There is more to loving a team than winning.

You know what was one of the best moments of the year for me? that game in LA where Amir and Samb played together and started creating havok inside and owning Bynum. They were hopping all over the place...... and we LOST that game! but it was still exciting as hell.

OTOH winning 50+ games and getting to the ECF are terribly blase and boring things now. Some will say we're spoiled, but i think the dirty secret is, the reason it's so ho-hum is this group of players and their personalities. They're just not fun, other than last second heroics there's nothing to get excited about. The 2002-2003 playoff run, I remember that run, that was FUN and EXCITING, I got more thrills out of seeing a rookie come off the bench and own T-Mac and that Philly series than the last 3 years combined. And THAT run ended with a SWEEP in the ECF, but that was so much more exciting than these last few years.

The best part of these playoffs was clearly Rodney Stuckey. the Stuck-ster.

I don't care if we only win 45 games and get bounced in the semis, I think we should dump our old guys, particularly in the front court, and roll with Amir, Max, and even Samb. Move Stuck to starting lineup, and bring Afflalo out of the mothballs. Get a coach who's a good teacher who's willing to institute inside-out system to take advantage of the mismatches.

Admit it, even though we'd lose a TON of games, it would be exciting as hell at times... because lets face it winning 55+ wasnt THAT exciting to begin with. Were you really excited about this year's Philly or Orlando series? I really wasn't, it was just killing time to see if we'd choke in the ECF again. It's the playoffs and we didnt give a crap about the 1st two rounds!!!

What these Pistons have taught me with their listless don't-give-a-crap attitude, is that there actually IS more to sports than just "winning"... You need a reason to WANT THESE GUYS to WIN, this is why people latch on to McDyess so much, Does Rip or Sheed getting another ring really matter to anyone? Are any of these starters going to get better or do amazing things we've never seen before? No chance in hell.

Amir. Stuckey. Maxiell. Samb. Afflalo. These are pretty much the only Pistons I want to see now.

Solid. Very solid. :cogent: in fact.

I :cogent: that :cogent: with my own :cogent:.

I'd like to keep Rip and Prince though. Everyone else is expendable.

metr0man's :cogent: stock is UP!

Well done, sir.

Nice post.

The thing I agree about the most is the need for a coach that preaches inside-out play.

I for one would not welcome new, mediocre overlords. The stretch of years starting with the one after Chuck Daly and ending with the one before Rick Carlisle is still very fresh in my memory. Year after year of watching teams that were lucky if they managed to make it to the first round and get bounced. Those teams were crap. You knew every year that they weren't playing for a shot at a title. That was blase. That was boring.

Winning never gets old. Never. I'll take another 50-60 wins and a trip to the ECF every year for the next 20. I want to see the best players they can find on the court and have no sentimentality for fresh-faced eager youths or (insert random guy from someone else's roster) unless they're better than the guys they replace.

If that makes us the Atlanta Braves of basketball, being in the hunt every year for more than a decade... I'm good with that.

man this is a tough debate, on one hand I understand the saying how this season was boring because it was the same old thing, but we did win. On the other hand the 90's are clear in my mind as well. But as for me, I would not mind sucking again for awhile.

The sweet is never as sweet without the sour.

I like seeing young guys develop, but at the same time, as a Pistons fan, I want to be a title contender...

I for one would not welcome new, mediocre overlords. The stretch of years starting with the one after Chuck Daly and ending with the one before Rick Carlisle is still very fresh in my memory. Year after year of watching teams that were lucky if they managed to make it to the first round and get bounced. Those teams were crap. You knew every year that they weren't playing for a shot at a title. That was blase. That was boring.


Yeah but Joe Dumars is light years better than the jokers who put together those teams. I've no doubt he would make us a respectable team with our youngsters leading the charge

Also i dont necessarily mean LITERALLY dump everyone else, thats not even practical... but I have to imagine a team with say, a backcourt of Stuckey/Rip/Tay/Afflalo and a frontcourt of Max/Amir/Samb/veteran-from-trades would be better than those teams you mentioned , and exciting to see grow.

I can't handle going through more years of watching the Pistons win but knowing they will never win the Championship. I mean, call me spoiled, but it's boring to watch a team that will never improve. I loved the Carlisle years because even though I knew we were going to get beat, the Pistons were on their way up. Every year was a next step for them. And then they skipped a step by winning the championship with Larry Brown.

Ever since Larry left, there has been no improvement from the players or the team. I'm not saying go back and get Larry, I'm saying make it exciting again. The overall goal is a championship, because that's what is remembered. And if it's a year or two or three of rebuilding and missing the playoffs, I'm fine with it as long as Dumars has a plan, which I know he will. Don't get down on Dumars just yet, because this is where he shows what kind of a GM he is.

At this point, you can just assume that I share MoTowns opinion.

I agree with it as well, except one point. Some players have improved, but most of them have not. Stuckey is improving, Max has improved and RIP has improved. I can't really say that Flip is the reason for that improvement though. I'd rather have a few down years before having a legit chance again than mediocrity. I still think we'd be good enough to make the playoffs even if we blew the team up (because we have enough talent to trade away). I doubt we'd go back down to the 32-50 days again.