Anybody want to post a (realistic) potential depth chart?


Under contract
Rip
Tay
Kwame (his option)
Amir
Dice (according to Storytellers (http://www.storytellerscontracts.info/resources/08-09salaries.htm))
Max
Stuckey
Afflalo
Bynum (team option)
zzzzzz

There was some discussion here recently about what to pay Dice next year, but if this info is correct, then he's not a free agent.

From my standpoint, it looks like we need a starting center, a backup 3, and at least one 3 point shooter. Adding a solid vet PG would also allow Stuckey to play the 2 when Rip is out, if need be.

Stuckey/Bynum/?
Rip/Afflalo
Tay/?
Dice/Max/Amir
?/Kwame

NBDL: Sharpe

I wonder what it would cost to bring back Herrmann?

C: Amir/Kwame
F: Dice/Maxiell
F: Prince/Sharpe (is a SF or PF? Seen that debate on here...)
G: Rip/Double A
G: Stuckey/Bynum

I'd say we need:

A couple of big men to combine with Amir, Dice and Maxiell

A back-up for Prince (really? What a surprise)

A veteran PG to mentor Stuckey/Bynum (unless you have someone on the coaching staff who handles this)

Solutions:

I'd use whatever 2nd round picks I had to move up and take a quality big man on Draft Day.

I'd sign a back-up for Prince in free agency for less than $4 million (and there should be plenty of cheap SF's that may/may not pan out). No point spending big money on Prince's back-up - he hasn't had one for years so if it wasn't important back then why is it important now?

Then I'd go after the bigs. There is Boozer, Marvin Williams, Lee, Millsap and I'm sure a fe wothers that could be wined and dined.

I'd have $14 million to get 2 capable bigs. That's do-able.

Amir starting at center, eh?

Would you prefer Kwame?

I didn't start Mr. Question Mark.

He's not on my depth chart cause I have't signed him yet

I used to share the dream that Amir would someday be a legit center, but I think he would get totally abused.

Imagine the glory if Kwame actually opted out. $4m more in cap space, just like that.

Not gonna happen, though.

I don't mind if Kwame doens't opt out - I'd put him on the block all next season and try to get something decent for his useless ass.

Amir as a legit starting C? When he was drafted I thought he'd eventually be a combo forward. Obviously I was wrong because the entire Pistons organisation decided early on he could not play SF.

They know what they're doing

or so they tell me

A question for you cap gurus:

Do you think it will be possible to sign both David Lee and Boozer this offseason? That's obviously best case scenario, but that would make sucking this season worth it and make the Pistons a legit contender again.

amir is garbage and so is kwame, amir because of his IQ and kwame cause of his hands.

Since when has Marvin Williams been a big? Josh Smith is playing PF for them (or so I thought) and Marvin was a SF.

A question for you cap gurus:

Do you think it will be possible to sign both David Lee and Boozer this offseason? That's obviously best case scenario, but that would make sucking this season worth it and make the Pistons a legit contender again.

I don't see why we would want to spend all of our cap space on two PFs.

A question for you cap gurus:

Do you think it will be possible to sign both David Lee and Boozer this offseason? That's obviously best case scenario, but that would make sucking this season worth it and make the Pistons a legit contender again.

Well, we have about 36 mil in salaries without draft picks. Throw in another few million there and you're at 39 mil. The current cap is 59 mil, so that would leave 20 mil to sign all FA's.

Lets suppose they both split that and you are capped out, this is your depth chart without any picks:

PG Stuckey/Bynum
SG RIP/AA
SF Tay/Sharpe
PF Boozer/Max
C Lee/Amir/Kwame

That's all salaried players. Your second rounders aren't likely to make the team. I agree with P in that I would trade all of them to move up and get the best player possible. In this case it would be a G or F of some sort to be the 6th man scorer. I would then move Kwame for a backup G or F that you don't get in the draft. He's an expiring, so you could probably get a decent bench scorer for him with a longer contract (from a team wanting to hit the 2010 FA crop with an extra 4-5 mil in space).

I would also try and convince Dyess to stay (he probably would to backup Lee/Boozer knowing we have a chance at a title run). His money would count against that 20 mil though, so it would be tricky. It would probably have to be Boozer 10 mil, Lee 8 mil, Dyess 2 mil.

