go get Amare...

If Kerr wants to win a title, he's going to need to commit to the defensive side of the ball, and Sheed is perfect for what they need...

Suns Get: Rasheed Wallace, Arron Afflalo

Pistons Get: Amare Stoudemire, Alando Tucker

I couldn't tell you if that works or not, I imagine it's close (I'm not sure what Amare makes), but something like that would increase the window of a title for both teams IMO...

Although, Kerr wouldn't dump Amare for KG, I doubt he'd do it for Sheed, unless he realizes he needs defense to win a Title...

There is a lot that can be had on Phoenix's roster, obviously besides Shaq & Nash...

Barbosa, Raja, Diaw are a couple possibilites, even though Diaw sucks ass now

The first call Joe should make is to the phoenix suns and see if they would take Sheed + tay + 1st round + future 1st round for AMARE then stones win it all next year think about this lineup

Chauncy
stucky 6ft 5
Rip 6ft 7 def can hang with most sf in the league and they would have a helluva time guarding him
Maxiell
AMARE

I'd rather see Billups and Sheed go for Amare (Billups would have to go somewhere else in a 3 way deal).

I would also rather see billups go but phoenix does not need him

I would rather as well trade chauncy in that deal but phoenix has no need

^LOL. That's why I said a 3 way deal. The Suns could use a better wing though. What about sending Billups to the Clippers and Maggs to the Suns?

Sheed (13.68 mil) to Suns
Billups (11.05 mil) to Clipps
Afflalo (1.01 mil) to Clipps

Maggs (8.4) to Suns
Knight (2.0) to Pistons

Amare (15.07) to Pistons
Bell (6.0) to Pistons

Clippers send #7 to Suns, the Suns send #15 to Clippers.

Pistons
PG Stuckey/Knight
SG RIP/Bell
SF Tay/Bell
PF Dyess/Max
C Amare/Amir

Suns
PG Nash/Barbosa
SG Maggs/Barbosa
SF Hill/Maggs
PF Sheed/Diaw
C Shaq/Sheed

Clippers
PG Billups/Livingston/Smush
SG Mobely/AA
SF Thorton/TT
PF Brand/TT
C Kamen/Fazekus

We can draft a backup to Tay or a PG. I'd probably bring back Dixon as my third PG and draft a scoring wing to replace Bell soon. Then grab a backup PG next year when Knight is gone.

Heres how it gonna go down joed is gonna call kerr up and sell him tay and sheed for barbosa and amare then when he is done hell call over to DC and trade chauncy for jamison then the lineup would be

Stuck / Barbosa
RIP / AA
Jamison / Jarvis / AMIR
Maxiell / MCDYESS / AMIR
AMARE / SAMB

Heres how it gonna go down joed is gonna call kerr up and sell him tay and sheed for barbosa and amare then when he is done hell call over to DC and trade chauncy for jamison then the lineup would be

Stuck / Barbosa
RIP / AA
Jamison / Jarvis / AMIR
Maxiell / MCDYESS / AMIR
AMARE / SAMB

That's a fun fantasy bball lineup, but where is the D?

That's a fun fantasy bball lineup, but where is the D?

and passing. 4 guys who want the ball in their hands and some putback dunks.

and shooting..barbosa and hayes will just wanna chuck 3's.

and our backup center has like 22 minutes of experience.

might have to say no to that one.

So no comments on my version?

I couldn't even pretend to be as good as you guys in all of this but, why would Kerr ever want to trade Amare for Sheed? What does Sheed offer over Amare at this point in their careers? And with Sheed, Shaq and Hill as their frontline? I'd crack some Medicare joke, but it wouldn't be funny and totally ironic since I'm 36.

Very ironic.

Right, Mo?

I couldn't even pretend to be as good as you guys in all of this but, why would Kerr ever want to trade Amare for Sheed? What does Sheed offer over Amare at this point in their careers? And with Sheed, Shaq and Hill as their frontline? I'd crack some Medicare joke, but it wouldn't be funny and totally ironic since I'm 36.

He wouldn't trade Amare for Sheed. That's why I modified it. In mine he is trading Amare and Bell for Sheed, Maggs and moving up in the draft 8 spots. At #8 they could add one of the best big men in the draft to replace Shaq/Sheed eventually. Also keep in mind they traded for Shaq to win the title. They fell way short, so how are they going to improve this year? Trade away Shaq? Nope. With Sheed they would have a big man to compliment Shaq on the offensive end (clearing the paint out for him). Sheed also allows Shaq to play more help defense and less man defense on good scoring big men. Maggs gives them a better weapon when Barbosa is not out there.

