Minny trade Al Jefferson and Ramon Sessions for Prince, Stuckey, Daye and Kwame.

9-man rotation be:

Big Ben/Jefferson (Wilcox)
Jefferson/Super Nova/Maxiell
Jerebko/Rip (Summers)
Rip/BG
Sessions/Bynum/(Atkins)

Yes?

No?

Crazy?

Including Sessions is a nice touch, lol. This just feels like a Joe D trade.

I might drive over there and speak to him myself.

Well, you know how I feel about Bynum starting.

That's why I included Sessions lol

But it all fits.

Minny wouldn't need him with Stuckey and Flynn in the same backcourt. One of those guys would be on the floor at all times to "run" the team.

And maybe it's just me but I think this is a pretty fair deal.

They be:

Kwame/Love
Love/Gomes
Prince/Daye
Stuckey/Brewer
Flynn/Stuckey

plus whatever else they have now (I don't care about the rest of their roster)

Nice young core, with cap space this off-season and possibly next season - they also have multiple first rounders in 2010...

I'm not gonna say they are better off doing this trade but shit - it doesn't fuck 'em up.

They have Rubio's rights, too, to keep or trade.

Kwame has experience in the triangle, too.

Okay, now I'm reaching.

Ooh... I like this trade.

Of course, if I were in Minny's shoes, I'd think it was crazy to give up Jefferson unless there's something not being told.

Jens (Cologne, Germany): What do you think about rumors the T-wolves are listening to offers for Al Jefferson and what would it take to get him? Maybe Prince and Bynum? Or Prince and Kwame? Second, what is going to happen to Gilbert Arenas if the Wizards are really voiding his contract?

Langlois: Jefferson was the centerpiece for Minnesota when it dealt Kevin Garnett. I’m not sure I buy that Minnesota is shopping him. I can see that with Kevin Love in tow, and the reality that a Love-Jefferson combination at the power positions makes Minnesota vulnerable defensively, that the T-wolves would consider dealing one or the other. But they can’t do the deal without getting back another significant young player in return. If you noticed, it was reported that Indiana rejected Minnesota’s proposal of Jefferson for Danny Granger – a young player with All-Star potential. For the Pistons, the equivalent would be Rodney Stuckey, and I don’t know that the Pistons would be keen on dealing the 23-year-old Stuckey for an undersized big man coming off major knee surgery – even if he’s one of the league’s top 10 post scorers. Because Minnesota is so weak on the wings, I’d guess any Pistons package would also have to include Austin Daye. Really don’t see a fit for the Pistons, whose most obvious trade assets – Hamilton and Prince – are better suited to go to established teams looking for a veteran piece to put them over the top.

LOL, I knew Keith was going to say that giving up stuckey would be too much. That's rich.

So giving up a guy that could be a top 10 guard (except he has no range whatsoever), for a top 10 post player is a bad move?

LOL @ Keith

wow, i really hope thats only Keiths screwed opinion... if we dont deal Stuckey for Big Al something is really wrong + i really like Sessions, he can be a starting PG for sure...

What. the. fuck!

How do you NOT jump for joy if Minnesota would take Stuckey/Daye (+ Prince and Kwame) for Jefferson (+ Sessions)?

Fuck me! That's beyond comprehension.

Al Jefferson, since 2007 when he joined Minny, has more double-doubles in that time frame than everyone else in the entire fucking NBA except Dwight Howard and Tim Duncan.

I know that cause I have him in the fantasy comp and when that little note appeared (less than 2 weeks ago) he was only 2 double doubles behind Tim Duncan!

Holy Shit!

And Joe's mouthpiece thinks we shouldn't try for Jefferson?

WHAT. THE. FUCK?

He looked pretty damn good last night. I watched him play the Nuggets. He had the baby hook, the turn around jumper, and was active on the glass.

The best part about the Langlois thing is you can easily imagine what he would/will say right after Stuckey is dealt, "it was painfully obvious to those in the inner circle and in the lockeroom that it just wasn't working out or clicking".
It's the same way he handled Curry, defend him to the hilt and then let him have it on the way out. Fucking company man.

The guy is fucking awesome from what I've seen and he's young.

IF he's being shopped then we gotta at least make the offer. If they say no then that's cool.

But you gotta make the play for him

He's an awesome scorer and rebounder. Not too awesome at much else. Think Randolph.

He's an awesome scorer and rebounder. Not too awesome at much else. Think Randolph.

He's 3 years younger, 1 inch taller and makes about 5 million less. those are big differences.

And that's not counting character (since I don't know much about his).

Yes, you forgot that his last name begins with a J, and Randolph begins with an R. Good finds Chris.

Think the player. He plays like Randolph. That's all I'm saying.

I agree. Very similar style. His high school profile compares him to Brand and Randolph. BTW, did you know he averaged 43 PPG and 18 RPG his senior year?