I feel the same way whenever that comes up. Neither of them are centers. We'd still need a center and one of them would be coming off the bench, or we would be very undersized up front.

I don't see why we would want to spend all of our cap space on two PFs.

You'd have to be convinced Lee can hold his own against centers.

I feel the same way whenever that comes up. Neither of them are centers. We'd still need a center and one of them would be coming off the bench, or we would be very undersized up front.

I'd prefer to sign Lee and attempt to trade Max or Amir to the Clippers for Kamen (we'd have the space to take on additional salary). They'd save 6-7 mil off next year and not have problems finding PT for Kamen, Camby and Jordan.

I would actually be pretty happy with that scenario. I've always been a Kamen fan since he was in college.

I'm not sure the savings are enough to merit a Kamen/Max or Amir swap or not. Certainly we have 2nd rounders that could be included.

If not Kamen, I think that is what Joe is going to try and do with the space. Maybe sign a FA he likes, but more so to trade for guys he likes on teams that need to clear space.

I would like to sign Boozer, and then trade whatever we can outside of Rip/Tay/Stuck to nab either Tyson Chandler or Chris Kamen. There's Millsap too if we can't nab Boozer.

Joe's really in the driver seat this summer. Hopefully he aims for some old ladies. So to speak.

Kaman is a possibility, especially since he's one of the few centers in the league that might actually be available.

Gotta move either Amir or Max if you sign Boozer or Lee, especially if Dice is retained.

The other option is to get Lee or Boozer and simply wait on Bosh to fill that other spot.

In that case I would prefer to trade Amir for Camby or another true center that expires in 2010.

You know there is a chance iverson thrives in his role off the bench and we go on to win the nba championship. We then resign AI and sheed and the team remains the same. I really think this team still has a shot at winning it all and shocking the world!!!!!!

Who's with me?????

I just got sick...

I just got drunk...

You know there is a chance iverson thrives in his role off the bench and we go on to win the nba championship. We then resign AI and sheed and the team remains the same. I really think this team still has a shot at winning it all and shocking the world!!!!!!

Who's with me?????

I'd love to see the championship part happen, followed by letting AI walk anyway, signing Sheed for the minimum as a 6th man-type, nabbing Boozer, resigning Dice, trading Amir/Max/whoever else for Camby, and then swining for the fences for a Bosh trade next season. Hey, we're dreaming big, right?

What would it likely take to get Kaman?

Would they only require Amir? Or would 1st round picks have to be included?

And I know they have Camby but how the hell did Kaman fall into the "available" spot - he's a true C and he doesn't suck, so what gives?

I feel the same way whenever that comes up. Neither of them are centers. We'd still need a center and one of them would be coming off the bench, or we would be very undersized up front.

I think people often over estimate the need for a center. A center is only important if you have a skinny PF that can't hold his own on the defensive end. I would think Boozer and Lee could do that. There's really only two players in the league that they would have trouble with: Shaq and Howard, and those two will give anyone trouble.

On the offensive side the title of your position doesn't matter. You need a low post player and a high post player. We all know Boozer is good enough on the block and Lee is that hustle player that we've lacked since Ben left. He won't be a game changer on defense, but he will be the guy that gives the Pistons 5 to 6 extra possessions a game with his hustle.

If the Pistons could secure those two I would call it a successful offseason. My faith would be restored.

I talked with Rob Otto yesterday, he is positive Joe will go after Boozer if it makes economic sense for Boozer to opt out.

What would it likely take to get Kaman?

Would they only require Amir? Or would 1st round picks have to be included?

And I know they have Camby but how the hell did Kaman fall into the "available" spot - he's a true C and he doesn't suck, so what gives?

I don't know what it would take. I'd like to know. Would they take Amir? Amir and AA? with a second rounder? I don't know. I'd like to keep our first if possible because we need to add a young bench scorer too. I'd give next year's first though.

But do you want to pay 10mil a year for a hustle guy? That's my biggest issue.

Well, if we renounce all our free agents the word is we'll have 20 million.

Factor in the cap hold for a mid-first (2 mil)

That leaves 18 mil to sign Boozer and Lee.

It seems we're unclear on Dice's contract situation so if he's a free agent and is wanted back/wants to come back then we've got less than 18 million.

