Note: this discussion orginated in the Pistons/Magic playoff thread, but has been split off into a seperate thread to keep the playoff thread on track and so it doesn't get buried in there.


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Well, here's what I think.

I think that Rip may just get traded this summer, because if he doesn't, he's going to opt out of his contract next year and Joe could lose him and get nothing at all in return.

Billups isn't going anywhere, so if Stuckey is going to get into the starting lineup, it's going to be at SG.

Do you think Stuckey's going to come off the bench forever?

Well, here's what I think.

I think that Rip may just get traded this summer, because if he doesn't, he's going to opt out of his contract next year and Joe could lose him and get nothing at all in return.

Billups isn't going anywhere, so if Stuckey is going to get into the starting lineup, it's going to be at SG.

Do you think Stuckey's going to come off the bench forever?
No, do you think Billups is going to start forever? lol.. Figuring out what to do when stuckey is ready is no issue to me at all. Its alot better than any other issue we had before. As far as Rip goes, you've never even gave credence to the notion of him staying in detroit or being extended, which is again PREMATURE. Stuckey will get his minutes, which I personally think will be enough. He's here to fill a void imo as a legit back up to a guy we overplayed the past couple seasons. The void he fills has plenty of minutes available to him and he's still got alot of work ahead of him before he can be called a starter on this team at any position. Playing SG in certain situations against smaller SG's? Yea i'm cool with that. Playing SG full time as a starter? No thanks. in 2-3 years the team will probably belong to Tay and Him with Billups contract being near its end. Not that big a wait when you're almost being guaranteed by design to get 20+ to maybe 25+ minutes a game in the coming couple seasons imo rotating as a partial SG PG.

But I could be wrong, neither one of us has a crystal ball. Just saying that imho he's better suited to help us as billups back up.

Well, here's what I think.

I think that Rip may just get traded this summer, because if he doesn't, he's going to opt out of his contract next year and Joe could lose him and get nothing at all in return.

Billups isn't going anywhere, so if Stuckey is going to get into the starting lineup, it's going to be at SG.

Do you think Stuckey's going to come off the bench forever?


You know, before this season started, I thought Rip was expendable, but now I don't know. Rip is an above-average defender given the position he plays and he's really our only pure scorer (in the sense that while Sheed & Chauncey can score 22 one night and 8 the next, Rip is always consistently around 16-22 ppg). Not to mention, his offensive numbers took a hit this year, which would suggest that if he were to opt out, he may not find a deal worth more than 11.3 per year, which he would earn his final yere here.

Plus, I don't even think Rip has a player option for 09/10...am I wrong?

As far as Rip goes, you've never even gave credence to the notion of him staying in detroit or being extended, which is again PREMATURE.

I'd say it's almost a lock that he won't sign a extension with the Pistons without testing the market. This is his big score, the contract that will be the most lucrative of his career.

Will Joe want to tie up that much $ in his backcourt?

As far as this discussion being premature, I couldn't disagree more.

then agree to disagree at game 4 of the second round with no options even close to playing out yet not being premature. And its a lame topic, i woulda preferred to be left out of it.

You are certainly welcome to leave the discussion if you aren't interested.

FWIW, Hamilton's player option next summer is for $11,625,000.

That's a lot of cash, but if he can lock in 4 or 5 years at a similar amount, he'd probably be wise to do so from a personal business standpoint.

Anybody want to take a guess on what kind of deal he'll end up with?

I'd say at that point, blow up the team, acquire a bunch of Euros, and build the team around Valter.

You are certainly welcome to leave the discussion if you aren't interested.

FWIW, Hamilton's player option next summer is for $11,625,000.

That's a lot of cash, but if he can lock in 4 or 5 years at a similar amount, he'd probably be wise to do so from a personal business standpoint.

Anybody want to take a guess on what kind of deal he'll end up with?


5 year 65 mil would be the rate we'd be looking at....He might get 70 on the market, but not much more. Obviously a very good player, but not the age that a young team would be thinking to build around.

If we re-sign Rip, that's a very good, but very expensive, backcourt.

And most likely, Stuckey would be coming off the bench until 2011/12, at the earliest.

But will Joe take a chance on Rip leaving or will he let someone else take that chance?

I'm not sure how many teams will have that kind of cap room, but if a team like the Sixers threw a bunch of money/years at him, would he bite?

