Glenn
11-15-2007, 04:30 PM
Thursday, November 15, 2007
Lots of questions and comments about playing time and the sometimes heavy minutes the starters are playing in the face of the off-season mandate from management that opportunities would be there for young players off the bench. We’ll start Mailbag with a representative sampling of those questions …
Chad (Saginaw): I get so angry and frustrated when the starters play 40 minutes or more in a game. Why do you think Flip is so scared to play his bench in pressure situations? I’m talking about the game against Portland Tuesday night. What does Flip need to see before he’s confident with his bench?
Langlois: More consistent play, Chad. I don’t think much has been out of whack so far except that Amir Johnson’s training camp injury set him back – mostly because it didn’t give him the opportunity to gain Saunders’ trust – and Rodney Stuckey, whose spot in the rotation was already secure, is still out with his broken hand. If you factor Stuckey’s 20 or so minutes into the rotation and add 10 or 15 more for Johnson, the relatively heavy minutes for the starters in some games wouldn’t be an issue.
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Travis (Chicago): I just finished watching the Pistons-Portland game and I had a few thoughts. First, Rasheed seems to be playing inspired basketball. He was all over the court, especially in the first half. Second, does Flip Saunders have the ability to appropriately manage players’ minutes? I know our starters are great, but we’ve seen what happens when they’re mentally and physically tired at the end of the season. Third, Nazr has no fluidity to his game and was owned by Joel Przybilla.
Langlois: No arguments on Rasheed. It’s been noticeable with him since the day training camp opened. As to your second point, Saunders wouldn’t be the first coach who finds security in the known. He knows to a high degree of certainty what he’ll get from his starters. The bench is going to be a work in progress. Those are all really young players coming off the bench. Jarvis Hayes is the elder statesmen. It’s his fifth year, but he’s never really had a niche like he has here, so it’ll take some time even for him. There’s a delicate equation at work in the maturation of every young player – they have to make steady progress toward earning a coach’s trust, and the coach in turn must be tolerant of reasonable growing pains.
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Jason (Grand Rapids): I recently read an article in which Flip Saunders said Amir Johnson’s playing time is limited because he is competing with Jason Maxiell for minutes. Then I read your interview with Joe Dumars in which he says Amir is getting limited time because of his injury. Who should I believe? It really doesn’t make sense that they speak of them both as being the future of the team. Why can’t they be on the floor at the same time?
Langlois: Flip Saunders is leery of playing Maxiell and Johnson together until they prove themselves as defensive rebounders. They’re both tremendously active offensive rebounders. I don’t think Saunders and Dumars have said anything contradictory about Johnson’s status. Saunders did say it’s tough for Johnson right now, coming off his injury and competing to take away some – not all, but some – of the minutes Maxiell has earned. Dumars said it’s a long season and Johnson will not be the odd man out.
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Freddie (Las Colinas, Texas): Watching Rasheed against Portland was like reliving our loss to the Spurs in the Finals a few years ago when he left Robert Horry open for the 3-point shot. He leaves his man open over and over again.
Langlois: Yes and no, Freddie. The Horry basket came on an out-of-bounds play. Portland was doing damage to the Pistons with the high pick-and-roll play with Jarrett Jack, Sergio Rodriguez and Steve Blake all working off or LaMarcus Aldridge, a rapidly developing second-year player who shoots unusually well from the perimeter. I’m not privy to what the game plan called for in defending Aldridge as he set the pick and then drifted to the open spot on the perimeter, but Portland was hurting the Pistons on both ends – the guards were getting penetration when the big men didn’t cut them off, and when they did Wallace got caught in the lane helping out and leaving Aldridge open for 20-footers. Against most big men, you’d take your chances with that. But against a rare few – Wallace and Aldridge being two of them – you get burned.
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Lee (Oklahoma City): Did they ever convict Brian Williams’ murderer? I thought they were going to charge his brother with the crime, but I don’t remember if they ever did.