Shaq was supposed to compliment Amare. I don't think many are under the illusion that Shaq can be the center of your team. He showed he's done with that role in MIA.

Bill Simmons seems to think a Sheed/Amare trade would be great for both sides, a couple other The Sports Guy suggested was Billups/Arenas and Sheed/Camby...

Shaq was supposed to compliment Amare. I don't think many are under the illusion that Shaq can be the center of your team. He showed he's done with that role in MIA.


Nash and Shaq don't have much left in the tank, if PHX is going to win a title, they're going to have to do it in the next two seasons, after that, if they still don't have a ring, Kerr, Shaq, Nash will all be gone and PHX will fade back into oblivion

Shaq was supposed to compliment Amare. I don't think many are under the illusion that Shaq can be the center of your team. He showed he's done with that role in MIA.

That was a foolish line of thought that some experts had. Shaq was supposed to move Amare back to PF and allow Amare to attack against smaller players. I don't think their skill sets mesh though. Both need to operate in the paint to succeed. Most teams with a good post scorer like to have a good jump shooting big next to them. Boozer and Okur are a solid combo because their styles are different. TD and D Rob worked well because they could hit jump shots and play in the paint. KG and Perkins work well together because Perkins is a banger and KG a jump shooter.

KG and Perkins work well together because Perkins is a banger and KG a jump shooter.


spot on, I love Dyess to death, but ever since his injuries, he's almost completely a finesse player, most of his shots come on mid-range's and if we had somebody to compliment him inside, it would be a beautiful watch

Sheed & Max for Amare?

Opens up PT for Amir, too.

spot on, I love Dyess to death, but ever since his injuries, he's almost completely a finesse player, most of his shots come on mid-range's and if we had somebody to compliment him inside, it would be a beautiful watch

Completely finesse offensive player. Dude hussles out rebounds and stands his group defensively in the post.

Sheed & Max for Amare?

Opens up PT for Amir, too.

i don't think the Suns would do it unless they get a scoring wing (which is why I did the 3 way with the Clippers). You may be able to do a 3 way with the Bucks as well (Redd is being shopped).

Langlois: There were rumblings before Phoenix traded Shawn Marion for Shaquille O’Neal that the Suns were preparing to come to Dumars with a Stoudemire-for-Wallace deal. I was skeptical at the time, but when I saw them do the risky O’Neal deal, I believe they would have made that trade. Steve Kerr was convinced the Suns were too weak defensively in the middle. I wonder if he would have rather had Wallace than O’Neal.

Amare for Sheed is the most logical deal in the world. Both teams increase their window for a championship.

What about Sheed/RIP/#29 for Amare/Barbosa/#15?

Joe gets his versitle backcourt with a Billups/Barbosa/Stuckey 3 headed monster.

What about Sheed/RIP/#29 for Amare/Barbosa/#15?

Joe gets his versitle backcourt with a Billups/Barbosa/Stuckey 3 headed monster.


If you thought Chauncey's defense is degrading, just wait until you see the defense (or lack their of) Barbosa is going to give you...

I love Leandro's speed and his scoring ability, but he's not worth losing Rip for, I would give them Chauncey instead, and keep Rip & Stuckey...


C- Amare/#15 pick/Samb
PF- Dyess/Maxiell/Amir
SF- Prince/MLE
SG- Hamilton/Afflalo
PG- Stuckey/Barbosa

I figured the Suns wouldn't be interested in a Nash/Billups backcourt. Maybe they are, I don't know.

^LOL. That's why I said a 3 way deal. The Suns could use a better wing though. What about sending Billups to the Clippers and Maggs to the Suns?

Sheed (13.68 mil) to Suns
Billups (11.05 mil) to Clipps
Afflalo (1.01 mil) to Clipps

Maggs (8.4) to Suns
Knight (2.0) to Pistons

Amare (15.07) to Pistons
Bell (6.0) to Pistons

Clippers send #7 to Suns, the Suns send #15 to Clippers.

Pistons
PG Stuckey/Knight
SG RIP/Bell
SF Tay/Bell
PF Dyess/Max
C Amare/Amir

Suns
PG Nash/Barbosa
SG Maggs/Barbosa
SF Hill/Maggs
PF Sheed/Diaw
C Shaq/Sheed

Clippers
PG Billups/Livingston/Smush
SG Mobely/AA
SF Thorton/TT
PF Brand/TT
C Kamen/Fazekus

We can draft a backup to Tay or a PG. I'd probably bring back Dixon as my third PG and draft a scoring wing to replace Bell soon. Then grab a backup PG next year when Knight is gone.