I don't think you can really replace RIP. That's the problem. Any SG you bring in from FA is going to be a guy the caliber of a Mo Pete. Maybe a good outside shooter, but highly unlikely that he's a decent mid range scorer (or we couldn't afford him). Probably very flawed defensively as well. As was mentioned above, RIP has rounded out into a pretty decent defender now. The last thing we need with no post players (face it, Sheed will never play there enough) is another 3 point shooter. RIP adds things that nobody else on our team does right now. We need him back.

Does anyone see any similarity to the Stackhouse situation with Rip?

If memory serves, Joe found out that Stack was planning on opting out, and that is what motivated him to move Stack while he could still get something in return.

What would we pull for Rip in a trade, and who do you suggest replaces him as our starting SG? And I'm not accepting Stuckey as an answer because we're grooming him as a PG and I just don't think Joe would do that. I also don't think he'd be able to guard the bigger SGs at all.

Does anyone see any similarity to the Stackhouse situation with Rip?

If memory serves, Joe found out that Stack was planning on opting out, and that is what motivated him to move Stack while he could still get something in return.


Stack was planning on opting out and seeking the max. Rip just wants security.

What would we pull for Rip in a trade, and who do you suggest replaces him as our starting SG? And I'm not accepting Stuckey as an answer because we're grooming him as a PG and I just don't think Joe would do that. I also don't think he'd be able to guard the bigger SGs at all.

LOL, relax, I'm just trying to get an idea of what Joe might be thinking.

Does anyone see any similarity to the Stackhouse situation with Rip?

If memory serves, Joe found out that Stack was planning on opting out, and that is what motivated him to move Stack while he could still get something in return.
Only from a contract standpoint.

Stack's game was much more flawed. His large jump in points (his second year here) from 14.5 PPG to 23.6 PPG coincided with his jump in free throw attempts (from 6 a game to over 9 a game) and 3 point attempts (from 3.5 a game to 6 a game). At the same time, his FG% dropped from %43 to %40, where it remained until he was traded. He is a career %41 shooter

On the other hand, RIP is a career %46 shooter (his first 3 years in Washington were under %43). We all know about his improvements on defense and behind the 3 point line as well.

As I said, the situation is similar from a contract standpoint, but RIP is a player that has improved his game. I think Stack simply benefitted from NBA's transition into a star league (with superstars parading to the free throw line). He never really elevated his game, he just got more opportunity to showcase his flawed game.

I'm relaxed, I was just trying to raise some questions. I just threw the Stuckey part in there because that idea's been tossed around a lot.

Chris, I'm not knocking Rip or his game/improvement, I'm just wondering how much of a chance Joe might be willing to take that he won't walk.

Chris, I'm not knocking Rip or his game/improvement, I'm just wondering how much of a chance Joe might be willing to take that he won't walk.

I know you are not. My point was simply that he got rid of Stack when his value was at his peak (and he probably sensed a decline). Joe sold high and bought fairly low. I think he can still sell high, but I'm skeptic he'll be able to buy low (and have it pay off again).

Who would even qualify as a low buy right now?

Hard to get a "low buy" when you are trading a guy with a $10m salary.

That's why someone else would have to be included (we didn't just get Rip straight up for Stack remember)

Stack was making around $6m, which made it a little easier to do this:


09/11/02
Pistons acquire Richard Hamilton, Hubert Davis and Bobby Simmons for Jerry Stackhouse, Brian Cardinal and Ratko Varda in a trade with Wizards.

Not to get sidetracked, but the Wizards turned Stack into this (after they gave him a 2-year extension for $18m in June, 2003):


06/24/04 Mavericks acquire Jerry Stackhouse, Christian Laettner, and the rights to Devin Harris for Antawn Jamison and $1M cash in a trade with the Wizards.

We had Bobby Simmons? Damn, I forgot about that.

Nice turnaround for the Wizards on that. Jamison has been solid for them.

Yeah, Simmons was waived immediately after the deal and never even reported to the Pistons.

So Joe did a good job of "buying low" there, I guess, lol.

Stack was making around $6m, which made it a little easier to do this:

Well, you also have to factor in the salary rise in general. I'm sure the average salary increases along with the cap slightly each year. Basically you need a good young player (drafted in the lotto lets say) and a full MLE player to balence out RIP's salary. Not that hard to do really if you find the right value player for RIP.

How about Rip for Chris Kaman?

Hmmmm, do we then move McDyess for a SG?

Yeah, Simmons was waived immediately after the deal and never even reported to the Pistons.