Langlois: One-time Piston Brian Williams, who changed his name to Bison Dele, disappeared along with his girlfriend and the captain of Williams’ catamaran in July 2002. It was widely suspected that his brother, who had changed his name to Miles Dabord, was responsible – his girlfriend said he told her there had been “a struggle” aboard the boat – but Dabord was found unconscious in Tijuana, Mexico in September of that year and died two weeks later. That’s pretty much where the story ends. Williams/Dele was one of the most, uh, unique people to ever play in the NBA. He didn’t march to his own drummer; he had his own drum section.
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Tobias (Voehringen, Germany): Do you think the Bulls would have beaten the Pistons if Stuckey had been in the lineup? Also, I’ve watched the “everywhere present” Celtics and, while I respect what they’ve done, I noticed that when they played the Nets they had four players who played more than 37 minutes and only eight who played. Do you think they will stumble over the season in that high gear?
Langlois: There’s no question Stuckey’s going to help the Pistons win games this year, but it’s impossible to say what his presence might have meant in that game. The Pistons’ biggest problems against Chicago were turnovers (17) and rebounding (allowing Chicago 15 offensive boards). Not sure how much Stuckey would have mattered in those two categories, but it’s fair to wonder how the game might have been different had he played. As for Boston’s minutes, read on …
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Gil (Charlotte, N.C.): How can everyone be so hung up on the Celtics when the “Big Three” are averaging 38.4 (Paul Pierce), 39.8 (Kevin Garnett) and 40.6 (Ray Allen) minutes per game? After Rivers was rumored to be fired after last season and the general mentality of head coaches, it’s only natural that he wants to play to win now to keep his job. How can anyone who follows the NBA think playing three 30-plus-year-old players that many minutes isn’t going to backfire at some point?
Langlois: It’s a calculated risk they’re taking in Boston, no question, Gil. I’m sure Danny Ainge has talked about it at length with Doc Rivers and I’m assuming Ainge has signed off on extended minutes for his stars. Pierce and Allen both missed significant time with leg injuries last year and Garnett has a lot of NBA miles on his legs. The career averages in minutes played for the three are 37.5 for Allen, who’s 32; 38.3 for Garnett, 31; and 37.8 for Pierce, 30. All three are playing more minutes than their career norms, and while they’re all still in the prime of the careers, pushing them to 40 minutes a night is risky. It’s also understandable. They have almost no depth in Boston.
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Jason (San Francisco): Would the Lakers accept Ben Gordon, Kirk Hinrich and Andres Nocioni for Kobe? Or is Kobe getting traded?
Langlois: I don’t know to both questions. If I were the Lakers, I wouldn’t take that package. I’d want Deng and one of Thomas and Noah as the centerpieces. I have a theory about the whole Kobe trade scenario, as I wrote about in my Monday blog.
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Fran (Southfield): I think for the Pistons to be great, Tayshaun Prince has to be more consistent. He’ll play great for a few games, then he seems to disappear. Is it so hard to play aggressively every game?
Langlois: The reality is that Prince is going to have to pick his spots with this team as it’s currently constructed. Chauncey Billups and Rip Hamilton are going to get more shots than he is and Rasheed Wallace, because of his inside-outside threat, should always get his opportunities, as well. That leaves Prince and Antonio McDyess among the starters to divide the shots that come to them. Some nights that will be a lot, others not so many. I wouldn’t put that on Prince. I also would caution against the argument that Prince is a better player with Hamilton out of the lineup. Yes, he scored 51 points in the two games Hamilton missed. That’s because he essentially took Hamilton’s role as the guy Billups kicked it too most frequently. He’s capable of doing that. He’s also capable of opportunistic scoring while continuing to play elite defense. As long as Prince doesn’t allow the situation to frustrate him, the Pistons are the better for it.
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Mark (Grand Rapids): Now that Billups is getting older, how many good years do you think he has in the NBA? He seems like the kind of guard who can be successful in the latter part of his career with his strength, shooting ability and leadership qualities. What’s your take?
