Make your endorsements here, suckas.
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When the pistons take a trip to the obama white house after the 09 championship, maybe they can have a pickup game.

I hate to say it, but I bet he rooted hard against the Bad Boys back in the day.

You should send him a letter or e-mail and ask him.

Also make sure to ask who Reverend Wright rooted for too.

And BO's friend who bombed the Pentagon, but wished he did more.

And BO's friend who bombed the Pentagon, but wished he did more.


While I think this Ayers guy is an idiot, he seems to be a somewhat productive member of society at this point. Moreover, BO has never had a close relationship with the guy. What I find truely frightening is McCain's relationship with his "spiritual advisor" Rod Parsley who said:

The secular media never likes it when I say this, so let me say it twice. Man your battle stations! Ready your weapons! They say this rhetoric is so inciting. I came to incite a riot. ... Man your battle stations. Ready your weapons. Lock and load--for the thirty, forty liberal pastors who filed against our ministry with the Internal Revenue Service. ... Let the struggle begin. Let it begin in your heart today with a shout unto him who has called us to war--not only that, he has empowered you and I to win. —Rod Parsley[8]

and

I cannot tell you how important it is that we understand the true nature of Islam, that we see it for what it really is. In fact, I will tell you this: I do not believe our country can truly fulfill its divine purpose until we understand our historical conflict with Islam. I know that this statement sounds extreme, but I do not shrink from its implications. The fact is that America was founded, in part, with the intention of seeing this false religion destroyed, and I believe September 11, 2001, was a generational call to arms that we can no longer ignore.

So McCain's "spiritual advisor" wants to incite a riot that would kill other pastors because they called the IRS to investigate the tax exempt status of his partisan church. When he's not inciting parishoners to kill other pastors, he advocates that America was founded in part to destroy Islam. If McCain didn't already seem hellbent on fighting as many wars as possible in the Middle East, I might let this guy slide. However, McCain seems to be collecting as many "spiritual" men that want to destroy Islam as he can. Say what you want about Ayers and Wright, but they have advocated against stupid wars. McCain supporters advocate for stupid wars. You tell me, which is worse?

Yeah, but the really important question is -- does Ayers have a jumpshot, or is he just kind of a bomber?

Serious questions here...

Is this Parsley McCains pastor? Is he in AZ? Did he marry JM? Or is this more of McCain pandering for votes?

Serious questions here...

Is this Parsley McCains pastor? Is he in AZ? Did he marry JM? Or is this more of McCain pandering for votes?

McCain referred to Parsley as a "spiritual guide" here.

http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2008/02/27/GOP27.ART_ART_02-27-08_A1_IS9FKJU.html?type=rss&cat=&sid=101

He may not have been married by this guy, but he has made no effort to define why Parsley should be his spirtual guide. However, the broader point is that McCain is going out of his way to line up support from pastors that actively foment violence against ALL Muslims in some sort of holy war (Hagee and Parsley). He also treats the words of these idiots with respect while BO has denounced Wright's statements about AIDS in Africa and other nonsense. I also present Mike Huckabee's suggestion 'that we rewrite the Constitution based on God's laws' as the most unpatriotic thing I have ever heard from any presidential candidate in my lifetime. Where is the righty outrage about that? This country is based on the premise that there is NO state religion and the Constitution and other documents are made of reasoned laws, not God's laws. Thomas Jefferson had such contempt for Christian dogma that he rewrote his own version of the Bible. Somehow, I doubt that he or any other founders considered the destruction of Islam as a reason for existence.

Further, BO has never received an endorsement from Ayres in his presidential run, does not have Ayres introduce him at campaign events. Further, BO has referred to his acts in the 70s as detestable. What is McCain's position on purging Muslims from the earth?

Labeling someone as a spiritual guide and having a 20 years association with someone is different to me. But your questions should be asked of McCain. And I'm sure they will be.