So Joe did a good job of "buying low" there, I guess, lol.


To be fair, had we kept him we may have a really, really bad contract on our hands now.....not that it excuses dismissing talent.

True, Herm.

As much as I hate the guy, Mike Miller would be another option.

If you want to get crazy, how about a Barbosa/Raja Bell package? We have the roster spots.

Hell, there's even good ol' Josh Howard. No disrespect.

Yeah, Simmons was waived immediately after the deal and never even reported to the Pistons.

So Joe did a good job of "buying low" there, I guess, lol.

I suspect if Simmons ever got a chance here than Tay never would have.

How about Rip for Chris Kaman?

I would for sure (and not because I went to Central). To get a true center (all be it flawed) would be great. Sheed would work well with a guy that operates in the paint mostly.

True, Herm.

As much as I hate the guy, Mike Miller would be another option.

If you want to get crazy, how about a Barbosa/Raja Bell package? We have the roster spots.

Hell, there's even good ol' Josh Howard. No disrespect.

Barbosa is a bad idea. Terrible defender and his game would overlap Stuckey too much. Plus his value is huge at this point.

Whoever we get has to be a halfcourt scoring superstar, or we're tearing this ship down.

Well, Sheed's got an expiring deal, so what about packaging Sheed and Rip for the much talked about "superstar"?

Well, Sheed's got an expiring deal, so what about packaging Sheed and Rip for the much talked about "superstar"? Better be a super-duper star for 2 all-stars. On a team looking to dump......Brand and a player I guess? No one is giving up young studs for old guys.

Yeah, in looking at that salary range, there's not much other than KG or Kobe and that ain't happening.

AI is scheduled for $20m next year, but I think that ship has sailed.

You'll never get return value on Sheed. Look at how cheap we got him. RIP is the best asset we have to move really. If you ended up with a big for RIP, you could easily move Dyess to a contender for another wing. I'd love a deal (or two) that moved RIP and Dyess for Kamen and Battier. You'd have to use the MLE on a scoring SG to round out the roster.

Dice to Houston is something that I've always thought could happen since he lives down there.

I'd think that Joe wouldn't feel as bad about moving him to HOU.

Stack was planning on opting out and seeking the max. Rip just wants security.
Good point. Otherwise no comment on the rest of this wrong forum stuff(looks like it needs to be in the fun with trades forum i never visit).

True, Herm.

As much as I hate the guy, Mike Miller would be another option.

If you want to get crazy, how about a Barbosa/Raja Bell package? We have the roster spots.

Hell, there's even good ol' Josh Howard. No disrespect.


I could live with that package, but I doubt Kerr would bite on that one. As pathetic as his team is defensively, losing Raja Bell would make them a college team...

I still don't think Rip will opt out though, theres no guarantee he can that kind of cash elsewhere, but I suppose alot could also depend on if we resign Rasheed and where we stand as a franchise...

You'll never get return value on Sheed. Look at how cheap we got him. RIP is the best asset we have to move really. If you ended up with a big for RIP, you could easily move Dyess to a contender for another wing. I'd love a deal (or two) that moved RIP and Dyess for Kamen and Battier. You'd have to use the MLE on a scoring SG to round out the roster.


You gave up a good bit of scoring there, yes? Am I wrong to think Kamen wouldn't score near for us what he did in LA? Maybe Sheed picks it up, I don't know, but that deal for two guys who aren't known as the toughest covers scares me a bit when we're already a good D team.

Question for the board, in my opinion, resigning Sheed (after next year) is a no-brainer, he's not going to cost what he got in his last deal, and I'm sure you could knock off a year...something like 4 years 45???

Somebody on 97.1, I think it was Terry Foster, casually said Sheed probably won't be resigned, but didn't have any source or anything, he just said it as an opinion...which kind of had me puzzled...

He's got game left in the tank, he'd probably be fully depreciated by the end of his next contract, but wouldn't it be a no brainer to resign him???

You gave up a good bit of scoring there, yes? Am I wrong to think Kamen wouldn't score near for us what he did in LA? Maybe Sheed picks it up, I don't know, but that deal for two guys who aren't known as the toughest covers scares me a bit when we're already a good D team.


