Ewing trade, the acquisition of bad contracts has snowballed. Here's a look back:

Sept. 20, 2000: Ewing is shipped to the Sonics in a four-team, 12-player trade for Luc Longley, Glen Rice, Lazaro Borrell, Travis Knight, Vladimir Stepania, two No. 1 picks and two No. 2 picks. At the time of the trade, Longley is owed nearly $21 million over three years and Rice is due roughly $8 million over each of the next two years. Ewing had asked for a trade after learning New York was shopping him, and former Garden president Dave Checketts acquiesced to his request.

Aug. 10, 2001: After he failed to fit in under coach Jeff Van Gundy, Rice is shipped off by then-general manager Scott Layden in a three-team deal with Dallas and Houston that brought Shandon Anderson ($54 million contract) and Howard Eisley ($28 million) to the Knicks. Anderson eventually took a $19 million buyout after feuding with new team president Isiah Thomas.

Jan. 5, 2004: In Thomas' first blockbuster deal, Eisley, Charlie Ward, Antonio McDyess, Maciej Lampe and two first-round picks are shipped to Phoenix for Stephon Marbury and Anfernee "Penny" Hardaway. At the time, Marbury is owed more than $85 million and Hardaway still has two full seasons left at almost $30 million.

Feb. 22, 2006: Hardaway's expiring contract is shipped along with Trevor Ariza to Orlando for Steve Francis, who is owed $49 million over the next three seasons.

Summer, 2006(?): Thomas will try to find a taker for Marbury, with the Minnesota Timberwolves perhaps the likeliest destination for two reasons: (1) The Wolves need to placate Kevin Garnett, who wants talent brought in, and (2) the Wolves also have a bevy of the type of bad contracts the Knicks specialize in acquiring. A package of Marko Jaric (signed through 2010-11), Mark Madsen (signed through '09-10) and Trenton Hassell (signed through '08-09) would work under the cap.

Chris Sheridan, a national NBA reporter for the past decade, covers the league for ESPN Insider. To e-mail Chris, click here.

the wrath of diddy

04-08-2006, 12:05 PM

ROTFLMFAO @ Knick fans

http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=500542

Shitbury a Hall of Famer that revolutionized the PG position! Poor souls.

Uncle Mxy

04-11-2006, 09:14 AM

I do feel a twinge of sympathy for Jackie Butler.
But just a twinge.

Fool

04-11-2006, 09:28 AM

ROTFLMFAO @ Knick fans

http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=500542

Shitbury a Hall of Famer that revolutionized the PG position! Poor souls.

Revolutionized the PG position?????? Yea, first PG that sucked a** and declred himself the best PG in the NBA at the same time....

lol Thats quite a revolution.

Black Dynamite

04-11-2006, 09:33 AM

The revolution is in all the teams that continue to pay him after he keeps getting traded. every pg he's been replaced with has helped the team win after his departure.

LOL@steve francis leaving Orlando being considered a subtraction. The way those two play ball. You're better off w/o them.

05-14-2006, 03:18 AM

There are two sources which are reporting that Dolan is of currently working on a buyout if the final 4 years of LB's deal. One sources claims that Dolan is only thinking about the possibility of a buyout. The other source says it is only a matter of getting an agreeable dollar amount on paper, to complete the buyout. In the coming weeks the truth will come out.

Additionally Dolan is not totally sold on Zeke's job security but the feeling among many of Dolan's officals and those close to him is Dolan believes, Zeke did what he could but LB tanked to get Zeke fire, or atleast didn't do all that he could have to make the Knicks better. If Kiki is interested in the Knicks Zeke could be gone if that happens look for the Knicks to go the cheap on the HC coaching opening meaning Mussleman, Bzedelik and former interim HC of the Knicks fit the bill of good but cheap. There is an outside shot that if Zeke keeps his job he will try to hire former Piston team mate Bill Laimbeer.

If LB is bought out look for him to do the "honorable" thing and either help out a friend with a sick son and take over the Nuggets or try help out a troubled kid who has a bad repuation in Sacramento.

Uncle Mxy

05-14-2006, 07:08 AM

When does Lenny Wilkens stop getting paid??

Glenn

05-14-2006, 07:22 AM

It's even better than you described JS, if Isiah tries to coach this team it's going be to great!

If I'm LB and they are going to pay me to get out of that place, I wouldn't even blink.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2444469

Report: Dolan considers buying out Brown's contractESPN.com news services

Larry Brown's dream job with the New York Knicks could end after only one season.

Madison Square Garden chairman James Dolan, who's upset over Brown's record and the coach's public criticism of his players, is considering buying out the final four years of the coach's contract, the New York Daily News reported in Sunday's editions.

The buyout is worth at least $40 million, the newspaper reported.

The Knicks declined to comment.

One published report indicated Knicks president Isiah Thomas was in line to replace Brown as head coach, the newspaper said, but the team would not confirm nor deny it.

Brown, who led the Knicks to a 23-59 season, has indicated that he will not resign. But the club could avoid having to pay another coach upward of $5 million a year if Thomas takes the job, the Daily News reported. One source told the newspaper that Thomas -- who coached the Pacers from 2000-2003 -- would be amenable to coaching the Knicks.