Huckabee is out of the race. I'm not sure what you're getting at there. Kucinich thinks UFOs exist, but we're not talking about previous peeps who have ran, or I thought we weren't.

re: the debate. I'm bummed I missed that one. It sure was the most talked about to date.

Suppose there was a little known white candidate that had a Pastor of 20 years that was a white supremacist, one that blasted away at blacks all the time, and was associated with someone who bombed abortion clinics and was unrepentant about it, Does anyone seriously think that there wouldn't be legitamate questions about that?

As much as I've railed against the media lately, I can see why those questions were asked. Would they be at the top of my list? No, but I'd prolly sneak 1 or 2 of them in.

Kucinich won a grand total of ZERO delegates. Huckabee finished second in the Republican race and won a number of states. People have mentioned Huckabee as a possible VP candidate. He is more or less in the mainstream of Republican politics, while Kucinich has always been out on the outer fringe. Honestly, I would take a candidate who believed in UFOs over a candidate that wanted to rewrite the Constitution based on his religious beliefs.

Also, I have not heard any categorical statements from Wright that asserted that blacks are a superior race (though I admit that those could be out there). The man lived through white supremacy, which was southern policy until the 1960s. How many white people have lived through black supremacy as the dominant political policy? Drug policy is tilted completely against black people to this day. How many days in prison did Cindy McCain get for stealing pills from her non-profit and getting prescriptions filled in the names of her employees without their knowledge or consent. One of the doctors (who was her employee at the time) lost his license to practice medicine, but good ole Cindy got off scott free.

Also, how is the desire for eradication of all Muslims not far worse than being pissed off at the way white people have treated black people? Is Wright out there fomenting a holy war or just telling black people that they have to be self-reliant? I agree that Wright's views are obnoxious and repellant, but he does not advocate violence the way Hagee and Parsley do. I'll agree that Ayres fomented violence in the 1970s, but he was never convicted of anything, does not presently foment violent, and is not introducing BO at campaign events.

Your opinion --> Huck is mainstream GOP and Kucinich isn't a mainstream Dem. Sorry, not going forward with a debate based on what you think is mainstream on one and not on the other...other than to say that I'm not sure I heard of Huckabee till last year. flash in a fry pan and gone.

Wright can say whatever he wants. Its fucked up what he had to go through. But to translate into today is fucked up. He's a race baiter. Its not a big deal except that someone who went to his church for 20 years wants to be the Prez. And peeps don't know a lot about this particular 'someone'.

Ayres admitted he did it. He got off on a technicallity and admitted that too. He says he wished he would have done more.

Honestly, Biden was my guy moreso than Obama. I tend to be somewhat fiscally conservative, but soically moderate. For example, I think school vouchers are potentially useful, even for religious schools, and I think pilot studies should be tried. I am strongly for balancing the budget, and I think grand social projects are often doomed to fail due to the law of unintended consequences. I prefer a "muddling through" approach.

However, I think the present US foreign policy is a total sham and I cite the following GAO report about the terrorists roaming freely in Afghanistan and Pakistan, where I believed our forces should have been focused all along.

http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d08622.pdf?source=ra

I don't trust McCain at all on foreign policy and I am deeply concerned about the ongoing theocrat movement embodied by Huckabee as well as McCain's alliances with terribly reprehensible rapture-seekers.

How the hell is the second place finisher not mainstream? He won a number of states. I would say Brownback was a fringe candidate. However, Huckabee was in fact widely considered a serious candidate.

Edit: also, you never answered how you feel about Pastors that call for the eradication of all Muslims. Do you support them?

How the hell is the second place finisher not mainstream? He won a number of states. I would say Brownback was a fringe candidate. However, Huckabee was in fact widely considered a serious candidate.

Edit: also, you never answered how you feel about Pastors that call for the eradication of all Muslims. Do you support them?

Not even going to grace that with an answer.