Langlois: John Hollinger of ESPN.com, who bases much of his work on statistics, wrote an interesting piece about a year ago that backs up your contention, Mark. Hollinger looked at the history of point guards and, while noting that most start to decline on the other side of 30, the exceptions almost always were players who fit Billups’ profile – point guards with above-average size for their position who are good outside shooters. There doesn’t appear to be much cause for concern with Billups, at least not this soon.
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Jack (Conroe, Texas): So after all the talk about Rasheed getting 30 minutes a game, six games into it he’s still playing more like 35-40. Is it because they’re waiting for Amir to kick in?
Langlois: Through six games – at the time your e-mail arrived, Jack – Wallace was averaging 33 minutes a game. That’s maybe a minute or two more than the Pistons might have envisioned for him, but it’s a very reasonable number. More than the ankle injury that set Amir Johnson back and has limited his playing time to date, I think it’s the fact that Wallace reported to camp in excellent shape and is playing at such a high level that the Pistons are a markedly different team without him.
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Andrea (Battle Creek): Why didn’t Arron Afflalo play against Seattle? If we lose games now, it’s much better than losing them in the playoffs. Rip Hamilton had a good game, but I would rather see Arron get experience.
Langlois: The Pistons think very highly of Afflalo and believe in him even more than when they drafted him after seeing his work ethic and competitive edge for four-plus months. But he was a late first-round pick who came to a stacked team. When Rodney Stuckey returns, Afflalo will be the No. 5 guard when most backcourt rotations go about 3 ½ deep. If the Pistons stay healthy, Afflalo probably won’t get more than spot minutes this season. His best bet is to be used as a situational defender.
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Eric (Lansing): I am so tired of people saying trade Rip Hamilton. People don't understand that Rip is probably one of the top five shooting guards in the league. Are these true Pistons fans that are requesting to trade Rip? Excuse me for venting but that is something I had to express.
Langlois: I don’t think there’s anything close to a groundswell of support for trading Hamilton or anyone else. Hamilton’s name has been bandied about recently because (1) Kobe Bryant is openly on the market – supposedly, at least – and (2) the Pistons are one of the few teams with the ammunition to swing the trade and (3) if the Pistons were to take on Bryant, then Hamilton, by virtue of playing Kobe’s position, would logically be included in the trade. When a player like Bryant is on the market, everybody is going to wonder what he might do for their team and what it would cost to get him. But it would be wrong to believe the Pistons are shopping Rip Hamilton.
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Preston (Muskegon): I’m not throwing judgment out the window, but I think the Pistons should play Cheikh Samb ahead of Nazr Mohammed. I saw him in the preseason and it looks like he offers more than Nazr with his size and smooth jumper.
Langlois: He’s as green as the jackets at Augusta National, Preston, and not ready yet for the pace of a regular-season NBA game. But you’re right in seeing the potential there – the great size and the shooting touch and the shot-blocking instincts. The plan is to get Samb down to Fort Wayne fairly soon so he can compete without being overwhelmed by the strength and savvy of veteran NBA big men.
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Patti (Iowa): In your Monday blog, you stated that Kobe Bryant has the only no-trade clause in his contract. Is it something any NBA player and their agent can ask for or is it because Kobe thinks he’s special and deserves such a contract?
Langlois: Yes and yes. Anybody can ask, but you can bet that what the Lakers are now experiencing will make it even less likely in the future that their request will be granted. Making trades in the NBA is already difficult enough given salary-cap restrictions and the lengthy list of collective-bargaining loopholes and stipulations that get in the way. Adding no-trade clauses makes it a nightmare.
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Martie: I was wondering if Flip or Joe considered having Rip come off the bench. That would give Prince more touches and a bigger offensive role as a starter. That seems to be working for the Spurs with Ginobili and for Dallas with Jason Terry. What do you think?
Langlois: I won’t dismiss the idea out of hand – it’s been addressed here several times now – but if the motivation behind it is to see if it can milk more consistent offensive production out of Prince, then I don’t see it as a serious consideration. Prince and Hamilton are both going to play somewhere around 35 minutes a night, give or take, and that means they’ll necessarily be on the court together for the majority of them.