In April, one day after the Knicks completed one of the worst seasons in franchise history, Thomas said the Hall of Fame coach would return to coach the team for a second season. The underachieving roster was another story.

"I am loyal to winning and I am not loyal to any singular individual," Thomas said then. "I'm going to do what I need to do to make our team better. ...

"When you won 23 games, I think we'll make some changes," he said. "Coach and I haven't sat down and fully decided what changes we'll make, but we'll probably make some changes."

flipscrackers

05-14-2006, 10:18 AM

If he gets bought out, how much money would LB have ended up making in the past 12 months? The buyout from Detroit, year 1 of NY's salary, then their buyout (if true).

He knows how to make his employers CTC.

Kstat

05-14-2006, 11:05 AM

Is Larry the richest coach in NBA history?

He's going to get his 2nd massive buyout in 2 years.

Uncle Mxy

05-14-2006, 01:23 PM

Even with Larry's recent fortunes, I bet Pat Riley has more -- the books, the commercials, trademarking "threepeat", gravitating toward big markets, etc.

Glenn

05-15-2006, 09:41 AM

Yesterday's Vescey column.

http://www.nypost.com/seven/05142006/sports/63701.htm

COULD BE BROWN & OUT COULD BE BROWN AND OUT

By PETER VECSEY

May 14, 2006 -- HOOP DU JOUR AMONG the "celebrities" who ambled over to Lincoln Center to watch David Blaine immerse himself in a water bubble was Isiah Thomas. If anybody can appreciate someone who stands around the West Side doing nothing, it's the Knicks president.

Then again, should information from a high-level team source prove precise, I'll be forced to wolf those words.

According to that Knicks hearing aide, Thomas suddenly has a plan; who cares if it's borrowed from his bosses? From what I'm told, Cablevision boss James Dolan and Garden President Steve Mills are endorsing the buyout of Larry Brown's remaining $44 million, four-year obligation, and strongly urging Thomas to take over as head coach, a position he held for three years with the Pacers.

That's one way, I guess, of holding Thomas accountable. Since replacing Scott Layden 21/2 seasons ago, he's assembled and re-assembled the roster.

Presumably, he thinks his chosen ones can play more than a lick.

Presumably, he still likes most, contrary to Brown, who loathes most, none more than Stephon Marbury, Isiah's poisonous pet who recoils on orders. That's why Stephon didn't make his season-ending speech to the media, as threatened; his cult figure commanded him to holster his fangs.

Presumably, Thomas will be able to extract more energy, caring and loyalty from his recruits than a drill instructor who habitually rags them in public. Marbury won't exactly be the only player celebrating, should Brown be bounced.

The way I hear it, Thomas is positive the Knicks will improve appreciably with him in charge. He's confident a tweak here, a tweak there, and his talent pool's win total will soar from 23 to close to break even.

For months, the piqued, the turned off and the tuned out have advocated the deportation of Mills, Thomas, Brown and Marbury, altogether aware it would never remotely happen in its entirety during this off-season or, considering their bloated contracts, in seasons to come.

Convincing Dolan to extinguish himself is a more practical prospect. You can't as much as tempt him to sell his family cable company and all its accoutrements; it's not like people haven't made the effort.

"The only way to get the Knicks out of Dolan's clutches," groans the above-mentioned insider, someone who's been there, tried that, "is to pry it from his cold hands." At the very least (at best, in other words), the popular rumination by those lost in a daydream is that even Dolan, Mills and Thomas must recognize that Brown and Marbury cannot return for another venomous go-around.

One pollutant or the other - hopefully both - must be eradicated before next season's projected mediocre presentation is too far gone to resuscitate.

Unless Brown's health issues - and advantageous insurance clauses - compel him to split, that would have seemed to leave Marbury as the odd man out. Judging by quotes from Timberwolves owner Glen Taylor, it's not unreasonable to visualize a trade to re-acquire Kevin Garnett's former kindergarten playmate.

That was the common-held belief. Yet, we figured wrong.

Glenn

05-15-2006, 09:55 AM

http://www.nypost.com/sports/knicks/66071.htm

END OF LINE FOR LARRY

By MARC BERMAN

May 15, 2006 -- Larry Brown underwent another bladder surgery last Friday and now this week he's expected to get cut again. By the Knicks.

Yes, Brown's days as Knicks coach are numbered.

According to sources, Brown is on the firing line, sources said, because he never acknowledged the talent assembled was better than their 23-59 record. Brass is worried it can't acquire the type of players Brown needs to win.

Owner James Dolan and Garden president Steve Mills believe the Knicks will be hard pressed to ransack the roster to Brown's liking. Hence the Knicks are exploring a divorce because of a irreconcible differences on the quality of the assembled cast.

Nearly four weeks after their tragic season ended, Dolan is expected to seek a buyout settlement this week, with president Isiah Thomas the leading candidate to inherit the coaching reins, taking over in a dual role.

In a bizarre irony, Brown went under the knife Friday in one last attempt to correct his bladder problem, The Post has learned. Brown's health has been a major issue the past two seasons. "He got out of the hospital on Friday, so I haven't spoken to him," Knicks assistant coach Phil Ford said. "I called to wish him well but he's recuperating from the operation. We were told the operation was a success." (Brown's condition forced him to use a catheter.)