Is this Parsley McCains pastor? Is he in AZ? Did he marry JM? Or is this more of McCain pandering for votes?
Last year, McCain changed his stated faith from Episcopalian to Baptist as seemingly a pandering sort of move -- a point of contrast with Hillary who's Episcopalian. More recently, his Baptist pastor, who he has seen for many years because he tags with his wife, said that McCain wasn't Baptist.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,296973,00.html

By the way, I'm not Episcopalian. I'm Baptist," McCain said.

http://www.abpnews.com/3116.article

“You have to be baptized by immersion to be a member [of North Phoenix],” Yeary said. “John and I have dialogued about that. … John is an Episcopalian, and he and his family attend North Phoenix Baptist Church when he is in town.”

When you and your pastor can't agree on what religion you are... fun.

It might be considered 'partisan spin' on my part, but I don't see this as even in the same ball park as BO and Wright.

Not even going to grace that with an answer.

I wouldn't have phrased it that way if you had made any comment whatsoever about the info I posted. You act as if the depth of a relationship with bad actors is much more important that qualities of the bad actors themselves. Either way, I would say that citing Parsley as a spirtual advisor goes way beyond the depth of BO's relationship with and endorsement of Ayres. I submit that BO has had a much deeper relationship with Wright, but that Hagee and Parsley are much worse for America both in tone and ability to cause mischief. For more on why I think McCain's relationship with the radical right is important, I posted in the Republican thread.

Kucinich won a grand total of ZERO delegates. Huckabee finished second in the Republican race and won a number of states. People have mentioned Huckabee as a possible VP candidate. He is more or less in the mainstream of Republican politics, while Kucinich has always been out on the outer fringe. Honestly, I would take a candidate who believed in UFOs over a candidate that wanted to rewrite the Constitution based on his religious beliefs.

Also, I have not heard any categorical statements from Wright that asserted that blacks are a superior race (though I admit that those could be out there). The man lived through white supremacy, which was southern policy until the 1960s. How many white people have lived through black supremacy as the dominant political policy? Drug policy is tilted completely against black people to this day. How many days in prison did Cindy McCain get for stealing pills from her non-profit and getting prescriptions filled in the names of her employees without their knowledge or consent. One of the doctors (who was her employee at the time) lost his license to practice medicine, but good ole Cindy got off scott free.

Also, how is the desire for eradication of all Muslims not far worse than being pissed off at the way white people have treated black people? Is Wright out there fomenting a holy war or just telling black people that they have to be self-reliant? I agree that Wright's views are obnoxious and repellant, but he does not advocate violence the way Hagee and Parsley do. I'll agree that Ayres fomented violence in the 1970s, but he was never convicted of anything, does not presently foment violent, and is not introducing BO at campaign events.
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re: the debate. I'm bummed I missed that one. It sure was the most talked about to date.
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/DemocraticDebate/Story?id=4670271&page=1


Suppose there was a little known white candidate that had a Pastor of 20 years that was a white supremacist, one that blasted away at blacks all the time, and was associated with someone who bombed abortion clinics and was unrepentant about it, Does anyone seriously think that there wouldn't be legitamate questions about that?

As much as I've railed against the media lately, I can see why those questions were asked. Would they be at the top of my list? No, but I'd prolly sneak 1 or 2 of them in.
The issue was that the entire first half of the debate was filled with loaded "Obama" questions. "Do you think Wright loves America as much as you do?" is classic "have you beaten your wife lately" territory. Obama would try to steer things to more serious turg but get interrupted. Then, when they got to serious "issues" questions after an hour, they wanted to balance the time between the two candidates because Obama spent more time talking about questions directed at him. Oh, and every time Hillary spoke and they wanted to mix things up visually by focusing away from the debate, it was always at a fawning bright Chelsea Clinton. With Obama, it was at a distant darkened crowd. When I was half-watching it during Pistons timeouts, I was thinking I must be missing the Hillary questions and Obama peeps, but I wasn't.