I almost hate to admit it... but I do like that trade... assuming it all fits. but why ya gotta do Chauncey like that? We can't just use and abuse like that by sending him to the NBA Pergatory. NOW... if we pulled Brand out of there... then fine send anyone in there... but Billups? He's been too good to us to send him to a non-playoff team like that. LOL!

So Sheed and Billups for Amare and Barbosa is good... but not great.
Billups and Nash is not a good combo at all. I don't think we need Barbosa and he doesn't fit with our style of play.

But...This IMO... is AMAZING!
Sheed and Rip for Amare and Diaw (and I checked it out on the trade machine and it worked)

PHO+
this definitely fits their win now priority
they get some soon to expire contracts if it doesn't work
they get more defensive minded while not losing on the offensive side
Nash and Rip much better combo than Nash/Billups
Rip fits PHO style of play better
Sheed's 3's can still spread out the floor for their offense

DET+
Amare is a huge upgrade for us
He still could work in a halfcourt style of play
We get younger with both of those players
Stuckey gets more playing time
We'd be heavy at the PF spot but that would allow us to trade
anyone at that position.

now you have to admit that looks pretty good.

Could Diaw be a backup SF? I know he played a very athletic version of PF for them and when he came into the league with the Hawks he was playing SG. Would he be able to be a 3-4 for us and backup Tay along with Afflalo depending on matchups?

Diaw is best as a backup F (both positions) like Walton is. Solid passer and all around player. However, you still need a 6th man that can score to complement him. our first rounder would have to bring us a good wing scorer, or we'd have to get a solid on with the MLE. Hopefully we'd draft a SG to replace RIP, keep Stuckey as a combo guard and sign Posey as well. I'd probably start Posey in RIP's spot and keep Stuckey as instant offense off the bench.

Could Diaw be a backup SF? I know he played a very athletic version of PF for them and when he came into the league with the Hawks he was playing SG. Would he be able to be a 3-4 for us and backup Tay along with Afflalo depending on matchups?

i think diaw can play 2-5, which makes him versatile as fuck, and i like that. he can guard many positions and would be expendable on the court.

id do the proposed trade above but who i am i say

As long as he can backup the 3 I'm down with this trade. Amare takes over the C spot for us, giving us the inside presence we need. Diaw takes over the backup SF spot, which we've needed to solidify for a few years now. Then we just take a look to see who we'd draft. Maybe they'd swap us draft spots, since we're giving them 2 all-stars and all. I'm not sure they'd do that, but they're always looking to sell off draft picks anyway, why not slide down some.

i think diaw can play 2-5, which makes him versatile as fuck, and i like that. he can guard many positions and would be expendable on the court.

id do the proposed trade above but who i am i say


I may be wrong, but I could almost swear he broke into the league as a PG with Atlanta...

talk about versatility...too bad his game disappeared after he got paid

talk about versatility...too bad his game disappeared after he got fat

can't blame Boris for putting some meat on his bones...it worked for Miguel Cabrera...

I may be wrong, but I could almost swear he broke into the league as a PG with Atlanta...

talk about versatility...too bad his game disappeared after he got paid

he did

could play 1-5

phx is rumored to be trading diaw and barbosa for a lotto pick

tell me D'Antoni isn't begging Walsh to get something done...

Theres a football saying about a team that has 2 quarterbacks is a team without 1 quarterback.

That sort of works with Diaw. The guy has 5 positions because he doesn't really have any position.

Which makes him great off the bench but terrible as a starter.

Theres a football saying about a team that has 2 quarterbacks is a team without 1 quarterback.

That sort of works with Diaw. The guy has 5 positions because he doesn't really have any position.

I don't see how that applies to basketball. That saying is true because you need your QB to be the leader of your offense. The leader in basketball can be from any position.

There is nothing wrong with a utility player as long as you are not counting on him to start.

There is nothing wrong with a utility player as long as you are not paying him $9m a year for the next FOUR YEARS.

Very true. Those types of players should be making MLE money at most. 9 mil a year should be spent on a 30-35 MPG player.

I'd still do my RIP/Sheed/#29 for Amare/Barbosa/#15 trade though.

I'd probably do that trade. I'd try to see if we could sub 2 seconds for our first though. Then we can grab someone at 15 and still take a flier on someone like Walker with the later pick. I'm starting to really like the idea of taking him and seeing what Arnie can do for his knee.

I moved Wil's new rumor to the "legit" Pistons rumor thread so people that don't like to read the pretend shit don't miss it.

http://wtfdetroit.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13947

I don't see how that applies to basketball. That saying is true because you need your QB to be the leader of your offense. The leader in basketball can be from any position.