According a source, the Knicks have not yet approached Brown's agent, Joe Glass, who was blindsided by a phone call about Peter Vecsey's front-page story in the Sunday Post that Dolan is considering buying out Brown and replacing him with Thomas, citing a high-level team source.

Unless this bad marriage can be repaired quickly, Brown's Knick tenure will last one season and he will own the worst career winning percentage in Knick coaching history (.280).

The Knicks did not deny Vecsey's story. "We're not going to comment on it," said Garden spokesman Barry Watkins. "We're not going to comment until when and if there's something to comment on."

Negotiations could turn ugly, knowing Glass' hard-line style, as he'll probably want the full money. Brown would be owed close to $40 million if the Knicks just fire him. But Brown could be amenable to taking less because of his age (65), health woes and the Kings' job opening. Brown's wife, Shelly, is from California. The Knicks begin their predraft workouts at their Westchester practice facility next Monday and would like to have Brown's future ironed out before then.

"I have no comment and that doesn't confirm or disconfirm (the story)," Glass told The Post. "I'm not going to comment on something I haven't read or intend to read. I'm not going to comment on any conversations I've had with Isiah Thomas over the past year."

In Memphis in March, Dolan was asked if he expected more results after paying $50 million for Brown. The Knicks owner said tellingly, "That's a misnomer. I've only spent two-thirds of one season."

The organization was astounded the club finished with 10 fewer wins than last season after adding Eddy Curry, Jalen Rose and Steve Francis. Brown, who broke the NBA record for most starting lineups (43), was often critical of the roster's makeup.

Brown's removal would be a horrible reflection on the Hall-of-Fame coach, illustrating how difficult he is to work with. Two owners in a span of 10 months wanted nothing to do with him anymore. Even after leading the Pistons to two straight Finals, Pistons owner Bill Davidson wanted him gone.

While it would seem a gigantic financial hit to the Knicks, a league source pointed out keeping Brown would cause the player payroll to expand even more. One of Brown's wishes in upgrading the roster is trading for Kenyon Martin and his $70 million contract, despite his bad knees and bad attitude.

According to a source, Thomas feels he cannot satisfy Brown's demands of making major trades, despite a serious inquiry into Chicago's Ben Gordon. "Look at their roster, who can they trade other than the young guys and get something good back," said another league source who has spoken to Thomas about the matter.

That source said Thomas does not want to trade his three first-round selections from last year - Nate Robinson, David Lee and Channing Frye, nor Eddy Curry. He also does not believe he can get close to value on Stephon Marbury, whom Brown also wants dealt. That Marbury and Brown had a bitter feud doesn't help Brown's cause. Plus, several players quit on Brown during the season. Bringing roughly the same crew back could spell disaster. The Knicks have two late first-round picks. Brown said in March he'd rather package them because they had enough young players.

During breakup day April 19, Thomas was in a subdued mood when he said lukewarmly Brown would return.

marc.berman@nypost.com

Fool

05-15-2006, 10:07 AM

Why isn't this in the LOL@Knicks thread?

Glenn

05-15-2006, 10:14 AM

We can move it there at some point.

I've laughed multiple times at this story, especially at Zeke.

He can't trade any of these problem children because of their bloated contracts, and they all don't want to be coached. They had a rebellion, and it worked. Great, they got over. Now Zeke has to deal with all of these fools that he acquired himself, and in the end, he's putting his neck square on the chopping block.

I wonder what becomes of Herb Williams?

I wonder if Kiki will just lay out and wait for Dolan to offer him the world once Zeke gets canned?

Fool

05-15-2006, 10:26 AM

BTW, Larry Brown is the smartest coach ever to grace the league. If he plays the same tune he's been playing till he gets his buyout then I'm 100% positive he started planning this whole thing back in the "It would be my dream job but I'm the coach of the Pistons" days.

Anthony

05-15-2006, 10:56 AM

You guys really need to get over LB

Black Dynamite

05-15-2006, 11:05 AM

LB need to get me a cut of that free knick money before zeke gets fired.

H1Man

05-15-2006, 06:36 PM

Brown buyout rumors don't bother Marbury

Larry Brown may be on his way out of New York. Stephon Marbury doesn't care either way.

"Based on our record, that's normal for anybody to have that speculation," the Knicks' point guard said of reports that the coach may be booted following a 23-59 season.

Owner James Dolan is considering buying out Brown's contract, the New York Post and Daily News reported Sunday. His possible replacement: team president Isiah Thomas, according to the Post.

"I wouldn't mind, it doesn't matter who coaches," said Marbury, who feuded with Brown throughout the season. "I don't care if Larry Brown comes back. I wouldn't mind at all."

Thomas coached the Indiana Pacers for three seasons, reaching the playoffs each time, before he was fired.

"We have not commented on anything over the last two days," Barry Watkins, senior vice president of communications for Madison Square Garden, said Monday.

A message left for Brown's agent was not immediately returned.

Brown, a Brooklyn native, described his hiring last year as a "dream job," and the Knicks hoped his happy homecoming signaled a return to the playoffs. But despite a league-high payroll of more than $120 million, New York finished with the league's second-worst record, matching the most losses in franchise history.

Still, the Hall of Fame coach - who signed to a five-year deal with the Knicks worth a reported $50 million - has said he believes he will return.