It didn't exactly rattle Obama, though I bet he was surprised because Charlie Gibson all by himself moderated a pretty fair debate last time and I would've seen him as a balancing force with George "I worked for Bill Clinton" S. There wasn't any huge gaffe or breakdown. If anything, Hillary made that by saying Obama was electable and undermining her own arguments to the superdels. But it was the "media takes it to Obama, with Hillary on the sidelines taking potshots" rather than their really debating each other. She could've gotten the proverbial pillow and taken a nap. By the time serious issues happened, there were time constraints and it was clear that no good moderation would be forthcoming. How many debates do you know where the crowd boos the moderators at the end?

I wouldn't have phrased it that way if you had made any comment whatsoever about the info I posted. You act as if the depth of a relationship with bad actors is much more important that qualities of the bad actors themselves. Either way, I would say that citing Parsley as a spirtual advisor goes way beyond the depth of BO's relationship with and endorsement of Ayres. I submit that BO has had a much deeper relationship with Wright, but that Hagee and Parsley are much worse for America both in tone and ability to cause mischief. For more on why I think McCain's relationship with the radical right is important, I posted in the Republican thread.

Just because you posted something, I have to comment on it? And if I don't your prejudice says I agree with it?

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/DemocraticDebate/Story?id=4670271&page=1


The issue was that the entire first half of the debate was filled with loaded "Obama" questions. "Do you think Wright loves America as much as you do?" is classic "have you beaten your wife lately" territory. Obama would try to steer things to more serious turg but get interrupted. Then, when they got to serious "issues" questions after an hour, they wanted to balance the time between the two candidates because Obama spent more time talking about questions directed at him. Oh, and every time Hillary spoke and they wanted to mix things up visually by focusing away from the debate, it was always at a fawning bright Chelsea Clinton. With Obama, it was at a distant darkened crowd. When I was half-watching it during Pistons timeouts, I was thinking I must be missing the Hillary questions and Obama peeps, but I wasn't.

It didn't exactly rattle Obama, though I bet he was surprised because Charlie Gibson all by himself moderated a pretty fair debate last time and I would've seen him as a balancing force with George "I worked for Bill Clinton" S. There wasn't any huge gaffe or breakdown. If anything, Hillary made that by saying Obama was electable and undermining her own arguments to the superdels. But it was the "media takes it to Obama, with Hillary on the sidelines taking potshots" rather than their really debating each other. She could've gotten the proverbial pillow and taken a nap. By the time serious issues happened, there were time constraints and it was clear that no good moderation would be forthcoming. How many debates do you know where the crowd boos the moderators at the end?

I heard he was a lil rattled and definately lost the debate. I don't much care really. After 20 some debates, they don't carry much weight unless someone makes a huge mistake.

Another point that I thought was somewhat cogent was that while BO's negs have risen (mainly cuz of the slicing and dicing thats went on between Hill, Bill and BO) it hasn't benefited Hillary. So they only thing she can do is continue to get peeps away from voting for him and just have them go away...type of thing. You get what I'm saying there Mxy? Not sure if thats clear. I thought it was a good point.

I've say he was more peeved than rattled. But again, I didn't watch all of it, just read the transcripts to catch up. There's only so much of George S.'s whiny voice that I can take. It seemed like once he realized he wasn't going to get a fair shake, his goal was to get through it.

And yup, you make a great point. Hillary's tactic is to smear Obama, hope that the people who haven't been paying attention who are likelier to vote your way come through big. If that miracle happens, then worry about how to win pissed off Obama voters later.

I see that tahoe has no interest in an intellectually honest debate, so I won't bother any more. One would think it would be easy to repudiate genocide proponents, but your decision not to reveals more about you than it does me for calling you on it.

I see that tahoe has no interest in an intellectually honest debate, so I won't bother any more. One would think it would be easy to repudiate genocide proponents, but your decision not to reveals more about you than it does me for calling you on it.

Again, I don't feel I have to repudiate something just cuz you posted it. I don't go around on this board or any other and repudiate every thought that I don't agree.

Good bye.

This thread sucks. Who fucking posted such a balls thread?