I'm just saying those differences are big. 5 mil is the difference between using the MLE or not (which can be big if you find a guy like Billups). It also allows you to make a trade that adds salary (5 mil farther from tax range). The 3 years is a big deal too.

You make that trade in a second.

Yet mouthpiece Keith claims otherwise!

Get the fuck outta here with that horse shit.

Get Jefferson in the East, team him with Nova, Rip and BG and holy fuck it's on

I miss Evil Keith.

Jefferson had 26 pts and 26 boards today!

But he's not worth Stuckey?

LMAO

Seriously. Dude makes slightly more than Rip. I would trade anyone on the team for Jefferson and call it a good season.

How bad does Minny want a shooter?

Gordon, Kwame (expiring), Atkins (Expiring), 2nd rounder (it'll be a high one, I'm sure)

Jefferson, Sessions, Pavlovic

They get a gunner and two expiring contracts. Kwame is depth at C, Atkins is depth at PG so they don't get too thin with this trade. Plus, they save $3m.

Pistons get their big-man. Sessions starts at PG with Bynum as the backup, Stuckey slides to SG. Or, Stuckey starts at PG and Rip starts at SG, with Stuckey sliding over to SG when Bynum or Sessions come in.

Or save them $4m and swap Pavlovic for Cardinal, add Wilcox and Summers on our end. May sweeten the pot for them a bit.

I doubt they move Jefferson without getting Stuckey back in the trade. He'd be the starting point for any discussion IMO.

And no matter what I seriously doubt Joe deals Ben Gordon. We just signed the guy. Why spend all that money on him then move him less than a year later? We would have been better off not signing him to start with and using the money on a big like David Lee or via a trade (draft pick for whoever)

You trade him less than a year later because Al Jefferson wasn't available to sign? I just did the Gordon thing because I kept seeing that they wanted a "gunner" or "shooter" or whatever. Stuckey doesn't have that killer jumper that it seems they're looking for.

Yeah, I read that article after replying here first.

I still don't think they'd take Gordon - they ain't trying to win now.

I think they'd take Stuckey and Daye cause long-term those 2 + Love + Flynn + whatever they got for Rubio could be pretty fucking good.

Minny trade Al Jefferson and Ramon Sessions for Prince, Stuckey, Daye and Kwame.

9-man rotation be:

Big Ben/Jefferson (Wilcox)
Jefferson/Super Nova/Maxiell
Jerebko/Rip (Summers)
Rip/BG
Sessions/Bynum/(Atkins)

Yes?

No?

Crazy?
Crazy!


Revise: Minny wants a Wing player, Jefferson for Prince and Summers maybe? I'd live with that(though I think Jerebko is the most overrated Piston ever already).

Jefferson had 26 pts and 26 boards today!

But he's not worth Stuckey?

LMAO
Not when I'd have to see Atkins on the court, and not when what they want is an athletic wing player. Danny Granger was their first option, wasn't happening though.

Crazy!


Revise: Minny wants a Wing player, Jefferson for Prince and Summers maybe? I'd live with that(though I think Jerebko is the most overrated Piston ever already).
I don't know how Jerebko is rated since I've only been able to watch a couple games this year. He's been a decent fill-in starter, but he's not some young stud player. Maybe he develops into that, but I just think of him as a hustle guy at this point.

I don't know how Jerebko is rated since I've only been able to watch a couple games this year. He's been a decent fill-in starter, but he's not some young stud player. Maybe he develops into that, but I just think of him as a hustle guy at this point.
Not even in Maybe territory.

He's a hustle guy with a very inconsistent shot and 2nd rate handles. Actually as a fill in i'm frustrated with him being a mediocre scoring threat when left wide open. Most of his offense comes on loose balls, rebounds, and broken plays. I appreciate him as a hustle guy of the bench, but i'm not satisfied with him as a starter.

Either way you fuckers voting him for player of the game when he passes the 10 point plateau on your phones are fucking ridiculous. I'm surprised there hasn't been an effort to stuff the ballot box for the all star game.

I thought it was awesome how Big Ben was looking for JJ on cuts to the hoop last night. It worked several times and made me wonder how much more of that we could do with a playmaking PG. I was lmao that Ben was taking it upon himself to make those plays. Wallace played one of the best games that I've ever seen him play last night, which is amazing, but this isn't really the right thread for this.

I thought it was awesome how Big Ben was looking for JJ on cuts to the hoop last night. It worked several times and made me wonder how much more of that we could do with a playmaking PG. I was lmao that Ben was taking it upon himself to make those plays. Wallace played one of the best games that I've ever seen him play last night, which is amazing, but this isn't really the right thread for this.
So Wallace making plays in the post is proof that we need a new PG? GTFOH ... You keep harping on areas we don't need to fix. At the end of the day we need more scoring up front, No high quality facilitator making big men better than they are is available(That fucker Devin Harris doesn't count). And if they were I'm not sold on it improving our tandem of losers in maxiell and wilcox. We need another scorer down low. Jefferson can be had imo for less than some think. Though i'm the only person here who likes Tay, i think he and maxiell (with maybe a pick) comes fairly close to at least getting talks started. They want a wing athlete first and foremost.