There is no way we should pay more than 7 mil for Lee. If that's the starting salary would the Knicks match it? I would assume they would.

Maybe we'd be better off trying for Kaman via trade and signing Boozer?

Dice signed for one year at the vets min. The contract they were showing that had him on the books for next year looked like it was still his old contract that was terminated.

I agree that I'd give Lee 7mil and nothing more. I also like the idea of trying to pluck Kaman away from them. If we could do that I'd be very happy.

Lee/Boozer would be a good scoring/rebounding frontline, but awful defensivly and undersized

I wouldn't want it if thats the case.

WE WON A CHAMPIONSHIP WITH ONE OF OUR BEST DEFENSIVE YEARS EVER.

Signing players that can play D should be a focus...along with a Coach that makes Defense #1 priority.

A coach that has any sort of plan whatsoever would be nice.

A coach that has any sort of plan whatsoever would be nice.

those are at the top of the endangered species list

Wasn't Avery Johnson a defensive-minded coach with a plan?

My friend from Dallas constantly complained about Avery Johnson the same way we complain about Curry....basically, that he was in way over his head....

Wasn't Avery Johnson a defensive-minded coach with a plan?


http://img.moronail.net/img/2/9/429.jpg

I don't know what a cockatoo sounds like, but I think it prolly sounds a lot like him.

That's why I was asking. I was unsure.

Steven (West Bloomfield, Mich.): If we are going to have a serious chance at contending next year with a payroll at or around the cap, I think we have to take advantage of the nearly $8 million we have tied up in Kwame and Amir’s salaries by trading them for more versatile players from teams looking to shed payroll. It’s one thing to have a couple of $4 million role players when we’re operating at $72 million but another when we’re working with $58 million. Also, if we don’t relinquish our rights to McDyess, we can go over the cap to sign him, right?

Langlois: On McDyess: no. The Pistons will not have Bird rights to McDyess. They will have to fit him under the cap. If the Pistons decide they need to move Brown or Johnson, their contracts – even in a summer of uncertainty due to the economic situation – should be movable. They both have one year left for well below the mid-level exception. It’s possible the Pistons could trade them in deals where they take back more salary once they get under the cap by renouncing their own Bird rights free agents, Allen Iverson and Rasheed Wallace.

One more from Master Keith.


Colleen (Ann Arbor, Mich.): Will the Pistons be shopping for a legit 3-point shooter this summer?

Langlois: There’s no question the lack of 3-point shooting has hurt the Pistons this year, Colleen. As I’ve stated consistently, I believe Joe D’s priority in free agency will be to address his frontcourt. If he does that and has enough money left over to add a nice perimeter player, I’m sure that 3-point range will be one of the major criterion involved in the search. Ben Gordon appears to be the most deadly 3-point shooter among the top perimeter free agents. Would the Pistons have enough cap space to sign two top free agents? Hard to say. Much depends on what the salary cap figure eventually is set at – it’s now widely believed that it will actually be reduced, for only the second time in the cap’s 25-year history – and also at what the market bears in a summer of great economic uncertainty.

this is the 2nd times Langlois mentions Gordon, or was it ASB? dunno but Gordons name was out there before, which is just crazy, this guy turned down 10 mil a year from Chicago, we've better use the capspace for frontcourt guys than another guard, we're fine with RIP,Stuck+AA, better get a CHEAP backup PG who can shoot the 3, not a guy like Gordon!

I definitely don't see Gordon coming here, especially for the money he would want. I have faith that Joe can see that...

18 mil capspace, i'd take on Haywood 1y/6 mil(for 2nd round pick) + Boozer 5y/60 mil, this would put us also in a good situation for 2010
Boozer 12 mil
RIP 11
Tay 11
Max 5
Stuckey 2,7
AA 1,9
= 43,6
Haywood, Amir, Kwame expiring contracts

Why would they trade us Haywood for a 2nd round pick? I feel like they'd be looking to dump other guys long before him.

Why would they trade us Haywood for a 2nd round pick? I feel like they'd be looking to dump other guys long before him.

They don't have that many higher salaried guys with talent, and it's not easy to dump guys with little talent.

Plus, they got JaVale McGee to fill Haywood's void (like he's doing this year).