I agree, I don't like that deal. I love Battier as a 6th man or defensive "stopper" but he can't be relied on to score, better off trying to get James Posey this offseason (if he doesn't exercise his 3 mill player option), he's a poor mans Battier and just as good offensively, and cheaper...

and as for Chris Kaman, he was a product of not having Elton Brand by his side to score, somebody had to do some mop up scoring on that team, and it was him, I don't think he's as good as his numbers indicated this year, and he's pretty heavily overpaid...

Question for the board, in my opinion, resigning Sheed is a no-brainer, he's not going to cost what he got in his last deal, and I'm sure you could knock of a year...something like 4 years 45???

Somebody on 97.1, I think it was Terry Foster, casually said Sheed probably won't be resigned, but didn't have any source or anything, he just said it as an opinion...which kind of had me puzzled...

He's got game left in the tank, he'd probably be fully depreciated by the end of his next contract, but wouldn't it be a no brainer to resign him???

Might be worthy of a separate thread, but Sheed's going to have a ton of value with his expiring deal. A top quality frontcourt player with a big expiring contract?

If we flame out in the playoffs, dealing Sheed might be the quickest way to reshape this team in a hurry. You could get quite a bit in return, IMO.

Barbosa is a bad idea. Terrible defender and his game would overlap Stuckey too much. Plus his value is huge at this point.
Barbosa used to be a quality defender. My hunch is that too many years of D'Antoni ball have made his defense the suck. That might be fixable.

If he's a FA I'd have to think we'd be #1 to resign him, he's considered taboo in a lot of circles. Here we've treated him well and he has in turn been on decent behavior.

You gave up a good bit of scoring there, yes? Am I wrong to think Kamen wouldn't score near for us what he did in LA? Maybe Sheed picks it up, I don't know, but that deal for two guys who aren't known as the toughest covers scares me a bit when we're already a good D team.
Well, Kamen can give you 13 and 10. That's 5 more points a game than Dyess. I would expect Tay to get more shots as well and score more like 16-17 a night. So, you need to replace about 9-10 PPG of RIP's scoring (at least). You could bring in Barnes, Posey or even Grant Hill to get you 9-10 PPG. Plus you've got Stuckey improving as well, and a better 6th man in Battier than Hayes.

PG Billups (32)/Stuckey (16)
SG FA (24)/Stuckey (13)/Battier (11)
SF Tay (32)/Battier (16)
PF Sheed (18)/Max (30)
C Kamen (30)/Sheed (12)/Amir (6)

I'd like to get Amir more minutes than that, but he would eventually phaze Sheed out more and more.

If you say so Chris. I know you replaced Rip's 30 + minutes with 27 from Battier. Maybe the FA is Flip Murray?

I'm not saying Battier is the guy, just that we could still score enough. A better bet might be someone like Miller, as Glenn mentioned.

If Sheed isn't re-signed then there'd better be a plan in place to make up that talent deficit. No, Amir Johnson doesn't qualify.

Glenn, you really think he'll get another deal like he got before?

but what our team needs most of all is an athletic wingman/2 guard who can create his own shot and get to the rim. rip can't do that. in fact, he's horrible at it.

i love the kid and he's been a warrior and a huge part of our success. he has improved some aspects of his game every year. but he never will be a guy who can handle and take the ball to the hoop and finish/get to the line. with the way the game is being called now, those qualities are even more valuable than ever.

true his midrange game is great. but it's no coincidence that every year in the playoffs teams beat him up, cheat through screens, and don't give him the space he's used to. rip is great with his conditioning and how he can run all day to get open. but the bottom line is, he relies on other people to get open and get his shots.

as a result he has been struggling to get those same shots when teams clamp down on him and we go through scoring droughts when he's not able to create his own shot.

i don't have anyone specifically in mind but we do need a 2 guard who is much more athletic and who can handle, create his own shot, and finish around the rim. otherwise we're completely at the mercy of the jumpshot, and we all know how bad we struggle when those aren't falling.

if we had a guy who could get to the rim and get some calls by driving, then we'd be much better off in playoff ball IMO.

stuckey has some of those qualities but he's not a true 2 guard, he's not a good finisher (yet) and he's not an elite athlete. ditto for afflalo. like it or not, we need a 2 guard with more handles and athleticism than we currently have.

maybe we could snag a sleeper w/ the 29 pick that can develop...

Chris Douglas-Roberts?

STUCKEY TO PG, CBILL TO SG! if Rip wants to leave.

STUCKEY TO PG, CBILL TO SG! if Rip wants to leave.