No matter how bad your bigs are, and ours are, they'll always be better when they play with a PG that knows how, and is willing, to get them the ball at the right time and in the right spot, as opposed to pounding the ball into the floor for 20 seconds and then driving to the hoop into 3 defenders.

Glan (Grand Rapids, Mich.): I’m sure you’re getting inundated with Al Jefferson questions, but there is a trade floating around that I’d like to get your opinion on. How about Al Jefferson and Ramon Sessions for Prince, Stuckey, Daye and Kwame?

Langlois: Not a fan, Glan. Stuckey and Daye have the potential to be the Pistons’ two best players and they’re 23 and 21. Jefferson also has a lot of good years ahead of him – if he’s healthy. He’s coming off a major knee injury that would make me a little nervous – especially because of the bulk he carries – about trading away a huge chunk of your future. It’s something to consider if you think Sessions can be at least an average starting point guard, but the jury is out on that score.

lol

I doubt they move Jefferson without getting Stuckey back in the trade. He'd be the starting point for any discussion IMO.

And no matter what I seriously doubt Joe deals Ben Gordon. We just signed the guy. Why spend all that money on him then move him less than a year later? We would have been better off not signing him to start with and using the money on a big like David Lee or via a trade (draft pick for whoever)

I didn't read the rest of the thread because I'm stuck on this sentence.

How the fuck would getting David Lee or a fucking draft pick be better than doing anything that gave us Al Jefferson? Are you kidding me? If we turned our last offseason cap space in to Al Jefferson by sacrificing goats at halftime for the rest of the season I'd drive those fuckers into the arena myself.

Ok, so now I read the last post in the thread too.

We all need to get KL to say something to us and then have that under our names. Like Vinny is the KL insider and Gla's should now be "KL is not a fan".

I didn't read the rest of the thread because I'm stuck on this sentence.

How the fuck would getting David Lee or a fucking draft pick be better than doing anything that gave us Al Jefferson? Are you kidding me? If we turned our last offseason cap space in to Al Jefferson by sacrificing goats at halftime for the rest of the season I'd drive those fuckers into the arena myself.

Maybe you should read the rest of the thread or the rest of the post.

Z suggested we (aka Joe) deal Ben Gordon as part of the package for Jefferson.

I seriously doubt Joe does that, since he signed BG 6 months ago. I then complained that we signed BG in the fucking first place when we coulda used that cash on David Lee and IF we did sign Lee we wouldn't be sitting here talking about Jefferson cause we'd already have Lee.

FUCK! Reading is fundamental.

This is the biggest load of bullshit ever:


Glan (Grand Rapids, Mich.): I’m sure you’re getting inundated with Al Jefferson questions, but there is a trade floating around that I’d like to get your opinion on. How about Al Jefferson and Ramon Sessions for Prince, Stuckey, Daye and Kwame?

Langlois: Not a fan, Glan. Stuckey and Daye have the potential to be the Pistons’ two best players and they’re 23 and 21. Jefferson also has a lot of good years ahead of him – if he’s healthy. He’s coming off a major knee injury that would make me a little nervous – especially because of the bulk he carries – about trading away a huge chunk of your future.

Before we go further people need to know that Jefferson is 25 years old. Big men generally hit their prime later than other players. So at his current level he's a double double machine and been healthy pretty much all fucking season.

And if we're not gonna make a trade because we're worried about the incoming player getting injured then let's just shut up shop now! What kind of stupid shit is that? Stuckey could blow out his knee tomorrow too.

And if that wasn't enough bullshit to fit into a single reply Langlois has more and this is just nuts


It’s something to consider if you think Sessions can be at least an average starting point guard, but the jury is out on that score.

How the fuck is Sessions ability to run the point a deal breaker?

We've got Will Bynum! Everyone and their fucking mther thinks Bynum is a good one. Sessions would merely start at play 20 mins. Bynum would get the majority of the playing time at PG.

And besides, last season Sessions was at least an average starter. So the jury ain't out - you actually have a season of evidence as opposed to none.

Fuck this mouthpiece motherfucker. Joe better make some calls and get something done cause this season is done - he needs to move on and build for the future.

Rip may or may not be part of that but Tayshaun? Hit the bricks, jabroni, get to steppin'. And rug the fuck up - I hear it's cold in Minnesota

Maybe you should read the rest of the thread or the rest of the post.

Z suggested we (aka Joe) deal Ben Gordon as part of the package for Jefferson.

I seriously doubt Joe does that, since he signed BG 6 months ago. I then complained that we signed BG in the fucking first place when we coulda used that cash on David Lee and IF we did sign Lee we wouldn't be sitting here talking about Jefferson cause we'd already have Lee.

FUCK! Reading is fundamental.

Hi.