There is nothing wrong with a utility player as long as you are not counting on him to start.

The saying isn't about leadership, it's about ability. He has 5 positions because he doesn't excel at any one of them. Essentially he has no position. He's just a guy, with some talent, making too much money.

The saying isn't about leadership, it's about ability. He has 5 positions because he doesn't excel at any one of them. Essentially he has no position. He's just a guy, with some talent, making too much money.

That doesn't mean he's a bad player. Everyone wants guys like that, just not for 9 mil a year or whatever he makes. I blame the Suns for paying him that, not Diaw for taking it.

Juwan Howard was a nice player until someone was dumb enough to give him 20 mil.

More teams need to do what Joe did and let your star walk if he's going to get too much (Big Ben).

I don't believe I said he was a bad player. I said the saying fits him.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AvzZpcHCSQr10KHgGQRTh528vLYF?slug=aw-stoudemiresuns020509&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

quote:
If Kerr and assistant GM David Griffin do trade Stoudemire, a four-time All-Star, they want a combination of expiring contracts, a talented young player – preferably a forward – and draft picks


Amare for Sheed, Amir + 1st round pick

I'm not sure that is enough unless he's pretty high on Amir.

I would think they'd also want to move Shaq if possible so they could have cap space next year to sign Boozer. maybe throw AI and Shaq in there and they'd do it.

They'd have Nash, Barnes, JRich, Boozer and Amir starting with Barbosa as 6th man, plus a couple picks in the mix.

We'd still have the space to sign Bosh BTW with Shaq's deal off the books.

Stuckey/RIP/Tay/Amare/Bosh would be ridiculous.

Stuckey/RIP/Tay/Amare/Bosh would be ridiculous.

Yeah, that would be secks.

Sheed, 2 of our 2009 picks plus Affalo and Maxiell for Amare.

Sheed starts next to Shaq and can pretend to be Robert Horry. Max and Affalo add to their bench and the Suns don't suck at the Draft so they could get some more youth.

Best of all for Phoenix: They clear a bucket load of cap in the next 2 years so they can be major players in the 2010 free agent class.

Is it just me or do the Suns always seem to have a ton of money to spend when the best free agent classes are up for grabs? They some smart fuckers.

So the two trades that just got proposed are:

Shaq/Amare for Sheed/AI/Amir/picks

and

Amare for Sheed/Afflalo/Max/Picks

I'd do either of those. If they didn't think they were getting enough in the first one you can offer to add in either Max or Afflalo.

I'd like this one but I don't think they'll take it. They'd rather have Amir than Max, I'm sure. Plus, this would leave us with an extremely thin bench
Trade Results (http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=614~1727~3187~366~2775~883&teams=8~8~21~21~21~21&te=&cash=)

We'd be:
Stuckey/Bynum
Rip/?? - Acker?
Tay/Herrmann
Amare/McDyess or Amir
Shaq/McDyess or Amir

They'd be:
Nash
Bell
Hill
Max
Sheed

Shaq and Amare aren't working together in Phoenix, who is suggesting that they be traded together?

I am. Who cares? It would only be another year and then Shaq is done. Perhaps they don't work there because half the team is run and gun and Shaq is not.

I'd do the deal without him too. I just figured they might want the cap space this coming year so they can replace Amare with Boozer.

Amare wants to get the hell away from Shaq.

That wouldn't be getting things off on the right foot here.

What about a 3 way deal that sends Shaq to Dallas and Kidd here instead?

Sheed, Max/Amir, AI to Suns...Kidd, Amare here...Shaq to Dallas.

Might need a little filler, but it should work.

Dallas needs a real center to take pressure off Dirk. Terry can simply start in place of Kidd. Suns get boatloads of cap space and two vets to try and make a run this year. We get Amare and Kidd's expiring deal. Plus he'd probably be willing to come off the bench and could actually get them good looks at the basket.

Trade Machine results (http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=366%7E2775%7E883%7E429%7E614%7 E1727&teams=21%7E21%7E21%7E8%7E6%7E8&te=&cash=)

i like it, and it works

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=366~2769~883~429~614~1727&teams=21~21~21~8~6~8&te=&cash=

I'd be down with that, no doubt.

I hate to pull a Ledezma here if it's been talked about, but Kerr is requesting an expiring contract, a draft pick and a young big man for Amare. That's about the most perfect match ever for the Pistons.

Sheed, Amir and a first for Amare.

I would love to have Amare play next to Sheed, however. I know you are all down on him, but I think if you paired him with a good to great big man, they'd be an incredible force. If Rip or AI could be included in that deal instead of Wallace, the Pistons would win the title this year. Book it.