Tay would have to double his shot attempts if Rip leaves...other than Rip, he's the only one who could probably get 20 on a consistent basis...

Chauncey may struggle guarding 2's though, he forefits his size advantage

This is a good thread, good enough to get me out of hibernation for about a hundred years. The idea here isn't what to do with Rip, its what other option would we have?

If we do lose this season, a change is clearly indicated. Dumars has made it clear that Dice will not be moved (NT clause and they are friends), and honestly Tayshaun and Sheed play better than their values. Chauncey is possible, but as you guys wrote Stuckey should be ready to take over just as Chauncey's contract is up.

We will have no cap space, and the MLE likely won't be enough to get us over the hump to win again. Realistically Rip WILL be traded if we can't win the whole thing.

Of the options you guys came up with and a few of my own, here are a couple ones I like.

Rip and Amir Johnson for Josh Smith with a max deal. One of two things will happen here. If Atlanta keeps him, they overpay. If not, we can target Childress in a S&T for less. Smith EXACTLY fits what a Piston should be at both ends of the floor. Unfortunately I would think Atlanta would pay him the max anyway.

Option 2, a trade with Dallas for Josh Howard and their first. Dallas is ready to blow something up, and they actually will welcome Rip's free agency at the same time Kidd's 21 mill comes off. Howard and Tay would both cover the guard spots well, and we should still be improved defensively. I like this trade with a pick thrown in to us.

Other players we could target could be Tony Allen, Ryan Gomes (to backup Tayshaun), Josh Childress but the question is really are these guys enough to get us over the top?

I love Josh Childress, if we gave him an offer sheet, I wonder how high/low it would have to be to prevent Atlanta from matching, surely having to give Smoove a near max contract would help our cause...

I like the Josh Howard idea. He's been to the Finals before and unlike Rip, he can get to the basket. Also, he makes his threes, and he's a far better rebounder than Rip. He's not as good defensively as Rip is, but he's not bad, definitely above average though.

Do you really think Dallas would toss in their #1 with that though??



One thing that would make it tough though, isn't Howard a BYC player?? I'm not sure the salaries match, you'd probably have to toss them Afflalo or something...

Or shit, don't we have a trade exception?? from the Delfino trade?

Oh hell, I don't know if they would give us the pick, but I do know that their team is much in need of a shakeup, much like ours if we lose. In addition, they have no future next season without the trade, and no real cap space until after next season (Stack contract). If they do the rip trade, it actually does give them the option to blow it all up, since they would have room for a max contract.

Howard is off BYC I believe.

I don't think the trade exception rolls over to the next season. I thought we had this season alone to use it.

Hey you can also add in the Rick Carlisle Rip connection now.

And if Dallas doesn't want to give us their first, we could always swap firsts or throw in our second with their first, something to even it up a bit more.

I say let Rip Walk without trading him.
Or trade him for one of the restricted's with the threat of sniping them otherwise.

Because lots of the player idea's I'm hearing make me sad.

Sit on the cap money because the next two free agencies are pretty decent as far as Detroit goes.
The Pistons would be in a good position to steal a restricted free agent away from another team or capitalize on the ETO's

Restricted---
Josh Smith
Emeka
Deng (wants out )
Iggy ( Free to go?)
Calderon

Unrestricted----
Jamison


ETO----
Gilbert Arenas (opting out)
Shawn Marion (probably opting out)
Jermain O'neal (Sell JO on playing with Sheed ..... and I sure as fuck would want out)
Allen Iverson (no thanks)
Elton Brand (probably not because of injury)
Corey Maggette (wouldn't this be nice?)




Or, try this.

Let Rip Walk, free
And in the next season, Let Sheed Walk, Free.


The 2009 Free Agency is going to be insane. We would still have a decent team for 2009 and lots of cap space. In 2010 we could be a reloaded contender


PS. what is the story on Monta Ellis?

Honestly Bubbles, I have to completely disagree. What Dumars has shown us is that his two best areas are drafting and trading. While cap space is awesome, I don't want to have to compete against teams like new york, who will S&T for the max on anyone and combine that with extra endorsements for being in NY. I likewise don't want to have players have to choose between the weather and cities like Phoenix and Orlando. Dumars has shown that he can sign good free agents too, but we have never signed a max level free agent from another team (which is a good thing). I HIGHLY doubt our ability to take one of those players from another team. Besides, if we let Rip walk, the next season is a lame duck year. Everyone on the team will regress. That's just not worth it.