"I meet with Mr. Dolan and Steve probably once a week," Brown said the day after the season ended. "I've never, ever gotten a feeling they don't want me to be a part of this. And they know how much I want to be here, especially in light of the fact that we won 23 games and I feel directly responsible for that."

He acknowledged that coaches without his resume probably wouldn't be safe with such a poor record, but Thomas indicated after the season ended that Brown would be back for another try.

"We haven't considered making a change because of his history. He may not want to hear this, but outside of Detroit and maybe Indy, he starts slow," he said.

"If you look at his history, he's a slow starter and then he picks up steam and all of a sudden players start doing what he wants them to do and GMs such as myself find a way to get him the things that he needs and he finds a way to win. And I believe that will be the case here."

If Brown does not return, it would be the second time in as many years that a team didn't want him back. He reached a buyout last summer with the Detroit Pistons - Brown maintains he was fired - even though he led the Pistons to the NBA Finals in both of seasons.

Brown endured a miserable season with the Knicks, squabbling with players through the media and missing three games in April because of illness. He had only one worse season as a coach, when he went 21-61 with the San Antonio Spurs in 1988-89.
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/5609498

realistic

05-15-2006, 06:51 PM

WTF does Marbury mean it "doesn't matter who coaches"? Does that mean that after Larry is canned, Knix fans can expect the same sorry performance under a different coach? Ouch.

Glenn

05-16-2006, 07:42 AM

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/16/sports/basketball/16knicks.html?_r=1

Brown's Camp Delivers a Denial Heard Before

By HOWARD BECK

There are growing indications that the Knicks are ready to sever ties with Coach Larry Brown and replace him with Isiah Thomas, the team president. The franchise has apparently resolved to make the move, with only the details of when and how to be worked out.

But Brown's longtime agent, Joe Glass, who has negotiated every one of his contracts — and orchestrated every early exit — says there is no exit for Brown on the horizon. If the Knicks have other ideas, and Glass said he last spoke with team officials a week ago, they have yet to say so.

"Nobody has ever said anything to me or anyone else that they didn't want Larry back," Glass said yesterday, addressing reports that the Knicks intended to dismiss Brown. "He is physically, mentally and professionally ready to assume his responsibilities as coach of the Knicks."

Later in the day, Glass and Thomas discussed Brown's status by phone.

"I spoke to Isiah Thomas earlier this afternoon and he categorically denied there's any substances to what was in the paper," Glass told The Associated Press.

Brown presided over a 23-59 season, the team's worst in two decades, and he alienated many of his players. He irritated team officials with his frequent critiques of the roster and with his feud with guard Stephon Marbury. Brown has four years and more than $40 million left on a five-year deal he signed last July.

The franchise's disillusionment with Brown has been widely reported. The New York Post first reported Sunday that Knicks ownership was ready to sign off on a buyout of Brown's contract.

An Eastern Conference executive who had spoken with Knicks officials said yesterday that Brown's dismissal was a certainty. The executive also confirmed that Thomas, at the direction of the ownership, planned to replace Brown. The executive was granted anonymity because he was not authorized to talk about another team's decisions.

Knicks officials continue to decline comment.

This is the second straight spring that Brown's coaching status has turned into a messy soap opera. A year ago, while coaching the Pistons in the playoffs, Brown created bad feelings with his bosses by inquiring about a position with the Cleveland Cavaliers. Questions about Brown's health also posed a problem for Pistons officials, who eventually bought out Brown's contract.

Even as those negotiations moved forward, Brown and Glass denied that he would leave the Pistons. Glass is now issuing nearly verbatim denials.

Brown is again coping with health problems, although they do not appear to be as serious. Brown had what Glass said was "a minor surgical procedure" last Friday. Glass declined to offer specifics, but two friends of Brown said it was another attempt to correct his bladder condition. They said they believed the operation was successful. The friends were granted anonymity because Brown wanted his health issues to remain private.

"He's recovering nicely," Glass said. "He's the coach of the Knicks, and ready and willing and able, and he intends to follow through on his commitment to coach the Knicks."

Glass also denied a report yesterday in The New York Times that representatives for Brown had inquired about his coaching the Charlotte Bobcats. He expressed frustration with reports that questioned Brown's job security. "The conjecturing going on through the papers from these anonymous sources is something I have a hard time dealing with," Glass said.

The Knicks would still have to negotiate a buyout settlement with Glass, or swallow the more than $40 million owed Brown. Glass negotiated a $7 million buyout with Detroit last summer. If ties were severed, Brown would presumably be free to entertain other offers. Charlotte and Sacramento are possibilities, but those who know Brown well say Golden State may be the most logical landing place.

At age 65, Brown ideally would seek a team that is playoff-ready. Brown and his wife, Shelly, prefer to live in a big city. And Brown would like to work for an organization that would allow him to move into a front-office role if he was unable to coach.

The Warriors meet those qualifications. Brown is friends with Chris Cohan, the Warriors' owner; they own homes in the Hamptons and have socialized in the summer. The Warriors are young and deep and could be playoff contenders. They have struggled the last two seasons under Mike Montgomery, whose job status is considered shaky.

Ousting Brown now, although it would cost the Knicks tens of millions of dollars, is viewed by some team officials as the easier path — and perhaps the more financially sound one.