Lots of questions and comments about playing time and the sometimes heavy minutes the starters are playing in the face of the off-season mandate from management that opportunities would be there for young players off the bench. We’ll start Mailbag with a representative sampling of those questions …
Chad (Saginaw): I get so angry and frustrated when the starters play 40 minutes or more in a game. Why do you think Flip is so scared to play his bench in pressure situations? I’m talking about the game against Portland Tuesday night. What does Flip need to see before he’s confident with his bench?
Langlois: More consistent play, Chad. I don’t think much has been out of whack so far except that Amir Johnson’s training camp injury set him back – mostly because it didn’t give him the opportunity to gain Saunders’ trust – and Rodney Stuckey, whose spot in the rotation was already secure, is still out with his broken hand. If you factor Stuckey’s 20 or so minutes into the rotation and add 10 or 15 more for Johnson, the relatively heavy minutes for the starters in some games wouldn’t be an issue.
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Travis (Chicago): I just finished watching the Pistons-Portland game and I had a few thoughts. First, Rasheed seems to be playing inspired basketball. He was all over the court, especially in the first half. Second, does Flip Saunders have the ability to appropriately manage players’ minutes? I know our starters are great, but we’ve seen what happens when they’re mentally and physically tired at the end of the season. Third, Nazr has no fluidity to his game and was owned by Joel Przybilla.
Langlois: No arguments on Rasheed. It’s been noticeable with him since the day training camp opened. As to your second point, Saunders wouldn’t be the first coach who finds security in the known. He knows to a high degree of certainty what he’ll get from his starters. The bench is going to be a work in progress. Those are all really young players coming off the bench. Jarvis Hayes is the elder statesmen. It’s his fifth year, but he’s never really had a niche like he has here, so it’ll take some time even for him. There’s a delicate equation at work in the maturation of every young player – they have to make steady progress toward earning a coach’s trust, and the coach in turn must be tolerant of reasonable growing pains.
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Jason (Grand Rapids): I recently read an article in which Flip Saunders said Amir Johnson’s playing time is limited because he is competing with Jason Maxiell for minutes. Then I read your interview with Joe Dumars in which he says Amir is getting limited time because of his injury. Who should I believe? It really doesn’t make sense that they speak of them both as being the future of the team. Why can’t they be on the floor at the same time?
Langlois: Flip Saunders is leery of playing Maxiell and Johnson together until they prove themselves as defensive rebounders. They’re both tremendously active offensive rebounders. I don’t think Saunders and Dumars have said anything contradictory about Johnson’s status. Saunders did say it’s tough for Johnson right now, coming off his injury and competing to take away some – not all, but some – of the minutes Maxiell has earned. Dumars said it’s a long season and Johnson will not be the odd man out.
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Freddie (Las Colinas, Texas): Watching Rasheed against Portland was like reliving our loss to the Spurs in the Finals a few years ago when he left Robert Horry open for the 3-point shot. He leaves his man open over and over again.
Langlois: Yes and no, Freddie. The Horry basket came on an out-of-bounds play. Portland was doing damage to the Pistons with the high pick-and-roll play with Jarrett Jack, Sergio Rodriguez and Steve Blake all working off or LaMarcus Aldridge, a rapidly developing second-year player who shoots unusually well from the perimeter. I’m not privy to what the game plan called for in defending Aldridge as he set the pick and then drifted to the open spot on the perimeter, but Portland was hurting the Pistons on both ends – the guards were getting penetration when the big men didn’t cut them off, and when they did Wallace got caught in the lane helping out and leaving Aldridge open for 20-footers. Against most big men, you’d take your chances with that. But against a rare few – Wallace and Aldridge being two of them – you get burned.
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Lee (Oklahoma City): Did they ever convict Brian Williams’ murderer? I thought they were going to charge his brother with the crime, but I don’t remember if they ever did.