Letting Rip walk without getting anything in return like we did with Memo just isn't a great idea.

You're right,

GIVE RIP THE MAX!

Take Rip out of game 4 and I'm not sure we win it. Take CBill out we win it. I could be wrong, but I doubt it.

Take Rip out of game 4 and I'm not sure we win it. Take CBill out we win it. I could be wrong, but I doubt it.


I think I have to agree. A game like today showed how many intangiables Rip brings to this team. His defense is irreplaceable (unless you get Raja Bell), but honestly he's the only true scorer on this team.

I have to think with how close he is with Chauncey, he's not going to opt out. But again, it will depend where we are as a franchise.

I think I have to agree. A game like today showed how many intangiables Rip brings to this team. His defense is irreplaceable (unless you get Raja Bell), but honestly he's the only true scorer on this team.

I have to think with how close he is with Chauncey, he's not going to opt out. But again, it will depend where we are as a franchise.

Yep, if we don't win it all, someone will have to go. Unfortunately, it might be Rip. It shouldn't be, but prolly will be.

Tahoe, unfortunately you are right. I love Rip, but it just doesn't change the fact that he will be our most moveable asset if we HAVE to make a change. Bubbles, there is no way I want Rip at the max, which is why I suggested a S&T for someone else.

If we lose, I just don't think there is going to be a superstar waiting to just take over. I have to think the most likely player to remain a Piston in Prince. He fits into any scheme and delivers in almost every category in the game.

Ideally we wouldn't have extended Dice or given him a NT clause, but that's what it took to stay competitive.

In the end, no team will give us a true superstar in exchange for Sheed or Billups. Tay possibly, but Dumars will never move him IMO. And unfortunately that leaves Rip.

Letting Rip walk without getting anything in return like we did with Memo just isn't a great idea.
We didn't have a realistic choice with Memo, owing to the CBA at the time.

We didn't have a realistic choice with Memo, owing to the CBA at the time.

I think Larry Brown had alot to do with Memo leaving. He wouldn't let the guy shoot 3's...

I think Larry Brown had alot to do with Memo leaving. He wouldn't let the guy shoot 3's...

But we should've had his rights.

Memo left because there was no way possible to pay both Memo and Sheed.

call me crazy but id love to see a jermaine/sheed frontcourt. we control the paint. billups/max or amir for jermaine. injury is an issue but we got arnie. we gotta keep rip. if he asks for too much s&T his ass but every other piston has asked for a decent amount of cash, so that money can be used on other fa's.

call me crazy but id love to see a jermaine/sheed frontcourt. we control the paint. billups/max or amir for jermaine. injury is an issue but we got arnie. we gotta keep rip. if he asks for too much s&T his ass but every other piston has asked for a decent amount of cash, so that money can be used on other fa's.

I would never make that deal in a million years. JO has to have very low value at this point based on his injuries. Sending Billups there is retarded (we'd be way overpaying). Look at what the Lakers moved for Gasol (who is far younger and far less injured). We could get a lot more for Billups, that is for sure. I'd much rather make an attempt at Brand than JO.

I would never make that deal in a million years. JO has to have very low value at this point based on his injuries. Sending Billups there is retarded (we'd be way overpaying). Look at what the Lakers moved for Gasol (who is far younger and far less injured). We could get a lot more for Billups, that is for sure. I'd much rather make an attempt at Brand than JO.

Another Heretic of the church of Arnie Kander!
Burn the witch!

It's not about doubting that Kander can help JO. It's about trading one of the best PG's in the league (a position that is very hard to fill) for a broken down PF (a position we have a lot of depth at).

Given a chance to play a full season of decent minutes (like Stuckey got), I'm not sure Amir can't be just as good as JO is now.

I think that this Pistons team is best with an old-school PG right now and for the foreseeable future.

Is Billups your old-school PG, Swami, or do you have someone else in mind?

I think that this Pistons team is best with an old-school PG right now and for the foreseeable future.

The spacing created for this team is created by a PG that can shoot at the top of the circle. Rip, Sheed, Dice, all feed off it. If your old school PG is the drive and dish type, that doesn't really fit the rest of the guys we have (except Prince who could play any style)

my 2 cents... I think Sheed likes the youngster Stuck better than anyone on the team.

It seems like Stuck gets the guy defending Sheed to have to help on Stuck when Stuck beats his guy out top. Leaves Sheed free for a lil bit for a bunny or a board or something.