What happened to you Mo? You and I were eye to eye on moving Chauncey and Sheed this past offseason.

I don't mind Sheed. I mind us counting on him as our post presence. Either he needs to go, or he needs a better inside player next to him.

I'd much rather do the deal with AI. I'm just not sure the Suns want Nash/AI/Barbosa all together.

fuck, steve kerr would trade Amare for a hot n ready.

What happened to you Mo? You and I were eye to eye on moving Chauncey and Sheed this past offseason.

I still think they had/have to be moved. I thought Chauncey's "we're fine" attitude is what hurt the Pistons just as much as Flip Saunders ineptness. I just hated the move that was made for Chauncey. If we gave him up, we needed a new leader or at least someone who fits the Pistons game plan. AI is not that leader, nor does he fit.

I've always been a Sheed fan because of his defense, but his post play has sucked the last couple seasons. He is a chucker, but I don't think parking him in the post is the solution. He isn't dominant down there any more, so he heads up top a lot. His defense, however, is still top tier. He still forces bad shots. If we can get a guy who can score down low (like Amare) and keep Sheed's D, that would be tremendous.

So in answer to your question, Chauncey and Sheed have to go, but for the right price.

So you're saying you'd like to see AI/Amir/picks for Amare? I don't know if it can be done, I'm trying it in the trade machine and I don't think they have the filler to make it happen.

Edit: Can't make it happen unless we agree to cut Hill or Lopez after the trade (they won't want to get rid of either of them) or we swap Max for Amir in the deal.

Yeah I never ran anything through the checker, I was just wondering if there was a way to make that happen. It would be better for both teams if they could figure something like that out.

Yeah I never ran anything through the checker, I was just wondering if there was a way to make that happen. It would be better for both teams if they could figure something like that out.

Congratulations!

You are on your way to becoming an NBA beat writer.

This is meant to be a joke at the expense of NBA beat writers, not an attack on your divine post.

Here's a wacky one (but the only way I could figure out an AI for Amare swap was to add a 3rd team):

Detroit:
AI (20 mil) to Suns
Max (3 mil) to Suns
AA (1 mil) to Suns
First rounder to Suns
Kwame Brown (4 mil) to Utah

Suns:
Amare (15 mil) to Detroit
J Rich (12.2 mil) to Utah
Barbosa (6 mil) to Detroit

Utah:
Boozer (11.5 mil) to Suns
Harpring (5 mil) to Detroit

Detroit gets Amare, puts RIP back in starting lineup. Barbosa, Harpring and Dyess are core of bench.

Suns lose Amare but get Boozer to replace. Also get depth up front with Max. J Rich hasn't done much there so they clear his salary. Can build around Nash, Boozer and still sign a top FA in 2010.

Utah has too many PF's and needs a wing that can score. They'd lose Boozer for nothing and will be over the cap, so they can't add much without moving him. They swap harpring for Brown to get cap space next year to retain Memo.

I'm not sure on Utah. They'd like to move Ak47 or Korver I bet, but their salaries are just too hampering. This deal would give them a solid team though:

PG Williams/Price
SG J Rich/Korver
SF Brewer/Miles
PF Millsap/AK 47
C Memo/Collins

Detroit:
PG Stuckey/Barbosa
SG RIP/Barbosa
SF Tay/Harpring
PF Amare/Amir
C Sheed/Dyess

Suns:
PG Nash/AI
SG AI/Barnes
SF Hill/Tucker
PF Boozer/Max
C Shaq/Lopez

We'd let Sheed and harpring walk next year and make a run at Bosh in 2010.

Nothing ensures that Boozer will want to stay in Phoenix. They could end up with nothing at the end of the season if he opts out. They'd just be trading Amare J Rich and Barbosa for Max, AA, and cap space after this season if they couldn't retain Boozer.

Ledezma's favorite radio personality is under the assumption that the only way this deal could get done is if Stuckey is included.

There's no way we're including Stuckey in a trade for Amare. JoeD isn't that stupid. Curry probably is.

Nothing ensures that Boozer will want to stay in Phoenix. They could end up with nothing at the end of the season if he opts out. They'd just be trading Amare J Rich and Barbosa for Max, AA, and cap space after this season if they couldn't retain Boozer.

True, but if he didn't they could just try to sign Bosh the next year (or one of the other great FA's). Playing with Nash is a pretty good sell I would think.

The only place I see Boozer going would be Miami anyway, so they'd have a 50-50 shot. He could develop some nice chemistry with one of the best PG's (like he had with Williams).