I read the thread up to your post so I know you were talking about Gordon signing. That's why I said "turning our cap space from last year" (you know, the thing we used to sign Gordon) "into Al Jefferson".

Only you would think having David Lee would be better than having Al Jefferson. Just like when you expected the Raptors to matter every year for the last decade. "Really guys, this year all those weak-ass players will get tough and be good."

Hi.

I read the thread up to your post so I know you were talking about Gordon signing.

Was I? I was talking about BG? Really? And yet you claim you read the thread up until that post....


That's why I said "turning our cap space from last year" (you know, the thing we used to sign Gordon) "into Al Jefferson".

Only you would think having David Lee would be better than having Al Jefferson.

Seriously - you're a fucking idiot.

Zekyl was talking about sending BG to Minny. I said that not only won't it happen (you know - we just signed his ass) but we should have signed David Lee instead of BG in the first place.

But I explained that already, right? You're just a moron that somehow fails to read posts or stay on the topic. Only you would be be fool enough to think I'd rather have Lee than Jefferson.

I would prefer to have Lee instead of BG especially now that we still have Rip on the books. But I'm the idiot, right? I'm the guy who can't fucking read.


Just like when you expected the Raptors to matter every year for the last decade. "Really guys, this year all those weak-ass players will get tough and be good."

And this stuff about the Raptors comes from where?

From the board discussing various teams and me saying "You know, I think Toronto will get better this season"? What the fuck does that have to do with anything?

Jefferson plays for Minny. Lee plays for NY. BG plays for us. Ain't no fucking person mentioned in the trade a Raptor - maybe you just put that out there because your dumb ass is trying to hide the fact you didn't actually read what is posted?

Wanker

Pharoah fail.

Pharoah fail.

Um, no.

And you spelt it wrong.

Are you that fucking myopic?


I then complained that we signed BG
You just fucking wrote that.

But no, you weren't talking about BG. You then didn't criticize me for not understanding you were talking about BG.

Wow you are terrible.

And the Raptors should be talked about EVERY TIME you open your mouth about something other than Diamond Dallas Page. Your love for them was THAT bad for THAT long.

Gotta love Fool - chopping sentences in half to suit his side of the story.


I seriously doubt Joe does that, since he signed BG 6 months ago. I then complained that we signed BG in the fucking first place when we coulda used that cash on David Lee and IF we did sign Lee we wouldn't be sitting here talking about Jefferson cause we'd already have Lee.


Granted it's a long ass, run on sentence but I don't see a full stop after "I then complained we signed BG"

And I didn't bring BG into the discussion - Zekyl did. Did you expect me not to read his post and somehow reply to it... Of course you did - you do that shit all the time.

Up until Zek mentioned him Ben Gordon was not part of the fucking discussion. So no - I wasn't talking about him. I was talking about Jefferson/Sessions for Prince/Kwame/Stuckey/Daye.

As for my "LOVE" of the Raptors - I'm sorry fucking my fandom of another NBA team offended you. I didn't realise it was THAT bad for THAT long. If I had known it was causing you so much fucking pain I would have posted a Toronto topic every single day.

Woosh.

LOL

I don't need to quote you fully. I wasn't using the content of the statement for anything. I was only using the statement to show YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT BG.

OMFG. YOU WERE. It doesn't matter who brought him up or why. YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT HIM. Then you tried to criticize me saying you weren't talking about him.

So dumb.

And I'm not even talking about your terrible love of weakass white post players or teams that have no shot at anything this time.

And I'm not even talking about your terrible love of weakass white post players.
That's uncalled for. They have feelings too.

^Nope. Weakass white post players don't have souls.

FYI: I like David Lee. I like Al Jefferson. I like Ben Gordon.

This moment in MoTown's preferences brought to you by: weakass white post players.

LOL

I don't need to quote you fully. I wasn't using the content of the statement for anything. I was only using the statement to show YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT BG.

OMFG. YOU WERE. It doesn't matter who brought him up or why. YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT HIM. Then you tried to criticize me saying you weren't talking about him.

So dumb.

And I'm not even talking about your terrible love of weakass white post players or teams that have no shot at anything this time.

And that's the difference between you and me.

I don't consider me replying to Z as me "talking about BG". Someone else brought him into the thread - I gave my opinion and then moved on. There wasn't some long winded essay or exchange about BG at all.

But you can take whatever shots you like at me and use whatever ammo you think you got. Bring up the Raptors, the disappearing acts, Chris Bosh, David Lee, me whining about the Draft picks. Talk shit about wrestling, the "love cave" or whatever else you can think of.

I don't care - and I don't take or make shit personal. I don't do that because I have better things to do with my time.

Like watch wrestling. Like follow Chris Bosh on twitter. Like go back and look at old NBA Drafts. Like downloading a Knick game or 2. Or maybe, just maybe I might retreat into the love cave with my woman and make another baby.