I wonder if they'd give us Blatche. Somewhere inside that guy is a super star waiting to blossom.

Plus, they got JaVale McGee to fill Haywood's void (like he's doing this year).

I wonder if they'd give us Blatche. Somewhere inside that guy is a super star waiting to blossom.

Amir's more talented twin bro?

Why would they trade us Haywood for a 2nd round pick?
Agreed, he's not much worth that.

Haywood has looked good so far in his 3 games back from injury.

18 & 12 last night.

I thought Bynum had guaranteed his spot for next season already, but if there were any doubts I think they've been put to rest.

Given his performance and AA's presence on the roster does anyone see Joe actually spending a decent chunk of our cap space on a guard? I don't. He might sign a veteran to mentor Stuckey and Bynum at PG, but nothing too expensive.

The frontcourt needs all the help it can get and I don't see Boozer fixing the problem on his own so Joe has his work cut out for him.

We need a C and a SF. Tay needs a real backup that we can rely on to save on his legs. We need a real center to step in and start for us. We've got Max, Amir, and Dice at PF for next year (we'll resign Dice) but no one that can play center for us. I don't want to force McDyess into that role because he's so much more effective as the PF next to someone that can go down low and bang bodies.

How about Tay/Amir & picks for Bosh and then Rip for Josh Smith?

That doesn't even use any of the cap room.

Find a team in financial trouble (like the Pacers, Bobcats, etc) and pillage them for a PG (Felton? Jack?)

Bibby is a free agent this summer, too.

Bibby
Stuckey
Josh Smith
Dice
Bosh

Ahh, dreams are fun.

Why would they trade us Josh Smith for Rip? They already have JJ at SG.

Correct.

IT WAS A DREAM

Also, I didn't think it through very much.

My 2 cents are ...

I like scoring from the 2, 3 and either 4 or 5. I think 3 very good offensive players can get it done if the other 2 play D.

The PG has lots to do. Let him do that shit and let the others score. Obviously if a team is playing off of the PG he has to have the ability to score. Bynum, as an example, can. Prolly doesn't have that outside range yet though.

So we have Rip and Tay for scorers. If we keep KB in the starting lineup, then I'd want a scoring PF. If we get a Billy Lambs type that can score, then go with a bruiser at PF.

Sheed moving outside continuously just fucks everything up, imo. I don't know where he fits in.

I don't know if Keith is speculating or if there is really something to this, but it's the first that I've seen anything about this.


Sharon (Southfield, Mich.): Do you think Rasheed will be willing to take a pay cut and come off the bench for the Pistons next season?

Langlois: There’s no question he’s going to take a big pay cut. He knows that. There are pretty strong indications on both sides that Rasheed and the Pistons want to work it out so he comes back here. I don’t know that he’ll have to come off the bench. It will probably be either him or McDyess – one starting, one coming off the bench.

I could see it happening because Joe will likely just fleece someone for a big rather than break the bank on Lee or Boozer. Since he'll be moving one or more expiring bigs in that deal Sheed would make sense. he could move Sheed, Brown or Amir (all expirings) to save a team money.

Sheed's return would likely depend on what else we can do this off-season and the make up of the team next season.

Akiva (New Rochelle, N.Y.): I thought this whole trade was to clear cap space for the free agents of 2010 such as Wade, LeBron, Bosh, et al. If the Pistons get Boozer this summer, will they still have cap space in 2010?

Langlois: Joe Dumars never gave anyone reason to believe he was going to horde his assets to be a player in 2010. In fact, he said the opposite – that as long as the NBA planned to have a season next year, he planned to field the best team possible. I do not anticipate the Pistons having cap space in 2010.

Raz (Troy, Mich.): You indicated many times that the Pistons need big men this off-season. Does this mean Amir Johnson doesn’t have a future with the Pistons, because this would just create more of a logjam in the frontcourt?

Langlois: It means that the Pistons’ two best big men remain Rasheed Wallace and Antonio McDyess, both of whom will be 35 when next season starts – assuming the Pistons can re-sign both of them this summer. Without solid indications from Amir that he’s ready to be more than a No. 4 or No. 5 big man, it’s only logical to assume that the cap space Joe Dumars created will be exercised in the pursuit of a long-term solution up front. That doesn’t mean Amir still won’t have a role. If he spurts this summer and proves worthy of another shot as the starter, so much the better. Joe D knows that in the near future, he’ll need permanent replacements for both Wallace and McDyess and he’s not going to fill both spots this summer, in all likelihood. If Amir Johnson (and Jason Maxiell) prove capable of being top-three rotation big men, then the Pistons have their best and most cost-effective solution.