They are concerned that keeping Brown — and keeping him happy — would necessitate a messy, and expensive, roster overhaul. Dumping the hefty contracts of Jalen Rose, Maurice Taylor, Marbury or Steve Francis may require the Knicks to take back even more onerous long-term contracts, further inflating the payroll and the team's luxury-tax payments. It would also cost tens of millions of dollars to buy out or waive players Brown deems undesirable.

Taymelo

05-16-2006, 08:11 PM

Source: Brown believes Knicks will fire him

ESPN.com news services

A source has told ESPN that Larry Brown has told friends there is no question in his mind that he will be fired by the New York Knicks.

The source also said Brown has told friends that no one from the Knicks has spoken directly to him in the last three weeks. Brown had bladder surgery Friday and is recovering at his home in suburban New York.

Brown's agent, Joe Glass, said he did hear from Knicks president Isiah Thomas on Monday and Thomas told him there was no truth to reports that the Knicks wanted to buy out Brown's contract.

"I spoke to Isiah Thomas earlier this afternoon and he categorically denied that there's any substances to what was in the paper," Glass told The Associated Press on Monday.

While no formal buyout talks have begun, it's clear the Knicks have made it known to Brown that they're open to the notion of a settlement on the four years and $40 million remaining on Brown's contract. The New York Post reported Tuesday that the Knicks are hoping the can buy out Brown for $25 million.

Brown signed the deal amid much hoopla last July, taking over what he once called a "dream job" and then leading the Knicks through a nightmarish season.

League insiders told ESPN.com that the Knicks, looking at things from a practical and financial standpoint, feel they'd be best served to cut their losses with Brown rather than undergo the type of large-scale roster overhaul that would be needed to placate him. In other words, why trade Stephon Marbury for less-than-star players whose contracts will carry huge luxury taxes when they can simply buy out Brown and move on with a new coach.

That coach would almost certainly be Thomas, who assembled the roster that Brown found so difficult to coach. Thomas and Marbury have been close throughout their two-plus years together in New York, and there's a school of thought that if anybody is able to get through to Marbury and turn him into a winner -- or at least a better teammate -- it might just be Thomas.

"Based on our record, that's normal for anybody to have that speculation," the Knicks' point guard told the AP of the reports that Brown may be cut loose.

As for the possibility of Thomas becoming coach, Marbury said: "I wouldn't mind, it doesn't matter who coaches. ... I don't care if Larry Brown comes back. I wouldn't mind at all."

Brown perplexed his players and eventually lost their support by constantly switching lineups and rotations, never quite settling on any set combination over the course of the entire 82-game season. His penchant for making thinly veiled criticisms of his players through the media irked his players nearly as much as it bothered the team's corporate owners at Cablevision.

Despite the players' and management's strangely rosy pronouncements on the day after the season ended, all was certainly not well inside the franchise. One of Brown's final moves that left several key people scratching their heads was his use (or non-use) of Steve Francis and Jalen Rose after they were acquired at midseason.

Knicks brass clearly realized something needed to be done. And in a culture where Cablevision typically writes a severance check to make its problems go away, the easiest solution in this case seems to be buying out Brown.

"I'm not going to comment on Larry's feelings through all this, and there really isn't anything else to say," said Glass, who negotiated Brown's $7 million buyout with the Pistons last July after Detroit owner Bill Davidson also came to the realization that he'd be better off with a different coach. The divorce of the Pistons and Brown turned into a bitter breakup, and this one appears to be heading that way, too.

The likely next step in the process would be a meeting between Brown and Knicks owner Jim Dolan, although Brown has reportedly asked for one and was turned down.

And with Glass saying no buyout talks have been discussed as of yet, this breakup could drag on through next week when the Knicks will learn the consequences of another of their mistakes -- trading their No. 1 pick to Chicago for Eddy Curry. The Bulls will learn next Tuesday at the draft lottery, where they'll be among the mathematical favorites, where the pick formerly owned by the Knicks will fall in the draft.

Information from ESPN Insider Chris Sheridan and The Associated Press was used in this report.

DennyMcLain

05-16-2006, 08:13 PM

Son of a bitch! You beat me to it!!! But I'VE got HTML sucka...