But no one cares about that shit.They wanna see some fireworks. It ain't New Year's Eve no more but you can try and bring it. You can call me names then I'll call you names and then we can go to the terrordome where I will smoke your punk ass like your a small bud and I'm Cheech AND Chong.

Cause after 20 fucking years of watching pro wrestling there is one thing I think I can do: Cut a decent promo.

If you wanna experience that then I suggest you get off your ass, dust yourself off and begin a new thread in the Terrordome. But before you do I got a little advice for you: If you're unsure of yourself, if you don't know if you should pursue this, if you think that maybe Pharaoh may just be a little off his rocker...

then maybe, just maybe you might wanna duck out the backdoor. And if you do happen to bail just remember - the life you save may be your own or mine lol

I've been trying to follow this, but I keep vacillating between confusion and indifference.

But that last post was indisputably good messageboarding.

I've been trying to follow this, but I keep vacillating between confusion and indifference.

But that last post was indisputably good messageboarding.

I want to be like P, so I guess I need to work on my simple 2 word replies that say "Fuck off" I need to explain myself more. I'm going to get right on that.

So what you're all saying is we SHOULDN'T trade BG?

I want to be like P, so I guess I need to work on my simple 2 word replies that say "Fuck off" I need to explain myself more. I'm going to get right on that.

Yeah, you do have to type more than "Fuck Off".

Why?

Because, and this might amaze you:

Some people don't actually read the posts in the thread!

They skim through and then BOOM! they (usually) partially quote something you posted and say "Hey dipshit - see this right here? That means you're a dickhead"

Umm, no - it means you FAILED to read the thread.

What makes you think you're so fucking important that you dont have to read the thread you are posting in?

Can't you at least have the fucking courtesy to read what is being discussed before you throw in your 2 cents?

Of course not - you're far too cool for that.

There are plenty of those fuckers at work. Whenever there is a meeting these ass licking cunts sit there and just constantly try to throw their 2 cents in while someone else is talking. They don't listen to what's being said - they just have to blurt out some random shit cause it'll make them feel all warm and fuzzy that they managed to speak in public.

Newsflash, dickheads: When the meeting is over everyone is pissed off at the morons who wouldn't shut the fuck up. These ass lickers turn a 15 minute meeting into a 30 minute waste of time.

And since some of us actually have work to do the 2 or 3 ass lickers are on the Shit List because they have the attitude of "Look at me - I have an opinion".

We all have opinions. Just because you have the time and the energy to provide it doesn't mean you should...

Unless you've been paying attention - in which case be my (house) guest, Kato

And Zekyl - I'd love to offer my opinion of your post but if I do reply I would be talking about Ben Gordon. I believe I did answer your question earlier though - which sparked this whole thing in the first place.

Speaking of sparking things up - where's my little bud? Cheech AND Chong need their medicine

And Zekyl - I'd love to offer my opinion of your post but if I do reply I would be talking about Ben Gordon. I believe I did answer your question earlier though - which sparked this whole thing in the first place.
No worries. I was just being an ass to liven the mood a bit.

Can we get back to the topic instead of the 1v1 :emo kid: -fest, though? If you guys want to take up page upon page of bitching about who should post what and all that jazz, take it to the terrordome where it belongs.

No worries. I was just being an ass to liven the mood a bit.

Can we get back to the topic instead of the 1v1 :emo kid: -fest, though? If you guys want to take up page upon page of bitching about who should post what and all that jazz, take it to the terrordome where it belongs.

I know. Fuckers derailing topics pisses me off. Stick to the topic mofos.

Let me preface this by saying we should all remember that the team is unlikely to add any contract years given that it is now for sale.

Now that all said, what are your thoughts on Stuckey and Prince for Sessions and Jefferson. This team honestly would be extremely stronger with a lot more minutes to go around and a ball distributor at PG. I like the Sessions/Bynum combo, and Rip and Ben should see a lot more jumpers. And a real post presence. Wow.

So P's last couple of posts were pretty damn long and there's NO WAY I'm interested enough in that dude's opinion to read them both all the way through but I did catch in one of them that he started crying about me getting too personal.

How did I get personal? Making fun of how terrible your Raptor love or your over enthusiasm for soft white centers who are pulling in D'Antoni numbers is getting personal?

Fucking place is soft. Even Pharoah is a pussy these days.

Am I a pussy?

Oh yeah and FUCK YOU!

I saw an episode of Sesame Street just like this once.

Z - this thread is only 2 pages long for me - I don't know how many it is for you. Fix your profile settings, dude.

And this


So P's last couple of posts were pretty damn long and there's NO WAY I'm interested enough in that dude's opinion to read them both all the way through but I did catch in one of them that he started crying about me getting too personal.

actually made me lol for real because of this:


Some people don't actually read the posts in the thread

What I actually posted was:


I don't care - and I don't take or make shit personal

And who's soft? Your the one backing out of this. Or maybe you didn't read the bit where I told you to step the fuck up and take this to the terrordome where I will smoke you like you're a Cuban cigar.