Langlois: One-time Piston Brian Williams, who changed his name to Bison Dele, disappeared along with his girlfriend and the captain of Williams’ catamaran in July 2002. It was widely suspected that his brother, who had changed his name to Miles Dabord, was responsible – his girlfriend said he told her there had been “a struggle” aboard the boat – but Dabord was found unconscious in Tijuana, Mexico in September of that year and died two weeks later. That’s pretty much where the story ends. Williams/Dele was one of the most, uh, unique people to ever play in the NBA. He didn’t march to his own drummer; he had his own drum section.
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Tobias (Voehringen, Germany): Do you think the Bulls would have beaten the Pistons if Stuckey had been in the lineup? Also, I’ve watched the “everywhere present” Celtics and, while I respect what they’ve done, I noticed that when they played the Nets they had four players who played more than 37 minutes and only eight who played. Do you think they will stumble over the season in that high gear?
Langlois: There’s no question Stuckey’s going to help the Pistons win games this year, but it’s impossible to say what his presence might have meant in that game. The Pistons’ biggest problems against Chicago were turnovers (17) and rebounding (allowing Chicago 15 offensive boards). Not sure how much Stuckey would have mattered in those two categories, but it’s fair to wonder how the game might have been different had he played. As for Boston’s minutes, read on …
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Gil (Charlotte, N.C.): How can everyone be so hung up on the Celtics when the “Big Three” are averaging 38.4 (Paul Pierce), 39.8 (Kevin Garnett) and 40.6 (Ray Allen) minutes per game? After Rivers was rumored to be fired after last season and the general mentality of head coaches, it’s only natural that he wants to play to win now to keep his job. How can anyone who follows the NBA think playing three 30-plus-year-old players that many minutes isn’t going to backfire at some point?
Langlois: It’s a calculated risk they’re taking in Boston, no question, Gil. I’m sure Danny Ainge has talked about it at length with Doc Rivers and I’m assuming Ainge has signed off on extended minutes for his stars. Pierce and Allen both missed significant time with leg injuries last year and Garnett has a lot of NBA miles on his legs. The career averages in minutes played for the three are 37.5 for Allen, who’s 32; 38.3 for Garnett, 31; and 37.8 for Pierce, 30. All three are playing more minutes than their career norms, and while they’re all still in the prime of the careers, pushing them to 40 minutes a night is risky. It’s also understandable. They have almost no depth in Boston.
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Jason (San Francisco): Would the Lakers accept Ben Gordon, Kirk Hinrich and Andres Nocioni for Kobe? Or is Kobe getting traded?
Langlois: I don’t know to both questions. If I were the Lakers, I wouldn’t take that package. I’d want Deng and one of Thomas and Noah as the centerpieces. I have a theory about the whole Kobe trade scenario, as I wrote about in my Monday blog.
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Fran (Southfield): I think for the Pistons to be great, Tayshaun Prince has to be more consistent. He’ll play great for a few games, then he seems to disappear. Is it so hard to play aggressively every game?
Langlois: The reality is that Prince is going to have to pick his spots with this team as it’s currently constructed. Chauncey Billups and Rip Hamilton are going to get more shots than he is and Rasheed Wallace, because of his inside-outside threat, should always get his opportunities, as well. That leaves Prince and Antonio McDyess among the starters to divide the shots that come to them. Some nights that will be a lot, others not so many. I wouldn’t put that on Prince. I also would caution against the argument that Prince is a better player with Hamilton out of the lineup. Yes, he scored 51 points in the two games Hamilton missed. That’s because he essentially took Hamilton’s role as the guy Billups kicked it too most frequently. He’s capable of doing that. He’s also capable of opportunistic scoring while continuing to play elite defense. As long as Prince doesn’t allow the situation to frustrate him, the Pistons are the better for it.
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Mark (Grand Rapids): Now that Billups is getting older, how many good years do you think he has in the NBA? He seems like the kind of guard who can be successful in the latter part of his career with his strength, shooting ability and leadership qualities. What’s your take?