John (Bloomfield Hills, Mich.): After the season, do you think Joe D will stick to his guns and not “blow up” the team and just add pieces to complement what are some quality assets? Your interviews have indicated that he rightfully has been resistant to blowing up the team.

Langlois: He’s in a position where he can take a third rail, John – add something more than just a “complementary” piece without sacrificing a core component, thanks to the cap space the Billups-Iverson trade provided. Usually, in order to add an All-Star-caliber component, you either have to have a roster almost devoid of star-quality players or have to sacrifice one of them in trade. Now, Joe D might well make other moves that involve his more familiar names, but he can keep them and add a very significant player or two. So he doesn’t have to “blow up” the team in order for it to come back next fall looking much, much different.


Ryan (Grand Rapids, Mich.): Any chance with the salary space and some nifty sign-and-trades Detroit can get Marvin Williams, Tyson Chandler and still have enough money to re-sign Wallace and McDyess?

Langlois: Depends who you’re talking about trading back to Atlanta. Marvin Williams is a restricted free agent, so I assume that’s the sign-and-trade part of the equation you’re citing. Any trade for Chandler, in my view, would center on the Pistons trading Kwame Brown and his $4.1 million 2010 salary to the Hornets for Chandler and the $25 million he has coming over the next two seasons. So the Pistons would be committing about $8 million of next year’s cap space to Chandler, essentially, when you figure the difference between Chandler and Brown’s salaries. Wallace and McDyess, combined, will probably come in somewhere around $12 million. So the sign-and-trade for Williams would essentially have to send away the same amount of salary to Atlanta as the Pistons would offer Williams in the first season, otherwise the Pistons wouldn’t have enough money to get all of that accomplished.


Nawaf (Riyadh, Saudi Arabia): Is there any chance of getting both Tyson Chandler and Carlos Boozer?

Langlois: I think that’s a real long shot, Nawaf. One or the other and then at least one (or both) of Rasheed Wallace and Antonio McDyess on short-term deals, Wallace maybe for two years and McDyess maybe for one since McDyess has said he wants to play one more year.

Now we know Langlois reads WTF:


Any trade for Chandler, in my view, would center on the Pistons trading Kwame Brown and his $4.1 million 2010 salary to the Hornets for Chandler and the $25 million he has coming over the next two seasons.

I do have a big prblem with this:


Wallace and McDyess, combined, will probably come in somewhere around $12 million.

WTF? $6 million each? No fucking way.

On to the debate - Chandler v Boozer...

Isn't Boozer 30? Isn't Chandler 27?

Both injury prone players.

But one is under contract for 2 years while the other would be signing a bright, sparkling brand new 5 year contract...

If they both proved to be "fit" I know who I'd pick

I don't want any part of Chandler, especially since he failed his physical.

I don't want any part of Chandler, especially since he failed his physical.

You thinking that it's a career ending toe injury?

To be fair, he has had a good number of legit injuries.

Not a Chandler fan at any level.

I'm OK with Chandler but would prefer to pursue Okefor or Kamen. Both are solid defenders but have some offense to their game.

If Curry is still the coach it won't matter who we bring in. We'll still suck!

If Curry is still the coach it won't matter who we bring in. We'll still suck!
:cogent:
Okefor is the only person we've mentioned that doesn't have an injury history. I'd prefer we got a new HC and brought in a big-man coach like many other teams have to help him work on his offensive game. His defense is already solid, if he could develop some offense, he'd be a great pickup.

I think Okafor does have an injury history. Didn't he have severe back problems coming out of college?

He hasn't missed big time since getting to the NBA, has he?

I think Okafor does have an injury history. Didn't he have severe back problems coming out of college?

HE NEVER HAD ARNIE KANDER!

ARNIE DOES THE VOODOO

USED TAMPONS AND TWIGS CURE EVERYTHING

Even Arnie can't cure attitude -- just ask Delfino and Iverson.