Oh, I see now - you're ducking out the back door, saving your own life.

Good call - because if this had of continued much longer I would have grown bored and looked like a pussy for not replying to your trash talk.

So thanks, man - I really appreciate it.

LOL @ "I woulda" "I was gonna" "You just wait"

So weak. Just like Sam L these days. Old and soft and incoherent.

"I wasn't talkin' about BG. I was just talkin' about someone else talkin' about BG."

So dumb.


I will smoke you like you're a Cuban cigar.

If you want to suck my dick, you gotta ask nicer than that.

I saw an episode of Sesame Street just like this once.
Do you mean Wondershowzen? Because I feel like I saw a few of those episodes like this before.

Umm, for the record at no point did I make this sexual.

But Fool, if you like to think about guys sucking your dick then that's your business.

I'm gonna mind my own business and get the fuck outta here like I shoulda, woulda, coulda done many posts ago.

Cause just you wait, Fool's gonna be talking about more cock sucking soon

Ash (West Bloomfield, Mich.): What’s the possibility of a trade of Prince and our first-rounder to Memphis; Gay and Thabeet going to Minnesota; and Al Jefferson coming to Detroit? Memphis should definitely trade Thabeet now when it’s yet to be seen if he can shine because he won’t get his minutes as long as Gasol is there.

Langlois: I do the trade in a heartbeat if I’m Minnesota, with one caveat: They’d have to be committed to matching offers for Gay this summer, and that could be tricky. Lots of teams cleared cap space and not all of them are going to wind up with Chris Bosh, Carlos Boozer or Joe Johnson. Some team might throw big money at Gay and then Minnesota would have a huge decision to make. Not sure I do the trade if I’m Memphis or the Pistons. It would really depend on where the No. 1 pick falls. If the Pistons wind up with a top-three pick on lottery night if they fail to make the playoffs, that would have a lot more value than the No. 10 or 12 pick.

Obviously Al Jefferson is not a popular dude within the organisation...

Or Vince Russo is booking this shit and the day of the trade deadline we somehow end up with Al Jefferson, at which point Langlois would get to work on promoting Jefferson as the best young big in the league.

We get Tay and his $ out of the way and we essentially "draft" Al Jefferson.

Geez, we'd be getting robbed!

It's a work, GD.

Gotta be.

No reporter, no matter where they're from or who is really paying the bills could look at that trade from Detroit's POV and not be all over it like melting butter.

Yeah, we get rid of an injured 10 mil contract and "draft" Al with a pick in the 5-10 range (probably).

And he's not sure why we'd do that?

I'm not reading his shit anymore. It's clear he's a bigger dipshit than ROb Parker.

Some people aren't sure AJ is worth his deal. At least Tay will soon be out of his.

Well, if we aren't willing to take on that type of deal for an all star caliber big, then we'll never have a legit center unless we find one in the draft (the odds are not good there).

You have to be willing to spend 10-13 mil a year on a legit big. What team has a 20-10 caliber player for less than that (after rookie contract)?

If we're doing that deal, why not leave Minnesota out of it altogether? Tay and our 1st for Gay and Thabeet. We were talking about a deal including our 1st for Gay before.
Would you trade Prince for Thabeet?
Even if he's just a serviceable big, that's an improvement. He could turn into something solid. He could just be a decent defensive big with no offensive game. Either way, that's a deal I'd make.

Would you trade our pick for Gay?
How much better of a player are we likely going to get with that pick? Especially if it's a top 3 protected pick.

Even though Blair owned Thabeet, I'd put more chips out there for Thabeet than Gay. But I dont know, or follow, NBA trade values.

Thabeet has the scent of bust all over him, from the times I've seen him.

I know Kstat thinks he's the next Mutombo or even better, but I don't see it.

It seems like he could be developed into a defensive big. By developed I mean you tell him... "Stand in the middle. When someone comes in the middle, either hit him or swat at his shot"

I don't know though...we just played them and I hardly paid attention to him.

Ok, carry on.

Mutumbo wasn't that great. It isn't a stretch to think he could become that. Having a solid defensive C with no offense isn't all that bad though. We did win with Ben basically that way.

Chris you are on crack. Mutumbo was pretty damn good. He knew his obvious limitations and played within his game. He got tons of blocks and was a decent enough rebounder. He also had a pretty good build for someone of his size. Thabeet sucks. Bank it and look at this thread 5 years from now when he still sucks.

Someone able to start for a decade and be a real contributor off the bench for a 2nd while winning 4 DPOYs and being an all-star like 10 times is only pretty good Fro.

Only pretty good Fro.

Chris you are on crack. Mutumbo was pretty damn good. He knew his obvious limitations and played within his game. He got tons of blocks and was a decent enough rebounder. He also had a pretty good build for someone of his size. Thabeet sucks. Bank it and look at this thread 5 years from now when he still sucks.