Updated: May 16, 2006, 6:35 PM ET

Source: Brown believes Knicks will fire him

ESPN.com news services

A source has told ESPN that Larry Brown has told friends there is no question in his mind that he will be fired by the New York Knicks (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/clubhouse?team=nyk).
The source also said Brown has told friends that no one from the Knicks has spoken directly to him in the last three weeks. Brown had bladder surgery Friday and is recovering at his home in suburban New York.
Brown's agent, Joe Glass, said he did hear from Knicks president Isiah Thomas on Monday and Thomas told him there was no truth to reports that the Knicks wanted to buy out Brown's contract.
"I spoke to Isiah Thomas earlier this afternoon and he categorically denied that there's any substances to what was in the paper," Glass told The Associated Press on Monday.
While no formal buyout talks have begun, it's clear the Knicks have made it known to Brown that they're open to the notion of a settlement on the four years and $40 million remaining on Brown's contract. The New York Post reported Tuesday that the Knicks are hoping the can buy out Brown for $25 million.
Brown signed the deal amid much hoopla last July, taking over what he once called a "dream job" and then leading the Knicks through a nightmarish season.
League insiders told ESPN.com that the Knicks, looking at things from a practical and financial standpoint, feel they'd be best served to cut their losses with Brown rather than undergo the type of large-scale roster overhaul that would be needed to placate him. In other words, why trade Stephon Marbury (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?statsId=3099) for less-than-star players whose contracts will carry huge luxury taxes when they can simply buy out Brown and move on with a new coach.
That coach would almost certainly be Thomas, who assembled the roster that Brown found so difficult to coach. Thomas and Marbury have been close throughout their two-plus years together in New York, and there's a school of thought that if anybody is able to get through to Marbury and turn him into a winner -- or at least a better teammate -- it might just be Thomas.
"Based on our record, that's normal for anybody to have that speculation," the Knicks' point guard told the AP of the reports that Brown may be cut loose.
As for the possibility of Thomas becoming coach, Marbury said: "I wouldn't mind, it doesn't matter who coaches. ... I don't care if Larry Brown comes back. I wouldn't mind at all."
Brown perplexed his players and eventually lost their support by constantly switching lineups and rotations, never quite settling on any set combination over the course of the entire 82-game season. His penchant for making thinly veiled criticisms of his players through the media irked his players nearly as much as it bothered the team's corporate owners at Cablevision.
Despite the players' and management's strangely rosy pronouncements on the day after the season ended, all was certainly not well inside the franchise. One of Brown's final moves that left several key people scratching their heads was his use (or non-use) of Steve Francis (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?statsId=3325) and Jalen Rose (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?statsId=2636) after they were acquired at midseason.
Knicks brass clearly realized something needed to be done. And in a culture where Cablevision typically writes a severance check to make its problems go away, the easiest solution in this case seems to be buying out Brown.
"I'm not going to comment on Larry's feelings through all this, and there really isn't anything else to say," said Glass, who negotiated Brown's $7 million buyout with the Pistons last July after Detroit owner Bill Davidson also came to the realization that he'd be better off with a different coach. The divorce of the Pistons and Brown turned into a bitter breakup, and this one appears to be heading that way, too.
The likely next step in the process would be a meeting between Brown and Knicks owner Jim Dolan, although Brown has reportedly asked for one and was turned down.
And with Glass saying no buyout talks have been discussed as of yet, this breakup could drag on through next week when the Knicks will learn the consequences of another of their mistakes -- trading their No. 1 pick to Chicago for Eddy Curry (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?statsId=3514). The Bulls will learn next Tuesday at the draft lottery, where they'll be among the mathematical favorites, where the pick formerly owned by the Knicks will fall in the draft.

Glenn

05-17-2006, 12:05 PM

LMAO!!!

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/story/418462p-353449c.html

Isiah in league of his own, CBA owners: Thomas deserves Knick mess

BY CHRISTIAN RED
DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER

With Madison Square Garden owner James Dolan thinking about dumping Hall of Fame coach Larry Brown, and Knicks president Isiah Thomas inching closer to coaching the $125 million doormat, some of Thomas' former business partners in the Continental Basketball Association are once again shaking their heads.

"I'd be blown away," says Bill Ilett, owner of the Idaho Stampede, when asked about Thomas pacing the sidelines in the shadow of Red Holzman. "I think Isiah has again shown that once the door is closed and the work starts, he takes on a whole different role. And again, it's about him."

Ilett was one of several CBA owners who dealt with Thomas when the former Detroit Pistons point guard purchased the league in 1999. But despite grand visions of creating the "Microsoft of basketball," it took Thomas just 18 months to run the 55-year-old league into bankruptcy before he jumped ship to coach the Indiana Pacers. The Pacers never got past the first round of the playoffs in Thomas' three years coaching.

During Thomas' brief tenure overseeing teams such as the Sioux Falls Skyforce and Fort Wayne Fury, owners said he often used abrasive tactics and profanity-laced tirades to get his way. When the league foundered, Thomas left embittered CBA owners, employees and fans in his wake.

"So Larry Brown's going to go and Isiah's going to take over? (Thomas) will get to coach the guys he got and they're not very good. Who will he blame this time around?" asks Rich Coffey, the former general manager of the CBA's Fort Wayne Fury and current owner of the Arena Football League's Fort Wayne Freedom. "This is about being a stupid owner. They've got the highest payroll in basketball and the worst team. On top of that $125 million (payroll) they have to pay a luxury tax. Now you're going to take the architect of that and put him on the floor to coach the team.

"Couldn't happen to a nicer guy."

Bill Bosshard, the former owner of the La Crosse (Wis.) Bobcats, also points out that even if Thomas can win the loyalty of the current Knick players, the franchise has bigger woes that might take years to correct.

"There's no future in the draft or in the salary cap. They've both got (the team) hamstrung," says Bosshard. "It wouldn't make any difference if Mickey Mouse was coaching them. The amount of money they're going through in this whole thing is mind-boggling. And they've got one of the most historic arenas in the world in Madison Square Garden. It's kind of a joke to see on TV."

Ilett, whose Stampede team recently joined the NBA's developmental league (NBDL), says the Garden circus should serve as a cautionary tale for other NBA franchises.