Langlois: John Hollinger of ESPN.com, who bases much of his work on statistics, wrote an interesting piece about a year ago that backs up your contention, Mark. Hollinger looked at the history of point guards and, while noting that most start to decline on the other side of 30, the exceptions almost always were players who fit Billups’ profile – point guards with above-average size for their position who are good outside shooters. There doesn’t appear to be much cause for concern with Billups, at least not this soon.
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Jack (Conroe, Texas): So after all the talk about Rasheed getting 30 minutes a game, six games into it he’s still playing more like 35-40. Is it because they’re waiting for Amir to kick in?
Langlois: Through six games – at the time your e-mail arrived, Jack – Wallace was averaging 33 minutes a game. That’s maybe a minute or two more than the Pistons might have envisioned for him, but it’s a very reasonable number. More than the ankle injury that set Amir Johnson back and has limited his playing time to date, I think it’s the fact that Wallace reported to camp in excellent shape and is playing at such a high level that the Pistons are a markedly different team without him.
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Andrea (Battle Creek): Why didn’t Arron Afflalo play against Seattle? If we lose games now, it’s much better than losing them in the playoffs. Rip Hamilton had a good game, but I would rather see Arron get experience.
Langlois: The Pistons think very highly of Afflalo and believe in him even more than when they drafted him after seeing his work ethic and competitive edge for four-plus months. But he was a late first-round pick who came to a stacked team. When Rodney Stuckey returns, Afflalo will be the No. 5 guard when most backcourt rotations go about 3 ½ deep. If the Pistons stay healthy, Afflalo probably won’t get more than spot minutes this season. His best bet is to be used as a situational defender.
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Eric (Lansing): I am so tired of people saying trade Rip Hamilton. People don't understand that Rip is probably one of the top five shooting guards in the league. Are these true Pistons fans that are requesting to trade Rip? Excuse me for venting but that is something I had to express.
Langlois: I don’t think there’s anything close to a groundswell of support for trading Hamilton or anyone else. Hamilton’s name has been bandied about recently because (1) Kobe Bryant is openly on the market – supposedly, at least – and (2) the Pistons are one of the few teams with the ammunition to swing the trade and (3) if the Pistons were to take on Bryant, then Hamilton, by virtue of playing Kobe’s position, would logically be included in the trade. When a player like Bryant is on the market, everybody is going to wonder what he might do for their team and what it would cost to get him. But it would be wrong to believe the Pistons are shopping Rip Hamilton.
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Preston (Muskegon): I’m not throwing judgment out the window, but I think the Pistons should play Cheikh Samb ahead of Nazr Mohammed. I saw him in the preseason and it looks like he offers more than Nazr with his size and smooth jumper.
Langlois: He’s as green as the jackets at Augusta National, Preston, and not ready yet for the pace of a regular-season NBA game. But you’re right in seeing the potential there – the great size and the shooting touch and the shot-blocking instincts. The plan is to get Samb down to Fort Wayne fairly soon so he can compete without being overwhelmed by the strength and savvy of veteran NBA big men.
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Patti (Iowa): In your Monday blog, you stated that Kobe Bryant has the only no-trade clause in his contract. Is it something any NBA player and their agent can ask for or is it because Kobe thinks he’s special and deserves such a contract?
Langlois: Yes and yes. Anybody can ask, but you can bet that what the Lakers are now experiencing will make it even less likely in the future that their request will be granted. Making trades in the NBA is already difficult enough given salary-cap restrictions and the lengthy list of collective-bargaining loopholes and stipulations that get in the way. Adding no-trade clauses makes it a nightmare.
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Martie: I was wondering if Flip or Joe considered having Rip come off the bench. That would give Prince more touches and a bigger offensive role as a starter. That seems to be working for the Spurs with Ginobili and for Dallas with Jason Terry. What do you think?
Langlois: I won’t dismiss the idea out of hand – it’s been addressed here several times now – but if the motivation behind it is to see if it can milk more consistent offensive production out of Prince, then I don’t see it as a serious consideration. Prince and Hamilton are both going to play somewhere around 35 minutes a night, give or take, and that means they’ll necessarily be on the court together for the majority of them.