I said Mutumbo was basically like Ben was here for a few years. What's wrong with that. But were excellent rebounders and shot blockers, but not great overall players. I didn't say Mutumbo sucked. But I would call a one dimensional player great. He was simply a great defender.

I haven't seen Thabeet in the NBA, but how can you say a guy that played pretty good defense can't be that way in the NBA? Ben wasn't a great defender in Washington or Orlando, or he would have played more. Defense is based on effort, timing and recognition. It isn't easy to have the latter two immediately.

Someone able to start for a decade and be a real contributor off the bench for a 2nd while winning 4 DPOYs and being an all-star like 10 times is only pretty good Fro.

Only pretty good Fro.

Where did I say the words pretty good?

You spin posts more than Tahoe lately.

Sorry.

Not that great Fro.

Someone able to start for a decade and be a real contributor off the bench for a 2nd while winning 4 DPOYs and being an all-star like 10 times is only pretty good Fro.

Only pretty good Fro.

BTW, he was an 8 time all star. The first few times were as the 3rd center behind Robinson and Hakeem. Then he got voted in the east a couple years because his competition was basically just PFs (Baker, Webber, Lattener). After that he backed up Zo, Anthony Mason, Antonio Davis, Smits, etc.

The guy was a great defender, let's not make him into a great player. he was good for 13 points, 12 rebounds and 3.5 blocks a game. Camby has similar numbers over the last 10 years despite being hurt a lot.

Man, two less all-star games and he's only "pretty good" while averaging a double double and over 3 blocks a game.

Let's not trade 16 of our 48 shooting guards for that guy.

Sorry.

Not that great Fro.

Would you consider AI to be a great player? He was a great scorer, won many scoring titles. How many rings does he have? Terrible defender, not a good leader, doesn't make anyone around him better.

I don't consider him a great player because he wasn't good on both ends of the floor.

Man, two less all-star games and he's only "pretty good" while averaging a double double and over 3 blocks a game.

Let's not trade 16 of our 48 shooting guards for that guy.

more misquoting. I NEVER SAID PRETTY GOOD? Are you mental or something?

And when did I say anything about trades? I didn't. I simply defended my comments that Mutumbo wasn't a great player overall. Doesn't mean you don't need guys like that on your team.

Who's quoting you? I wasn't even quoting you the first time. If you are going to get all mad about something. Get mad about something that's actually happening.

your "pretty good" text is in fucking quotation marks moron. you can't use the quote function because I didn't say it. If that isn't quoting then what is?

I'm so fucking done with this board. I'm debating leaving for a while because I'm so sick or people not being able to read. I get so mad on here lately I can't even stand it. I read 1 or 2 threads and that's it because of shit like this where people put words in your mouth.

BBF said "pretty damn good". I said no Fro only "pretty good" then you freaked out.

Yes, I was mocking you but get a grip. Maybe taking a time out is a good idea for you.

Also, you can totally use the quote function to misquote people.


No you can't.

I prefer dudes to women.

...not really sure why I added that last part...

Of course you can abuse the quote function. I've done that to be funny.

I got pissed because I said that I never typed "pretty good" and explained my assessment on him. Your very next post said "pretty good" in quotes.

Can you blame me for getting pissed at the fact that you can't read my posts and just repeat the same thing you said that I already refuted?

I like debating, but lets be frank. Putting words in people's mouth are a good way to kill healthy debate. And you've been doing that a lot to a lot of posters.

Well, it's my assumption that you got mad because of things not related to this website because if my mocking of you to make my point was all it took to get you mad you'd either never have been around this long or somehow I've never mocked you before (and let's be honest the latter isn't the case). BTW, check the posts. Your retelling of the story is incorrect.

I mean, maybe you think specifying that he went to 8 all-star games instead of what I said ("something like 10") is earth shattering to the argument and really makes your case but I don't. And so I mocked it. Especially since you only made my point stronger by giving the dudes pts, boards and block numbers.

And last I knew you were the one killing the debate over the rookie/sophomore criteria and replacing it with an old bit, not me.

I won't deny that I mock people. Especially when they are making bad arguments.

Saying Mutumbo is not a great player is a bad argument? I compared his impact to Ben and Camby (not for as long granted) and got no response. I asked for your opinion on AI and you ignored it.

I get frustrated when people gloss over facts and simply mock people. Yes, it has to do with more than this thread, but not more than this board. It has to do with the general attitude of a few posters on here that seem to relish in killing healthy debates with one liners and parsing words.

It's the kind of shit that completely derails entire threads. We just wasted 3 pages debating how I classified Mutumbo in a thread about Al Jefferson because you'd rather just mock me.

I'd say its a fact that if you have the other pieces Mutumbo was good enough to play on a championship team. He wouldn't hurt you one bit, unless you are looking for your center to be a 20-10 guy.

Thabeet seems to me to be able to fit that role with some coaching.

Saying Mutumbo is not a great player is a bad argument? I compared his impact to Ben and Camby (not for as long granted) and got no response. I asked for your opinion on AI and you ignored it.