"NBA franchises cannot operate with one guy. Phil Jackson taught that to Michael Jordan, that the Bulls couldn't operate (alone) with the greatest basketball player in the world. That he needed team effort and that (Jordan) needed to step back to go forward," says Ilett. "Isiah's 45 years old and he still has not learned that. It will be interesting to see how it all shakes out in the end. It looks like it would fit one of those Harvard Business School studies on what not to do."

Glenn

05-17-2006, 12:08 PM

http://www.nypost.com/sports/knicks/66138.htm

BYE BUYOUT

By MARC BERMAN

May 17, 2006 -- Angry agent Joe Glass claimed the Knicks will have to fire recuperating Larry Brown if they don't want him to coach next season because he will not accept a buyout.

As reported in yesterday's Post, owner James Dolan is seeking to buy out Brown for $25 million of the nearly $40 million he's due on his contract's remaining four years.

"There's been no discussion of a buyout and there won't be a discussion of a buyout," Glass told The Post yesterday. "We're not going to accept a settlement. He's coaching the Knicks or they're firing him - one way or another. There's not going to be a $25 million buyout.

"He wants to coach this team," Glass added.

Brown has told confidants he believes he will get fired, according to ESPN, as he has not heard directly from a club official in three weeks.

The Post has learned Brown's wife, Shelly, told a confidant last night she believes it's "50-50" her husband will return, and she is feeling a lot of deja vu from the Detroit saga that ended with Pistons owner Bill Davidson getting Brown out.

A source close to the family said the Browns are most worried the Knicks have not formally squashed reports.

"They were the last to know that Davidson wanted to fire him when everybody else seemed to know (last July)," the source said. "They have no idea what's going on."

Glass said nobody has contacted them about a buyout.

Thomas is in Hilton Head, S.C., meeting with his college scouts, and Brown still plans to show up Monday at the team's Westchester facility to conduct the first pre-draft workouts with prospects.

Though an NBA source said there's no timetable to resolve Brown's future, it will be awkward for Brown to run those drills with the noose hovering above his head.

A source close to Brown said the Knicks coach was "blindsided" by Peter Vecsey's front-page Post story Sunday that owner Dolan was considering buying out the coach and having Isiah Thomas take over the reins.

The source said Brown was returning Sunday from a Manhattan hospital with Shelly when they heard about the Post's front page. Brown had successful bladder surgery last Friday.

Glass said Monday that Thomas told him in a phone call the newspaper reports have "no validity."

Glass was furious the media continued to speculate that Brown is finished. In fact, Glass blamed The Post yesterday for Brown's Detroit departure, citing its "dream job" story.

"You want to know the truth," Glass said. "The truth is when Bill Davidson decided to fire Larry, he said one of the main reasons was he read a story in the paper by Marc Berman that the Knicks were his dream job. That was one of the main reasons he wanted him out of there." (That Post story included Brown saying he was rooting for Herb Williams to keep the job.)

Dolan, Brown and Glass appear headed to an imminent face-to-face showdown, but league sources do not believe Brown can say anything to save his job, even though his bladder issue is cleared up.

"There's no way I can determine someone's future action," Glass said of Dolan. "I only have to go by what they tell me. My job is to protect Larry Brown and his interests. Can I predict what course of action they'll take? No. But I'm very, very tired of all the conjecture."

Dolan reportedly believes buying out Brown is more economical than agreeing to the trades Brown has suggested that would add significantly to the Knicks' payroll and luxury-tax payment. Kenyon Martin's $70 million contract alone would be triple Brown's cost (with luxury tax). The Knicks dread bringing back Brown with roughly the same roster that finished 23-59 this past season.

Glenn

05-17-2006, 12:10 PM

One more good one, then a merge into LOL@Knicks.

http://www.nypost.com/sports/nets/66131.htm

WARD SAYS TEAM NEEDS ROLE PLAYERS

By LENN ROBBINS

May 17, 2006 -- Former Knicks guard Charlie Ward is sickened by what he sees.

It's not the losing. The former Heisman Trophy winner at Florida State and longtime Knicks point guard has endured his share of painful losses, great wins and personal successes, including yesterday's selection into the National Football Foundation College Hall of Fame.

It's the way the Knicks lost this season, their utter lack of team play, that Ward can't stomach.

"You look at the roster and they have a lot of guys who come from a I-need-the-ball-to-be-effective mentality," Ward said yesterday. "You've got to have role players. You can't have all superstars or superstar mentality."

Ward was proud of the fact that even though he often started at point guard, he was a quintessential role player in his 10 seasons with the Knicks. He averaged 6.3 points and 4.0 assists, the Knicks were a winning team, and Ward was happy to play his part.

"Everyone wanted a superstar point guard while I was here," Ward said. "They've got a big name now and they're dealing with the consequences."

Ward didn't utter Stephon Marbury's name, and Ward said the Knicks' failure wasn't just one player's fault. But Ward always played a leadership position: quarterback at FSU, where he led the Seminoles to their first national championship, then point guard in the NBA. The floor general sets the tone for the team.

"Guys are different," Ward said. "I really can't fathom people saying they can't succeed in a certain system."

Marbury and soon-to-be ex-coach Larry Brown openly clashed over the guard's inability to fit into Brown's system. As reported exclusively by Peter Vecsey in Sunday's Post, the Knicks and Brown are looking into ways to end their relationship after one horrendous season.

Ward was an assistant coach with the Houston Rockets this season and said he's preparing himself to be an NBA head coach. But he said he wouldn't want to coach in New York, and after watching the three-ring circus (James Dolan, Isiah Thomas and Brown) that was the 2005-06 Knicks, who can blame him.

"If Coach Brown is out, whoever the next coach is will have to work a miracle," Ward said. "It's going to be tough. I don't know who led the revolt, but for it to become public and guys to say they can't work in a style is really disheartening.

"Look at Coach Brown's resume," Ward continued. "From the outside looking in, he's had short stints but he's been successful. For players to feel they can't play a system . . . the Detroit Pistons won a title. They might not have liked the system, but they won. The same thing in Indiana. I just think the Knicks are immature."

Uncle Mxy

05-17-2006, 01:14 PM

Isiah learned all the wrong lessons from Trader Jack, I tellya...

Black Dynamite

05-18-2006, 12:22 AM

can atlanta fire mike woodson for us?:o

realistic

05-18-2006, 12:24 AM

We should start an "LOL at the Pistons" thread.

Anthony

05-18-2006, 06:42 PM

LOL@The pistons for letting Brown go.

BIG BEN'S FRO

05-19-2006, 06:59 AM

I would have to say he probably took his franchise model from Bob Whitsitt when he was with the Portland trailblazers. Man now with no pick, it is going to be tough to rebuild that squad in a hurry. I guess if I was Zeke, I would have to reestablish their putrid defense. They can only accomplish this now by overspending, as usual. The best strategy would be for them to trade for expiring contracts and tank it for a season or two. But in the spirits of Isaiah, maybe he can sign Zo to the Full MLE (horrible deal) might get his teams defensive intensity up. Man that team has so many cancers and albatross contracts it is horrible.

Black Dynamite

05-19-2006, 11:45 PM

you lost me after you said sign Zo. :p :D

Glenn

06-07-2006, 11:15 AM

http://www.nypost.com/sports/knicks/67130.htm

DOLAN SICS HIS LAWYERS ON SITE
By MARC BERMAN

June 7, 2006 -- Knicks owner James Dolan has sent his lawyers after the new Web site selltheknicks.com for peddling derogatory T-shirts with his likeness, including one with Dolan pictured in a dunce cap, The Post has learned.

According to sources, Cablevision attorney Ashima Dayal dispatched an e-mail to cafepress.com, which manufactures, distributes and handles the shirt sales for the fledging anti-Dolan Web site, whose birth was first reported in the Post's Rumble section 10 days ago.

The e-mail from Dolan's lawyer said, in part, the Dolan T-shirts, which sell for $19.99, "infringes upon their intellectual property rights." In accordance with the notice, the manufacturer has temporarily taken the T-shirts off the site.

The founders of selltheknicks.com are trying to convince the manufacturer that all the T-shirts need not be banned.

"I don't know how you claim something like that," said one of the Web site founders, who requested his last name not be used for this story. "His face is one thing. The name Dolan is incredibly generic. It's a common name."

The same source said his Web site will continue on, and if they can't sell the old T-shirt, they are planning to make a new one inscribed "Dol-ass."

"It's kind of spineless," he said. "At least we have [Dolan's] attention. If he wasn't scared of what we possibly could do, he'd let it roll over. It's encouraging, but it's also disappointing he's being so petty and can't take a joke."

About 20 T-shirts have been sold, and the founders of the site say they can't be recalled. The Web site founders are planning a protest at Dolan's musical gig at B.B. King's on July 9.

A Knicks spokesman declined comment.

Vinny

11-24-2006, 06:27 PM

What the fuck are up with Isaiah's eyebrow's? He looks evil:

http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/sp/tools/med/2006/11/ipt/1164351646.jpg

Cross

11-28-2006, 11:07 AM

Tension is building once again among the ranks of the New York Knicks. And, once again, at the center, sits Stephon Marbury. That was actually a pun, since Marbury was benched for the start of the second half of the Knicks' 106-95 loss on Saturday, a game that dropped New York to 5-10 on the season. Marbury did not attempt a shot in just over 19 minutes of action, including just five minutes in the second half, marking the first time in his career that he's gone shot-less in a game. While Knicks coach Isaiah Thomas said he sat Marbury because he felt ill in the pre-game shoot-around, Marbury said, "I wanted to play. I was feeling sick this morning but I was fine when I got to the arena." According to various published reports, Marbury was the only person on the Knicks bench not applauding when the team mounted a fourth-quarter rally, opting instead to sit with a towel over his head; also pointed out is that he's got as few friends on the team roster as he does in your average Madison Square Garden crowd these days. Marbury is averaging 6.2 fewer points and 1.9 fewer assists than last season, by all accounts an unmitigated disaster. Fantasy owners who thought it couldn't get any worse than last season have been proven wrong and then some. Just two seasons ago, Marbury averaged 21.7 points, 8.2 assists, 1.4 threes, and 1.5 steals, so there is a talented point guard still residing somewhere in the current manifestation of Starbury. It seems completely necessary for all parties involved that Marbury leave the Knicks roster, the sooner the better. But there is really no way of knowing how this situation will eventually be resolved. It's the Knicks, after all.