Sorry, I was trying to calm you down before you started executing your coworkers.

Yes, I would consider the one time MVP of the entire league, 17th greatest scorer (6th in ppg) a great player.

I guess if I'd have known that only getting one NBA MVP honor and being one of the 20 greatest scorers the game has ever seen wasn't even enough to crack your "great" status we wouldn't have had two waste the last three pages on your temper tantrum.

I didn't gloss over any facts. Averaged a double double, went to 8 all-star games, was named the best defensive player in the league 4 times (the first player to ever achieve that feat), started for a decade, meaningfully contributed to teams for 2 decades.

Only Marcus Camby.

(My responses in bold)



Yes, I would consider the one time MVP of the entire league, 17th greatest scorer (6th in ppg) a great player.

I guess if I'd have known that only getting one NBA MVP honor and being one of the 20 greatest scorers the game has ever seen wasn't even enough to crack your "great" status we wouldn't have had two waste the last three pages on your temper tantrum.

Well, we just have different standards then. Tmac is a 7 time all star, 2 time scoring champ, and were it not for injuries would have better career numbers than AI (not quite in points, but certainly in other categories). He's not a great player either. Just a great individual scorer that wasn't as durable as AI. In my eyes the only for sure all time great players in the NBA that are actively playing are Shaq, Kobe, Duncan, KG. I think AI is in the debateable group with Nash, Kidd, Dirk, etc that have never lead their team anywhere. There are others that will be considered such when they put in the years.

I didn't gloss over any facts. Averaged a double double, went to 8 all-star games, was named the best defensive player in the league 4 times (the first player to ever achieve that feat), started for a decade, meaningfully contributed to teams for 2 decades.

DPOY started for the 83-83 season. You can't tell me Bill Russel wouldn't have won that at least 10 times.

As I said, he was a good player overall. Great defender. The type you need on a great team. Just not a great player overall. I wouldn't consider Pippen a great player either, but the type of guy you can win with for sure.

You guys really need to change you settings. All this Mutumbo shit only took 1 page lol

And to be fair I understand what Chris is talking about (the not reading part)

And I also don't believe Mutumbo is a great individual player. He's a fucking awesome defender, the kind of guy every contender needs and if we could get a big man like him I'd be very happy.

But let's not pretend he was Tm Duncan.

And this is my thing about teading for a big man - ain't no one giving away the super-duper quality big men.

Amare and Jefferson have issues but I believe you build from the inside out. Joe obviously believes differently (otherwise he wouldn't signed a big man with $16+ million in cap space) BUT...

We have the perimeter guys now. Any tade that does not include BG and Nova that nets us a "quality" big (like Amare/Jefferson) is a must do.

Guys like Daye and Stuckey are a dime a dozen IMO and are not important in the gran scheme of things. IF they have to be sent then they get fucking sent. Obviously I'd rather send them with Rip so we still have Tay's contract as an asset but you can't have everything in life.

Why are CV31 and BG untouchable?

Why are CV31 and BG untouchable?

Yeah, I would trade anyone on this roster for a legit all start big. Certainly there are varying levels of that (Bosh vs Kaman vs Jefferson, etc). But I'd part with anyone on the roster for that big. You can always find a replacement at those other positions. PG is hard, but we already don't have a true PG anyway. If we need to move CV, so be it. It's not like Boozer, Lee, Amare and a host of other PFs won't be out there. Don't know if we'd have cap space or not (really depends on the deal), but you could even find a MLE PF to play next to the big. If we kept our pick after such deal we'd have a great chance to fill any hole anyway.

Certainly you don't want to send the message that we're in the business of signing FA's and then trading them immediately, but if you have a valid reason I don't think it looks bad. If the Cavs offer Lebron for CV and BG, you don't tell the Cavs "not thanks, we don't want to risk scaring off other FA's". You make the deal that makes you better. They'll understand when the team sucks this year, they've been hurt and haven't held up their end of the deal yet, and you are getting a great player back. If you move them in a salary dump, I can see future ramifications.

Why are CV31 and BG untouchable?

They're not untouchable, I just can't think of any deal where they'd be included.

Teams looking to trade quality players are generally trying to get youth, expiring contracts and/or picks.

A long-term contract (BG. Nova, Maxiell, Rip) is not the most desireable thing for a team looking to rebuild.

CV and BG are fairly young though. I would think teams would want them before wanting RIP.

CV and BG are fairly young though. I would think teams would want them before wanting RIP.

But who are you dealing them too?

A title contender like Boston might prefer Rip. Been there and done that, fits their system, not selfish, would fit into their locker room, shorter contract that ends closer to when their window will.

It's on a case by case basis, I agree. I just don't think BG at his price is attractive to many teams and CV might be attractive in a deal but he's gotta be included with something else of value, like a young dude, draft pick or Tay.

Fuck that!

Amare or Jefferson are not worth Prince, CV and a young player. We'd have to be getting something else of value in return if that was our package